HMO - Help!

Bunnie

Hiya all,

Im renting a 2 bed flat the now and im living in the 1st bedroom and subletting the 2nd.

My boyfriend was thinking of moving in next year into the 1st bedroom with me but we would still need to sublet the other room to be able to afford rent.
Grrr BF not a student so we will have to pay council tax.

Would a HMO license be required?

I know that if theres more than 3 unrelated people living there it is but surely myself and BF are a couple and therefore realated and count as a household. Yes? Is it then required if 2 or more households are sharing?

Eeek am just a bit confused!

Am dealing with Glasgow City council by the way!

Well any help or advice would be much appreciated!

clutton_2

it is the responsibiolity of the LL to buy the license if it is required - its not clear to me from your post if you are the owner-occupier or the tenant ....

tbs624

As you say that you are renting the flat you must be a tenant
Do you have the LL's permission to sub-let ? Is your LL Glasgow CC or you just mean that you live in Glasgow and therefore any licensing would come under Glasgow CC?

See the Civic Government (Scotland) Act 1982 (Licensing of Houses in Multiple Occupation) Order 2000 (as amended in 2002 and 2003)

A house is an HMO if it is the only or principal residence of three or more qualifying persons from three or more families.

Two people are members of the same family if:

• they are married, or live together as if they were married (including same-sex couples)

• one is the other's parent, grandparent, child, grandchild, brother, sister, uncle, aunt, nephew or niece (includes relationships by marriage or by half-blood, & children who are fostered, adopted or otherwise brought up as a member of the family)

Therefore your proposed situation must mean two "families", so not an HMO but you would still need to clear it all with your LL

Bunnie

Guess i should have explained more, doh!

Landlord owns the proptry and is a really good friend of my dads so hes renting the entire flat to me.Yippee!

LL sugested i sublet the room as he wanted me to pick a friend etc to live in the flat with me. He sorta knows i cant afford the rent without another body in the flat! He sorta takes a back seat unless something is wrong with the flat which i really like.

All the subletting details are sorted and contracts in order etc.

Just wanted to know what would happen if the BF was to move in and 3 people were living in the flat but counts as 2 families. Wasnt sure if it was HMO or not?

I know he wouldnt consider to make the flat HMO cause of the cost etc which i understand.

I know HMO differes in England/Wales and Scotland and within local council and is why i said i was in Glasgow!

Looked on glasgow city council website and didnt undertand it atall!

Well thanks for any help!

bookduck

I'm sure he knows your father very well and trusts your good judgment to. I am sure he will not mind you having a friend there - a friend. However if something goes wrong, the line probably will read

"..was a really good friend of my dads..."

He sorta takes a back seat unless something is wrong with the flat which i really like.

The other option is that he know you can't afford it and wants you to find someone who you are compatible with.

Speak to him, not to us and find out what is up. We can only guess. Also find out what deposit and other bits he wants. Understand some bits you should not directly ask like "can I advertise and invite a stranger to live here", as then he would be consenting to a HMO, and you know he does not want this

End of the day you will probably be responsible for all your tenants actions including rent collection..If the council knock on your door, then assume he will know nothing and say you are subletting.

good luck!

poppysarah

If your name is the sole name on the lease then you will be responsible for EVERYTHING that goes wrong.

Someone only has to organise a party to completely trash your financial reputation.

The landlord "allowing" you to sublet is basically him avoiding the correct precautions which will save your life when some eejit ends up leaving a pan on and burning the house down.

Do it properly or not at all. Your life is way too important to squander.

Bunnie

I do have contracts in place with the LL saying i can sublet the room etc.

If i sublet it then there will only be 2 people living in the flat (me and the person im subletting to) and it will not be HMO.

Im fully aware of the legal position im in by subletting and am willing to take it on.

I think its a bit rash to suggest im squandering my life by allowing another person in the flat. Anyone, including myself, is capable of starting a fire for example. What precautions would he have to take if the flat wasnt HMO?
There already is a fire extinguisher and fire alarm in the flat. Is there anything else?

I just wanted to know that if a 3rd person moves in and me and him are classed as a 'family' would a HMO be require?

My understanding is that 3 or more unrealated people in one flat requires a HMO. But what happends if 2 are related and the 3rd is not, therefore 2 'families' living in the flat?

And also i dont understand how he would be consenting to a HMO if he agrees to another person (2 in total) living in the flat?

Thanks

tbs624

Bunnie wrote: »

.....I just wanted to know that if a 3rd person moves in and me and him are classed as a 'family' would a HMO be require?

My understanding is that 3 or more unrealated people in one flat requires a HMO. But what happends if 2 are related and the 3rd is not, therefore 2 'families' living in the flat?....

Bunnie -look back at my post above and you'll see this:

tbs624 wrote: »

.....A house is an HMO if it is the only or principal residence of three or more qualifying persons from three or more families.

Two people are members of the same family if:

• they are married, or live together as if they were married (including same-sex couples)

• one is the other's parent, grandparent, child, grandchild, brother, sister, uncle, aunt, nephew or niece (includes relationships by marriage or by half-blood, & children who are fostered, adopted or otherwise brought up as a member of the family)

Therefore your proposed situation must mean two "families", so not an HMO but you would still need to clear it all with your LL.

(The additional criteria was that the tenants shared a kitchen, bathroom & toilet)
You and your BF will be classed as "living together as if you were married" and therefore you will be one "family": if you then add the third tenant in their own room your status within the property has to be 3 persons from *two* families so not an HMO.
Is the owner of the property a registered landlord, as required by law in Scotland?

Bunnie

Yes the LL is registered.

As it is a 2 bed property though he never imagined it would be HMO.

I understood what you had said before but i was confused by the information on the Glasgow CIty Council website regarding HMO.

"You should note that a licence for a House in Multiple Occupation will be required for premises where there are 3 or more persons living together who are not all members of either the same family or of one or other of 2 families."

"...or of one or other of 2 families."

Does this mean what you had said that if there is only 2 'families' in the property then it does not require an HMO? The wording is a bit confusing sorry!

Ekk

barnaby-bear

Bunnie wrote: »

Guess i should have explained more, doh!

Landlord owns the proptry and is a really good friend of my dads so hes renting the entire flat to me.Yippee!

LL sugested i sublet the room as he wanted me to pick a friend etc to live in the flat with me. He sorta knows i cant afford the rent without another body in the flat! He sorta takes a back seat unless something is wrong with the flat which i really like.

All the subletting details are sorted and contracts in order etc.

Just wanted to know what would happen if the BF was to move in and 3 people were living in the flat but counts as 2 families. Wasnt sure if it was HMO or not?

I know he wouldnt consider to make the flat HMO cause of the cost etc which i understand.

I know HMO differes in England/Wales and Scotland and within local council and is why i said i was in Glasgow!

Looked on glasgow city council website and didnt undertand it atall!

Well thanks for any help!

An HMO here is 3 or more consisting of two or more household - if you don't have written permission for the LL you as the one subletting are responsible for the legislation and legalities.... HMO interpretations vary area to area.

barnaby-bear

barnaby-bear wrote: »

An HMO here is 3 or more consisting of two or more household - if you don't have written permission for the LL you as the one subletting are responsible for the legislation and legalities.... HMO interpretations vary area to area.

The broad definition is HMO = two or more households but there is an exemption for two households each consisting of one person... i.e. two people houseshares:
http://www.kettering.gov.uk/site/scripts/documents_info.php?documentID=391&pageNumber=3