new centraal heating

lady123_2

can anyone offer me some advice on central heating systems, i need to instal central heating in a house im buying, theres currently none there, just an old boiler for heating water, i can get keys to house on exchange as its empty so will be easier to fit the pipework with no furniture there, i would prefer a Worcester boiler, its a 3bed mid terrace house, with 1 bathroom through lounge, i also want to instal a shower straight to mains connections in bathroom, could anyone give me a rough cost of all this, am i better to buy the boiler seperate and pay for installation, or all together, can i get a grant towards the work from local authority, im not on benefits and not a pensioner, do people have links to places to buy boilers or heating packs, any advice would be welcome

moneysavingplumber

Most people are likely to sugeest you have a combi boiler, and if overall space is a priority it's likely to be the best option for you. The boiler will be larger than a conventional boiler but you won't need any additional space for a hot water cylinder or storage tanks in the roof. The hot water will be at mains pressure but the flow rate will be reduced to anything from 9 litres a minute (for the avarage 24 KW combi) to 18 litres a minute (the larger combis that incorporate a 'heat-store'). If you are more likely to use a shower than a bath then this may not bother you, but it tends to limit tap usage to one at a time to prevent interference with the hot flow rate and temperature.

Worcester Bosch are good, but also look into Vaillant Ecotec series and Alpha CD series.

https://www.ptsplumbing.co.uk

Find a local branch and ask for details of their 'Magic Boiler Scheme' a government backed initiative to help promote 'A' rated condensing boilers, I've not seen any of the above boilers at better prices than on this or similar schemes.

I would also ask around locally and get recommendations of decent plumbers in the area and get a few quotes. Based on what you have said I would guess at a supply and fit cost of around £3K, but this could vary either way and savings are possible if you buy the kit yourself but this could give you other headaches and alot of good guys may be reluctant to take the work on if they think there may be hassle if the gear hasn't arrived on time, or may be inferior to their usual preferred materials etc.

I would get the recommendations and get a few supply and fit prices to start with and see how they are first.

AuntyJean

We truly regret changing from a back boiler to a combi.

How the powers that be can ban back boilers (Feb 95 I think) in favour of combi's I do not know. You use twice or three times as much water - you have to let the tap run for at least 4 minutes before it becomes hot. Hot! Thats a joke. Even on maximum temperature it is only just above hand hot!

I had a higher spec installed than was necessary, a Worcester Bosch 28CDi. It is supposed to run up to 17 radiators. We have 5. If I put the washing machine on it will be cold water going in (from both taps) which then takes up electricity to heat it up to 40 degrees. Yes, I have had the boiler checked. The only problem the guy could find was a valve which was not working properly. Made a slight difference but not a lot.

As for lower gas bills, I have yet to see a significant drop. Maybe because prices have risen. My monthly DD has in fact gone up from £45 to £49.

The only place suitable for the combi was in the airing cupboard in the master bedroom. This mean losing half the shelving and when it switches on at 5am it wakes me up.

If your boiler is still working I would consider having it checked out and just go for replacement radiators.

As for cost. I shopped around and the best quote (without replacement rads) was £2,000! The combi could have been bought on the internet (discountheatingsupplies I think) but the Corgi guy who fitted it said he could get it cheaper.

One other point. I now have an attractive grey pipe about 10 inches round, sticking out of the side of the airing cupboard leading to the outside wall. I will have to pay to get someone to box it in someday but for now it is just an ugly eyesore (had to take shelves down again to accommodate this).

moneysavingplumber

AuntyJean wrote:

We truly regret changing from a back boiler to a combi.

How the powers that be can ban back boilers (Feb 95 I think) in favour of combi's I do not know. You use twice or three times as much water - you have to let the tap run for at least 4 minutes before it becomes hot. Hot! Thats a joke. Even on maximum temperature it is only just above hand hot!

I had a higher spec installed than was necessary, a Worcester Bosch 28CDi. It is supposed to run up to 17 radiators. We have 5. If I put the washing machine on it will be cold water going in (from both taps) which then takes up electricity to heat it up to 40 degrees. Yes, I have had the boiler checked. The only problem the guy could find was a valve which was not working properly. Made a slight difference but not a lot.

As for lower gas bills, I have yet to see a significant drop. Maybe because prices have risen. My monthly DD has in fact gone up from £45 to £49.

The only place suitable for the combi was in the airing cupboard in the master bedroom. This mean losing half the shelving and when it switches on at 5am it wakes me up.

If your boiler is still working I would consider having it checked out and just go for replacement radiators.

As for cost. I shopped around and the best quote (without replacement rads) was £2,000! The combi could have been bought on the internet (discountheatingsupplies I think) but the Corgi guy who fitted it said he could get it cheaper.

One other point. I now have an attractive grey pipe about 10 inches round, sticking out of the side of the airing cupboard leading to the outside wall. I will have to pay to get someone to box it in someday but for now it is just an ugly eyesore (had to take shelves down again to accommodate this).

