advice needed

pomp

really in need of a bit of advice, we've found a house we really liked, made an offer which has been accepted, have a mortgage arranged everything ready to go and was just waiting on draft contracts from our solicitor along with a final report.

This is when we found out that there are no deeds for the house, which have become lost at some time, the title is possessory only. The sellers have been asked to pay for indemnity insurance.

there is no paperwork stating whether the double glazing (which was installed 2005-2006) meets building regulations.

There is no documentation stating whether planning permission was sought for the rear "garden room" (small conservatory) and whether it meets building regulations or if an RSJ was put in place.

nor is there an installation certificate for a boiler which was installed in 2002.

I'm really confused and worried now and seriously considering pulling out if i dont see these certificates or something in black and white protecting us, i dont want to buy a house to find the windows were put in by "someone down the pub" for example, perhaps im being a bit over dramatic.

Am i right to be worried?

poppysarah

Ask if they've had the boiler serviced ever. If not then who knows how long it'll last.

Double glazing has improved over the years and is unlikely to be regs but don't worry about that tooo much.

Lost deeds shouldn't matter.

The building regs bit might matter as will the back of the house falling down. You need structural eng type advice and prob scuffing back plaster to reveal RSJ. Costs money.

I'd be tempted to tell them to stuff it all. Or ask for 20k off.

tbs624

poppysarah wrote: »

.....Double glazing has improved over the years and is unlikely to be regs but don't worry about that tooo much.

Erm - since April 2002 there has been a specific set of standards for replacement doors & windows: when windows or doors (of 50% or more glass AFIAA ) are replaced in existing properties, they have to comply with Approved Documents Parts L (conservation of fuel & power) and N (impact safety) and the new installations must not worsen the property’s compliance with other parts of the Building Regs, specifically Part A (structure), B (fire escape) F (ventilation), J (combustion appliances and fuel storage systems) and M (access for the disabled).

A property owner should therefore have either Building Regs approval or FENSA certification (FENSA = Fenestration Self-Assessment Scheme, set up by the Glass and Glazing Federation (GGF) et al in response to the current Building Regs for E&W) http://www.fensa.co.uk
- where they don't have then an indemnity policy will usually be suggested. That policy only covers you in the event of the Building Control Officer pursuing you for non-compliance,not for any defective parts or workmanship, or weakening of the property's structure

Is the possessory title ( rather than absolute title) all that is registered at the LR and if so, for how many years has that been the case? I think maybe Richard Webster is the best bet on here for answering the "missing deeds" / possessory title bit.

Agree with poppysarah that a service record by someone who is CORGI registered would help you with the boiler issue.

poppysarah wrote: »

I'd be tempted to tell them to stuff it all. Or ask for 20k off.

Unless you are getting this at a fantastically low price or it has something you haven't mentioned that makes it your potential dream house then I think I'd be looking elsewhere.

Have you discussed your concerns with your solicitor? Make him work for his money - this is the type of stuff you are paying him/her to advise you on.

Doozergirl

pomp wrote: »

really in need of a bit of advice, we've found a house we really liked, made an offer which has been accepted, have a mortgage arranged everything ready to go and was just waiting on draft contracts from our solicitor along with a final report.

This is when we found out that there are no deeds for the house, which have become lost at some time, the title is possessory only. The sellers have been asked to pay for indemnity insurance.

there is no paperwork stating whether the double glazing (which was installed 2005-2006) meets building regulations.

There is no documentation stating whether planning permission was sought for the rear "garden room" (small conservatory) and whether it meets building regulations or if an RSJ was put in place.

nor is there an installation certificate for a boiler which was installed in 2002.

I'm really confused and worried now and seriously considering pulling out if i dont see these certificates or something in black and white protecting us, i dont want to buy a house to find the windows were put in by "someone down the pub" for example, perhaps im being a bit over dramatic.

Am i right to be worried?

You're probably being a bit dramatic about some things.

The fact is that many, many houses themselves weren't built with planning permission and building regulations anywhere near like we know them so being overtly picky about whether extensions etc do, often defies common sense.

Have the boiler services or obtain a gas safety certificate for everything in the house. I can provide you with the certs for my boiler installation but I don't have any proof that the boiler is safe at this moment in time. That is more of a concern to you.

A conservatory, in most cases, does not need planning permission or building regs! The windows, if installed post April 2002 should comply with building regulations but really, if a surveyor isn't pointing out any issues then the certificate is irrelevant now. Building Control cannot enforce anything after 12 months unless they obtained a court order - if the windows and conservatory apper sound, believe me, they aren't going to come and hammer down your door!

As for possessory title, talk to your solicitor about it. If it's been within someone's possession for a long time then I'm sure an indemnity policy would suffice. One assumes that if your solicitor is suggesting one rather than suggesting you pull out, they don't see it as too much of a problem.

planning_officer

In terms of the conservatory issue - it is likely to be classed as permitted development (PD), thereby not requiring an application for planning permission. That's dependent on whether the property has undergone any other extensions and whether the conservatory is nearer to any road bordering the curtilage of the property than the house itself. You say it's small, so is probably likely to be PD.

In any event, even if it did require planning permission, it becomes lawful after 4 years (i.e. no enforcement action can be pursued), so if it looks like it's been there for that length of time, I wouldn't worry!

pomp

unfortunatley the seller / sellers solicitor could not provide any paperwork for any of the work they have had done, apart from the planning permission for the extension.

Our surveyor expressed concerns about the build quality of the conservatory and our solicitor, who has also discovered some further issues, was very concerned to the point of advising us not to sign anything!

So we made the decision to pull out i know this will have a knock on effect and i do feel for the sellers, i know how i would feel had it been me in their position, but for us to make possibly the biggest purchase of our lives we need to be certain and not have things clouded in concerns and worry.

SquatNow

Walk away, plenty more fish in the sea etc etc.