Asked for Dental NHS Scale and Polish.Told "Go to Hygienist at £25 extra"

boozercruiser

This taken out...amended and posted later.

welshdent

I'd check out your wording with this for completeness (not because I am being petty) "I understand that this should be done at regular intervals but know doubt you will correct me if I have my facts wrong.
Best regards"

but no doubt.

I genuinely feel sorry for the dentists they ship over. These guys have literally had a few hours of training then shadow dentists who also have had a few hours of training and expect them to get on with it. Dentistry is approached differently and the NHS adds even more layers of bizarreness to the mix. They are usually sending you to the hygienist because someone has told them to.

boozercruiser

welshdent wrote: »

I'd check out your wording with this for completeness (not because I am being petty) "I understand that this should be done at regular intervals but know doubt you will correct me if I have my facts wrong.
Best regards"

but no doubt.

I genuinely feel sorry for the dentists they ship over. These guys have literally had a few hours of training then shadow dentists who also have had a few hours of training and expect them to get on with it. Dentistry is approached differently and the NHS adds even more layers of bizarreness to the mix. They are usually sending you to the hygienist because someone has told them to.

Thanks for your advice Welshdent. I have taken that out. Please be as 'petty' as you like. I want to get that letter right.

Like you I feel sorry for the rather mish mash of Dentists I have been seen by over the past few years. Actually my argument is NOT with those particular dentists but with the Denticare organisation itself.
I make it pretty clear in my draft letter (and previous posts) that I think the Denticare Dentists are only carrying out instructions from the employer.
After all, they are a long way from home and are just trying to make a living from an employer who intructs them exactly how to carry out the practice in this country.

Anyone please point out anything you see in the wording which is perhaps not quite right. I can take constructive advice. It's only when it becomes personnal insult that I object to.

One thing is for sure. Short and Curlies springs to mind in respect of my argument as to how Denticare are conducting themselves in respect of patients with any type of Gum Disease.

I am confident that I have right on my side with this one. In fact I would not mind betting that my letter will have to be referred right to the top of the organisation for an answer as it will have to be answered correctly seeing as I have made them aware that I am prepared to take the issue both to the NHS authority and the media.

boozercruiser

That is something else Denticare do. "Can I book you for six months time". I resist that and go yearly...........(Article Daily Mail 13th April 2011) ....:-



Does your dentist make you visit too often? Chief dental officer sends reminder of 'appropriate recall intervals' for check-ups?

"I have literally, one hour ago, just returned from my first check up in two years !! I brush my teeth twice a day and try to curb my love of chocolate and sweet things. No work needed at all, and she even complemented me on the condition of my teeth for my age !!! I'm 55".
- Elizabeth, Worcestershire, 13/4/2011 13:23


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1375983/Does-dentist-make-visit-Chief-dental-officer-sends-reminder-appropriate-recall-intervals-check-ups.html#ixzz1JPkXY38h


By Sophie Borland



Last updated at 8:43 AM on 13th April 2011

• Comments (34)
• Add to My Stories

Dentists are advising patients to come back for check-ups far more often than they need to, the Government has warned.
Many are suggesting people return in six months’ time when they in fact need to be seen only every two years.
And concerns have been raised that some dentists are ‘exploiting’ the system and inflating their pay by encouraging healthy patients to come for check-ups more often than is recommended.

Health officials claimed adults only need to be seen by their dentist every two years

Figures show their average salaries have soared in recent years and one in ten now earns more than the Prime Minister, taking home at least £150,000 a year.
According to official guidelines from the health watchdog NICE, most adults need to go for a check-up only every two years.


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• How mouthwash can give you bad breath... AND stain your teeth

But 71 per cent of NHS patients are called back to their dentists within nine months, figures from the Department of Health show.
Of these, 13 per cent return within three months, according to statistics from last April to September.
It adds: 'In some instances there is good evidence that some patients are being recalled more frequently than necessary.'
The figures have prompted England’s chief dental officer Dr Barry Cockcroft to write to all dentists, reminding them of the NICE recommendations.
He wrote: ‘Ensuring patients are given an appropriate recall interval is a professional and ethical requirement and helps patients to maintain good oral health.’
But a spokesman for the British Dental Association said: ‘Many patients want to see a dentist more frequently.’
Officials say dentists who are not following these rules are wasting time better spent on ensuring treatment for new patients and helping those with poor dental health, especially young children.
NICE recommends that adults should be recalled for checks, depending on risk factors including alcohol, tobacco use and diet, every three months for those most at risk of dental problems and every two years for those with the lowest risk.

Checks on children should be between three months and a year.


Figures revealed that 71 per cent of dental patients are recalled for checks within nine months

Since April 1 NHS patients have to pay £17 (up from £16.50) for routine examinations, diagnosis and advice, a sum that can also cover initial X-rays, scaling and polishing.