The ban on back boilers was as much from a point of safety, as they are almost always situated in a lounge area and draw combustiuon air from the room in which they are situated. The industry has wanted to ban all conventionally flued boilers for a long time now, and the Part L requirements on efficiency have more or less done this by the back door. If they are not properly maintained and air vents are inadvertently covered they can become very dangerous, especially in the middle of winter when heating is up and windows closed.

The Worcester 28CDi is only Sedbuk 'D' rated as far as I know so if you were advised significant gas savings this would have been wrong, although some back boilers don't even achieve a rating they are so poor on efficiency.

It does sound as though you were poorly advised and I agree that a combi isn't for everybody. You should have been consulted about the visible flue/air duct beforehand, and it is always a poor choice to put a boiler anywhere near a bedroom where the noise can cause a disturbance.

I think the OP's 'boiler' is either a multipoint water heater or a cylinder so they don't have the option to add heating to it.

lady123_2

thanks ever so much for your advice guys, i'm gonna stick with worcster boilers as i know there ok, i'm trying to get a discount boiler from somewhere called Energy saving trust, has anyone ever gone through them, and could someone recommend a type of boiler/model to choose, for 6 rads 1 bathroom, i can get the boiler fitted in our new small kitchen as its near the out side wall leading to back garden, would appriciate a decent model number if anyone can help, thanks


lady123

brummybloke

i had mine done about 3 years ago, it cost £2500 for all old storage heaters taken out, central heating put in. it was all done in 1 day as i asked the company of it could be done in 1 day ( they had 3 teams working on it). they now do this as an offer as it saved them money by having a complete fit in 1 day rather than 1 team spending 4 days doing it. this is with combi boiler and 7 radiators.
the hot water thing mentioned? well mine was like that until i played with the thermostat, it has settings for water and radiators, both were set at radiator temp at first so the water only went to 21c. the water temp is now set higher and the water comes out all lovely and hot.


oh and the old water tank taken out also and they installed my chrome tower heater in the bathroom.

moneysavingplumber

lady123 wrote:

thanks ever so much for your advice guys, i'm gonna stick with worcster boilers as i know there ok, i'm trying to get a discount boiler from somewhere called Energy saving trust, has anyone ever gone through them, and could someone recommend a type of boiler/model to choose, for 6 rads 1 bathroom, i can get the boiler fitted in our new small kitchen as its near the out side wall leading to back garden, would appriciate a decent model number if anyone can help, thanks


lady123

The Greenstar Junior 24i or 28i

At https://www.ptsplumbing.co.uk the current price on the Magic Boiler Scheme is £556.50 + VAT for the 24KW and £623.00 + VAT for the 28KW. The flue is an additional £46.00 + VAT.

https://www.worcester-bosch.co.uk

AuntyJean

brummybloke wrote:

the hot water thing mentioned? well mine was like that until i played with the thermostat, it has settings for water and radiators, both were set at radiator temp at first so the water only went to 21c. the water temp is now set higher and the water comes out all lovely and hot.

Is it possible to change the temperatures in a Worcester 28CDi? I have dials on the front which range from | to |||| then MAX, are there internal thermostats too?

lady123_2

moneysavingplumber wrote:

The Greenstar Junior 24i or 28i

At https://www.ptsplumbing.co.uk the current price on the Magic Boiler Scheme is £556.50 + VAT for the 24KW and £623.00 + VAT for the 28KW. The flue is an additional £46.00 + VAT.

https://www.worcester-bosch.co.uk

thx moneysavingplumber and other posters for your advice, can you tell me if im better going wth the greenstar range and would i better better going with the w/b 30si, im not sure what the difference is, is it that you get more water quicker, also are these boilers ok with a one of them showers that are plumed straight to mains and have all the fixing hidden behind the tiles/wall so as i just turn it on from the controls, i dont want an electric shower, hope you guys understand me.thx again for your help guy's

moneysavingplumber

lady123 wrote:

thx moneysavingplumber and other posters for your advice, can you tell me if im better going wth the greenstar range and would i better better going with the w/b 30si, im not sure what the difference is, is it that you get more water quicker, also are these boilers ok with a one of them showers that are plumed straight to mains and have all the fixing hidden behind the tiles/wall so as i just turn it on from the controls, i dont want an electric shower, hope you guys understand me.thx again for your help guy's

If you are in England or Wales then you will have to go with the Greenstar condensing range, assuming you are on gas and not oil.

The Greenstar 30 Si has a flow rate of 12.3 litres/minute, and is also available on the aforementioned scheme at £670.50 + VAT and the flue would be the same as above at £46.00 + VAT.

Make sure that you get your requirements and suitabilities verified before purchasing anything.

cheggers

Who ever fits your boiler just make sure you ask to see there Corgi card, you dont want some cowboy messing with your gas.