prepayment meters and emergency credit.

scorpiokisses

I had my NPower prepayment gas meter removed last month as we were finding it hard to scrape the money together so often for it's topping up. I thought all was fine and dandy until two days later they sent me a bill for £60.60 and when I queried it, they woman said it is the standing charge that hasn't been paid back whenever I have used my meter's emergency credit. Now that £60.60 came from September to December and I said that was high, she then directed me to the fact that my last bill, an information only one, said that I owed £47. So instead of telling me to pay it back, and making sure I was aware that this cost was there, they did nothing, and now I have to pay £60 that I currently don't have. Why couldn't they have taken it from the credit I was putting on every week? Is there anything I can do?

Scouse28

SwanJon wrote: »

As above, the meter will only recover 70% of anything you put in for gas charges (debt or emergency credit). 70% of £5 in £3.50, so this was the most it could take, adding the other £1.50 onto your credit (£1.08+£1.50=£2.58) - so you were in credit, but you were also still using the borrowed money.
So you had borrowed £3.92, and paid £3.50 of it back. You have since gone on to use the other £1.08, and when you next topped up, you paid back this and the missing 42p = £1.50.

The electricity meters work like an overdraft - you only borrow what you need.
The gas meter works like a loan - you borrow the full amount then pay it all back.

As I said above, if your suppliers charges your for using emergency credit it will need to be in the contract, and I'm fairly sure that no supplier actually does this. (Although plenty of people - customers & employees - seem to think it does.)

But it hasn't paid it all back, just 70%, the one thing npower did say was that if you use emergency credit then charges couldn't be taken.

SwanJon

If you have borrowed more than the 70% that is taken next time you top up, it will recover this the next time you top up, and so on.
I can't say for certain about standing charges on gas meters as have never worked with them programmed that way, but...
Gas meters with two tiers wil not charge you the higher tier 1 rate in emergency credit, and electricity meters will not charge you standing charge while in emergency credit, so assuming the gas meter deals with standing charges in the same way it recovers the difference between tier 1 and tier 2...
The meter remembers how much standing charge has been missed whilst in emergency credit, and looks to recover it when you next top up.
So, if you borrow £5 emergency, are paying back £5/week for a bill, and have a standing charge of 10p a day, and have used EC for 2 days you will need to pay back £10.20.
The meter will recover it - EC first, then for the bill, then for the emergency credit.
If you top up £5 - you pay back the 20p, and £3.30 of the bill.(=£3.50, 70%)
You still owe £1.70 for your bill and £5 EC.
You then top up another £5 - the meter recovers £1.70 for the bill, then £1.80 for EC (=£3.50, 70%).
You still owe £3.20 EC
Say you don't top up again for a week. The meter is now looking for the next payment of £5 for the bill, so when you top up £5, it takes £3.50 towards that.
You still owe £1.50 for the bill and £3.20 EC
And so on.
EC is always taken last, but if you continue to top up you will pay it back.
It is against a suppliers licence to encourage you to get into debt, so I would be very suprised if they deliberately programmed the meter another way.
It is more likely that somewhere along the line a wrong read was used (opening/closing), payments were lost (either within your supplier or sent to another), the tariff was incorrectly set on the meter (much rarer with gas meters than electricity but still possible), or a message was sent to the meter giving you credit and they didn't match this on their system.

Scouse28

SwanJon wrote: »

If you have borrowed more than the 70% that is taken next time you top up, it will recover this the next time you top up, and so on.
I can't say for certain about standing charges on gas meters as have never worked with them programmed that way, but...
Gas meters with two tiers wil not charge you the higher tier 1 rate in emergency credit, and electricity meters will not charge you standing charge while in emergency credit, so assuming the gas meter deals with standing charges in the same way it recovers the difference between tier 1 and tier 2...
The meter remembers how much standing charge has been missed whilst in emergency credit, and looks to recover it when you next top up.
So, if you borrow £5 emergency, are paying back £5/week for a bill, and have a standing charge of 10p a day, and have used EC for 2 days you will need to pay back £10.20.
The meter will recover it - EC first, then for the bill, then for the emergency credit.
If you top up £5 - you pay back the 20p, and £3.30 of the bill.(=£3.50, 70%)
You still owe £1.70 for your bill and £5 EC.
You then top up another £5 - the meter recovers £1.70 for the bill, then £1.80 for EC (=£3.50, 70%).
You still owe £3.20 EC
Say you don't top up again for a week. The meter is now looking for the next payment of £5 for the bill, so when you top up £5, it takes £3.50 towards that.
You still owe £1.50 for the bill and £3.20 EC
And so on.
EC is always taken last, but if you continue to top up you will pay it back.
It is against a suppliers licence to encourage you to get into debt, so I would be very suprised if they deliberately programmed the meter another way.
It is more likely that somewhere along the line a wrong read was used (opening/closing), payments were lost (either within your supplier or sent to another), the tariff was incorrectly set on the meter (much rarer with gas meters than electricity but still possible), or a message was sent to the meter giving you credit and they didn't match this on their system.

We did receive a credit of £15 for a problem we had with the said meter in the past.

barrington86

scorpiokisses wrote: »

I had my NPower prepayment gas meter removed last month as we were finding it hard to scrape the money together so often for it's topping up. I thought all was fine and dandy until two days later they sent me a bill for £60.60 and when I queried it, they woman said it is the standing charge that hasn't been paid back whenever I have used my meter's emergency credit. Now that £60.60 came from September to December and I said that was high, she then directed me to the fact that my last bill, an information only one, said that I owed £47. So instead of telling me to pay it back, and making sure I was aware that this cost was there, they did nothing, and now I have to pay £60 that I currently don't have. Why couldn't they have taken it from the credit I was putting on every week? Is there anything I can do?

The information you were given at the time, when advisor told you that preve statement showed £47 owed, was correct. The amount owed would have been taken on from your credit as you topped up your meter so no need to ask for payment (see the 70/30% split explanation). The fact of the matter is for a debt like that do build up, it would suggest that you were not paying enough to cover your gas usage and the standing charges. Now you are on a credit meter it might not be cheaper for you, please make sure that you received written confirmation of prices and pricing structure and make sure that you understand how you will be charged. On a prepayment meter you were charged about 3p per KWH. Slightley more expensive on billing meters. Only benifit you would see normaly is if paying by a direct debit as you would get a £20 yearly discount.
Instead of paying as you go you will see a bill every 3 month which you will be expected to pay within 14days. The £60 you owe from your prepay meter can be added to your first bill.