Can my poor sister do anything???

Purple_Sparkles

Contact the police, it's at least fraud. A friend of mine bought something off Ebay and never received it, they emailed the seller and never got a reply or anything. Then they contacted the police who actually went round to the sellers house and told the seller that if they couldn't prove the item was sent or collected then they would be arrested. The seller quickly refunded my friend in full and it was only for £50!

I hope you get it sorted regardless of the amount, theft is theft.

pandagirl03

My sister has been to the police and they wont do anything. Maybe the lady whos account has been used by scammers they will take more notice. Ebay and paypal dont seem interested in helping people its a joke.

soolin

peter_m wrote: »

It appears that I'm the victim of a similar scam/con/theft/fraud!!
I noticed money missing from my bank account (£680). Upon investigation I found that a Paypal transaction for this amount had taken place without my knowledge. This was linked to an ebay transaction where I had "won" an auction and "bought" a computer. I had absolutely no knowledge of this whatsoever. I contacted the seller, who told me that the computer was collected by 2 men, from his father. I'm certainly not 2 men, and I don't look Nigerian, as apparently these guys did.
I've reported this to ebay and to Paypal and limited investigation has taken place as far as I can see. Paypal have refunded me £150, which they have got from the seller, but I'm still £530 down. Ebay don't appear to want to know.
If you are on this forum, I guess you know how ebay and paypal work...If you win an item, you get an email saying so and asking you to pay. You then need to log into Paypal to add funds to your account, which is then used to pay for the item. Paypal then send you a receipt, at least that's how it has worked for me in the past.
I have had no emails whatsoever and didn't log into Paypal to authorise payment.

I guess I will have to put this down to having been done over, although I'm going to continue to try to get my money back, but I'd like as many people as possible to know that ebay and Paypal may not be as safe and secure as they both claim.

Where did the funds from 'your' paypal payment come from, if from a credit card you can start a claim for fraudulent use of a card. if from anywhere else then go back to the police and be persistent as you will need their help to persue this through your bank.

Basically what has happened is that your security has been breached, you either fell for a phish or your level of protection on the PC is low enough to have allowed a key logger. I suspect the latter as it looks like the scammers got your paypal ebay and email passwords and I can't believe anyone would fall for three seperate scams. If this was recent then you may still have a security breach and you really need to sort it out, the techie board will be able to offer some good places to start and some recommendations about internet security.

Bromley86

One other point. Another board user posted about the funding source being a Visa debit card and that being covered by the same chargeback ability as a Visa credit card.

So if that's how PP took their money, talk to the bank about it. Note that the other guy's bank didn't believe him until he insited that they contact head office.

Ray13_2

I have been in contact with my Bank regards to company saving details of my debit card and after some months find that they have written into terms of business that if any dispute arises they can use these details to obtain money they believe to be due them by use of the debit card details held. My bank advise that this is correct and cannot be stopped even by issue of a replacement debit card since "visa" would link old and new cards. They say AOL and SKY do this regularly. So it doesn't seem to help if you've used a debit card.

Brooker_Dave

peter_m wrote: »

It appears that I'm the victim of a similar scam/con/theft/fraud!!
I noticed money missing from my bank account (£680). Upon investigation I found that a Paypal transaction for this amount had taken place without my knowledge. This was linked to an ebay transaction where I had "won" an auction and "bought" a computer. I had absolutely no knowledge of this whatsoever. I contacted the seller, who told me that the computer was collected by 2 men, from his father. I'm certainly not 2 men, and I don't look Nigerian, as apparently these guys did.
I've reported this to ebay and to Paypal and limited investigation has taken place as far as I can see. Paypal have refunded me £150, which they have got from the seller, but I'm still £530 down. Ebay don't appear to want to know.

Send them a letter before action, and then if they ignore that sue them.

The police may take an interest as the amount is over £500, but sadly the UK police don't really care too much about internet fraud...

