Asked for Dental NHS Scale and Polish.Told "Go to Hygienist at £25 extra"

George_Bray

Toothsmith wrote: »

Complain to the PCT George.

Toothsmith - do you think I'll get very far? I was told that if the word 'periodontal' comes into it then they are justified to charge at Band 2, even though the treatment (scale and polish) seemed to me to be as brief as you should get under Band 1. I'm not doubting that I may have mild periodontal issues but what I am saying is that I certainly haven't received any 'prolonged' treatment from the dentist. The gum problems, for the time being, were cleared up with antibiotics and mouth wash, both of which I paid for, on top.

elfen

Last time I went I had a Greek dentist, as was the male dentist in the practise, and they were both excellent. I don't think it's the foreign that's the problem, more the training they do or don't get. Lady dentist was brilliant, got the plaque from under the gumline and complimented me on my teeth-cleaning skills.

welshdent

George_Bray wrote: »

I've come across another aspect of 'scale and polish' which I consider to be a scam and a rip-off. When it was suggested I pay for a scale and polish with the hygienist at a cost of about £30, I said no, I'll make do with whatever scale and polish is included within the dentist's band 1 treatment arrangement. This should have been about £16.50, all inclusive, for band 1.

But they got the extra £30, almost, by another ruse, and charged me under band 2 (£45.60) for a 'periodontal' scale and polish, even though the dentist spent no more than a few minutes on one of the briefest, quickest scales/polishes I've ever had done. I asked for a print-out of the work done and it appears as 'prolonged periodonal' treatment. That's a lie. By any common sense definition of the word 'prolonged', this wasn't prolonged at all. It was brief. I'm now told, the NHS allows the dentist to charge for level 2, if you're deemed to have periodontal issues, even if it doesn't affect the time they spend.

That's a price hike from approx £16.50 (level 1) up to £45.60 for NOTHING.

Warning - if you have 'scale and polish' on the NHS, insist it's a normal scale and polish. Make sure it's not classified as 'periodontal' scale and polish, unless they are genuinely going to spend 30 mins or something.

George as to see a copy of your BPE scores because you could be complaining about a justifiable treatment regardless of how quick you felt the treatment to be. I regularly do band 2 periodontal treatments - this is when I offer the cheaper private hygiene visits (if indeed it would be). If you have a BPE score in any sextant of 3, 4 or * then the dentist can justify it. Now you SHOULD have had a treatment plan form and have had it explained to you ... but your perception of how long it took doesnt come in to it to be blunt and I dont mean to be offensive ... but to claim a band 2 according to the regulations all the dentist actually has to do is "irrigate a pocket" ... now we dentists know this is ineffective ... but it is still and band 2 and would take seconds to do.

welshdent

p.s. antibiotics and mouthwash doesnt clear up gum disease as such. The cleaning would. Prolonged may just be a way of referring to it simply for the practice to explain to a patient

George_Bray

welshdent wrote: »

your perception of how long it took doesnt come in to it to be blunt and I dont mean to be offensive ... but to claim a band 2 according to the regulations all the dentist actually has to do is "irrigate a pocket" ... now we dentists know this is ineffective ... but it is still and band 2 and would take seconds to do.

I'm not sure what the "irrigation" is, but is that the con trick then if it's so quick and easy to do? I agree I wouldn't have known or noticed. The entire cleaning was carried out within about 5 minutes. How can that justify a jump from band 1 to band 2 at almost three times the price?

coldstreamalways

I think what Welshdent is saying is that the time taken is not relative to the cost or banding of the treatment. If it was then root canal treatment wouldn't cost the same amount as a 5min filling.
Time isn't how the banding is worked out George. If you want the correct answer, you need to ask the dentist for your BPE score. If it's 1 or 2 then you were conned, if it's 3, 4 or * then you weren't.

To help prevent this problem in the future, learn how to brush and floss your teeth properly, I do and I have scores of 0 thus not needing any hygiene treatment at all.

Hope that helps.

Toothsmith

George_Bray wrote: »

I'm not sure what the "irrigation" is, but is that the con trick then if it's so quick and easy to do? I agree I wouldn't have known or noticed. The entire cleaning was carried out within about 5 minutes. How can that justify a jump from band 1 to band 2 at almost three times the price?

As the others have said, the key is the BPE score.

Some perio things can be qquick, but if it really was just 5 mins, then you'd probably be right to complain.

If they haven't done a BPE score, then they'd find it vry hard to defend.

Complaint to the PCT? It might work, especially if others have been complaining about similar issues. Depends how switched on the PCT is. But as most are about to be abolished, they're probably not that motivated at the moment.

Worth a try though.

jugglebug

George_Bray wrote: »

I'm not sure what the "irrigation" is, but is that the con trick then if it's so quick and easy to do? I agree I wouldn't have known or noticed. The entire cleaning was carried out within about 5 minutes. How can that justify a jump from band 1 to band 2 at almost three times the price?

How can it justify the price hike? If a dentist was writing the rules it wouldn't. However they were not written by a dentist, they were written by some desk jockey at the Department of Health.
They did not write any guidance whatsoever as to what constituted band 1 or band 2. Just said Band 2 is for the treatment of periodontal disease, that's it.
It is then left to the Dentist to make their own minds up what the cutoff is. Leaving you and many others like you feeling scammed.
Under the old system there were specific things than needed to be done, guidance given to dentists when the new contact came in specifically said that anything in the old documentation was no longer applicable.
Leaving us in the situation where one dentist may judge a treatment as band 1, another Band 2 and the civil servants who wrote the rubbish laughing up their sleeves as it is the patients and the dentists falling out while they pop out for a liquid lunch
edit.
Should have said of course that it is also written into the contract that we need to apply the rules within it universally as patients must be treated equally. How is that possible when there is sod all guidance

George_Bray

Toothsmith wrote: »

As the others have said, the key is the BPE score.

Thank you everyone for letting me know about BPE scores. I'll try and find out what was recorded. I remember the dentist reading out numbers so I guess they were probably BPE scores. I'm still disgusted that my symptoms should determine the charging basis, rather than the time taken, materials used, etc, which in my case were as minimal as could ever be.

welshdent

It is your symptoms and signs that determine a diagnosis though and recommended treatment is based on that diagnosis. I spend at least 90
Minutes carrying out a root filling for £30 but get paid the same should I wish to clean out a single deep pocket and irrigate it in 5 minutes. We sadly do not make the rules as already pointed out. If dentists actually devised the contract then it would be dramatically different