Additional work such as fillings, extractions and root canal treatment takes that to £47 and crowns, dentures and bridges can push the bill per course of treatment up to £204.
The department says changes to the dentists' contract, which are about to be piloted in 62 dental practices, should make implementation of the NICE guidelines easier.

Dentists in England will be paid for the quality of the treatment they give rather than the quantity from this summer, the government has said.
The aim, says the Coalition, is to get dentists away from the 'drill and fill' culture where payments are tied to treatment targets.
The briefing states: 'The lengthening of recall intervals can allow NHS dentists and their teams to tackle health inequalities through having more time and resources to focus on providing access to new patients and prevention.'

However, the department was keen to avoid simply blaming dentists for the patterns.
Patients themselves are also partly responsible, as the report said some wanted six-monthly checks despite good dental health.



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1375983/Does-dentist-make-visit-Chief-dental-officer-sends-reminder-appropriate-recall-intervals-check-ups.html#ixzz1JPigtGIr

welshdent

ahh booze you need to REALLY take stories like that with a bucket load of salt. Its based on zero evidence and designed entirely to upset public opinion against dentists so they dont care when the government launch another attack on us with their contract changes. Its all political. If you actually did have gum disease then I would want to see you every 3 months not every 6. I have MANY patients that NEED to be seen that often. I also have many that 6 months intervals is enough to turn decay in to a small filling but 12 months would have made it an extraction. Sure 6 months doesnt suit everyone but then neither does 12 24 or 3. It has to be based on the individual. Barry cockroft is a puppet frankly and has IMO done more to damage the profession than anyone else ever has managed. But thats another story!!

Incidentally NICE guidelines are just that ... guidelines. If they were not then they should be called NICE rules.

brook2jack

If you read carefully BC it says check up intervals should be tailored to clinical need. As Welshdent says there is no way anyone with gum disease, or recurrent decay should be left that long.

As I recall you have had both extractions and fillings in recent courses of treatment. Maybe if you had taken the dentists advice and had a check up at 6 months rather than 12 months then the tooth might not have needed extraction? But then also if you follow dentists advice you would never need a filling or treatment for gum disease and then in which case a yearly check up would be reasonable.

Interestingly the norm for every other country in the world is at least 6 month check ups and more often for people with gum problems.

welshdent

Also ... by requirement every time we do ANY band we HAVE to do an examination so its taken as granted that for every band 1,2 or 3 we do we must do an exam therefore it is counted as being seen with X amount of time. There is no way to measure it any other way at the DOH do not record any other data. So bc a hypothetical situation, you come in for a regular examination and I say you are fine so go away for 12 months I dont need to see you again for a year. 3 months pass and you bite on a piece of pork scratching and ping half the side of your upper left first molar tooth. You obviously are concerned so make an appointment for me to look at it and fix. I suggest an inlay (band 3) following a thorough examination. You want me to do this so I provide it for you. When I close that form off and submit it, as far as you are concerned, you had a problem as I fixed it. As far as the DOH and barry are concerned, you attended with in 3 months of the last course of treatment. You had an uncessesary recall and are thus wasting government money and I am gaming the system. See where it can get a little foggy with the interpretation?

brook2jack

Ps BC the largest increase in cancers in thus country is seen in oral cancer. It's affecting more people and younger people. It can be dependant on lifestyle (drinking and smoking), and also occurs in people for no known reason.

Oral cancer is best treated early, at a point when often the patient has no or few symptoms eg when it's spotted at a dental check up. All the dentists here will have spotted oral cancer along with many other potentially fatal conditions ranging from leukaemia to diabetes to internal bleeding. Dental check ups are also tailored to take in risk factors for some of these diseases.

I would hate to think that someone ignores professional advice that may be potentially life saving or at least teeth saving in the basis they will save themselves the price of a check up.

boozercruiser

brook2jack wrote: »

If you read carefully BC it says check up intervals should be tailored to clinical need. As Welshdent says there is no way anyone with gum disease, or recurrent decay should be left that long.

As I recall you have had both extractions and fillings in recent courses of treatment. Maybe if you had taken the dentists advice and had a check up at 6 months rather than 12 months then the tooth might not have needed extraction? But then also if you follow dentists advice you would never need a filling or treatment for gum disease and then in which case a yearly check up would be reasonable.

Interestingly the norm for every other country in the world is at least 6 month check ups and more often for people with gum problems.

Brook2jack/Welshdent. I think everything you say in answer to my 'information' posting from the Daily Mail is obviously very relevent.
I accept all your words without disputing any at all.:)

Except to say......I don't have much faith in NICE guidlines anyway.

That Dentist I had for 25 years always just asked me back once a year. I got into my mid 60s with around 85% of my teeth...with just the odd filling. It's just the last 4 or 5 years I seem to be in a problem as my lovely Northampton Dentist never did mention anything about Gum Disease.

welshdent

One of our patients is still alive today because they came in with a swollen parotid gland that didnt look right. Immediate referral off and it turned out to be lymphoma. On the flip side others have come in having delayed and delayed ... eventual referral was too late