Brooker_Dave

frivolous_fay wrote: »

I would be tempted to email [EMAIL="richard.uk@ebay.com"]richard.uk@ebay.com[/EMAIL] and ask the head of ebay UK Trust & Safety his advice on the situation.

Like they care.

It's due to them forcing people to take paypal on collection only items that this has become a problem.

digerati

pandagirl03 wrote: »

My sister has been to the police and they wont do anything. Maybe the lady whos account has been used by scammers they will take more notice. Ebay and paypal dont seem interested in helping people its a joke.

Your sister got fobbed off by her local Police station desk clerk as that's what they're trained to do. Why? - it reduces the crime stats if crimes are not reported.

Action to take

Tell your sister to phone her local Police station and ask to speak to someone in the CID. Almost every Police Station now has at least one specialist CID Officer who is knowledgeable about online fraud and e-crime (including eBay and PayPal).

She needs to lay a formal complaint against the buyer for committing a criminal offense under Section 2 of the Fraud Act 2006, namely Fraud by false representation since her buyer obtained the goods without payment. Don't let anyone attempt to fob your sister off with the old "it's a civil matter" excuse - it isn't. (They are only trying to avoid the paperwork and keep their crime stats down.) Repeat after me - "fraud is a criminal offense"!

Your sister should visit her local Police station fully armed with printed copies of: eBay auction(s), payment details, all email between you and the fraudster, PayPal, eBay or their other victims, and finally notes of any telephone conversations you have had with fraudster, PayPal or eBay. Make sure all email print-outs show full headers (ask someone to show you how to do this as it varies between email packages) since it provides legally-admissible proof that the emails are genuine. Do keep the electronic originals and make back-up too, as justice can be slow in coming.

The important thing is to make sure she obtains a crime number as this can be used to pry open PayPal's defenses and is key to getting a full refund.

If she gets a clued-up CID person they may take the easy route and simply phone the buyer, mention a complaint has been made against them, but offer them the chance to make restitiution before the matter goes any further. Make sure they don't refund via PayPal as they can always reverse it later. Rather insist on a bank transfer, postal money order or bank cheque as these are non-reversible.

If her buyer doesn't or can't cooperate, the Police can obtain all the buyer's details from PayPal and pass them on to her. Armed with these details and the crime number - she can lodge a complaint with the Financial Ombudsman Service against PayPal with all the supporting facts. In most cases, when presented with evidence that goes against their conduct, PayPal will attempt to settle up in full via an ex gratia payment.

Also, if this buyer conned multiple eBay sellers, advise your sister to contact the other affected sellers and ask them to contact their local Police station and make a Fraud Act 2006: Section 2 complaint against the buyer. When the Police in the buyer's locale receive numerous complaints against that person, they will take it much more seriously than a single isolated complaint. Police know that multiple complaints over a short period are good indicators that a scammer or conman is at work.

Hope this helps and Good Luck!

Jockey666

digerati wrote: »

Repeat after me - "fraud is a criminal offense"!


The important thing is to make sure she obtains a crime number as this can be used to pry open PayPal's defenses and is key to getting a full refund.

If she gets a clued-up CID person they may take the easy route and simply phone the buyer, mention a complaint has been made against them, but offer them the chance to make restitiution before the matter goes any further. ex gratia payment.

Since when are the police a debt collection agency?

If you're giving the OP sound advice and insisting a crime is recorded, then in that case it must be investigated. They cannot simply ring up the seller and demand they refund. If the police are to become involved compensation should be awarded by the court following a sucessful prosecution.

digerati

Jockey666 wrote: »

If you're giving the OP sound advice and insisting a crime is recorded, then in that case it must be investigated. They cannot simply ring up the seller and demand they refund. If the police are to become involved compensation should be awarded by the court following a sucessful prosecution.

Jockey666,

OP's sister is the seller whom has been allegedly defrauded by buyer via PayPal. The Police often get involved early on as a simple phone call to resolve the case means less paperwork than when a criminal complaint is lodged. It's a win-win situation for the Police and defrauded party. However it usually only works with non-professional fraudsters.