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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Sam M
    • By MSE Sam M 6th Apr 17, 4:26 PM
    • 214Posts
    • 153Thanks
    MSE Sam M
    Great Hunt: Have you ever had a Section 75 claim rejected?
    • #1
    • 6th Apr 17, 4:26 PM
    Great Hunt: Have you ever had a Section 75 claim rejected? 6th Apr 17 at 4:26 PM
    Have you had a 'Section 75' claim rejected because you paid via a third-party firm such as Sage Pay or WorldPay?


    Under Section 75 law, your credit card provider is jointly liable with the retailer for a purchase over £100 if something goes wrong.

    But we're concerned you may not get this protection if a retailer uses a third-party payment firm, as we've seen some claims rejected.

    The authorities refuse to give us a definitive answer, so we need your help.

    This Forum tip was included in MoneySavingExpert.com's weekly email!
    Last edited by MSE Sam M; 11-04-2017 at 1:11 PM.
Page 1
    • Avatar73
    • By Avatar73 12th Apr 17, 8:11 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Avatar73
    • #2
    • 12th Apr 17, 8:11 AM
    No
    • #2
    • 12th Apr 17, 8:11 AM
    No, I have not.
    • hollydays
    • By hollydays 12th Apr 17, 9:02 AM
    • 14,878 Posts
    • 10,665 Thanks
    hollydays
    • #3
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:02 AM
    • #3
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:02 AM
    Have you had a 'Section 75' claim rejected because you paid via a third-party firm such as Sage Pay or WorldPay?


    Under Section 75 law, your credit card provider is jointly liable with the retailer for a purchase over £100 if something goes wrong.

    But we're concerned you may not get this protection if a retailer uses a third-party payment firm, as we've seen some claims rejected.

    The authorities refuse to give us a definitive answer, so we need your help.

    This Forum tip was included in MoneySavingExpert.com's weekly email!
    Originally posted by MSE Sam M
    By " the authorities" who exactly are you referring to The FSA?
    Last edited by hollydays; 12-04-2017 at 9:37 AM.
    • chudleyette
    • By chudleyette 12th Apr 17, 9:09 AM
    • 59 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    chudleyette
    • #4
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:09 AM
    • #4
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:09 AM
    I haven't had a claim rejected because of it being via a third party but did book a hotel room which was appalling via hotels.com and tried to make a claim. It was rejected by my CC provider and ombudsman because my contract wasn't with hotels.com but the hotel, which felt completely unfair.
    • afm315
    • By afm315 12th Apr 17, 9:27 AM
    • 1 Posts
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    afm315
    • #5
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:27 AM
    Do you mean payment service providers that are also an acquirer (who process claims)
    • #5
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:27 AM
    How is this even a subject for discussion when the Payment Service Provider doesn't hold the funds at any point, they go straight to the acquirer to process and this is who the card issuer contacts for any claims. Worldpay is also an acquirer as well as payment service provider, perhaps this is the missing link? Interested to understand what has happened to other people as its not the process as I understand it following making a claim recently.
    • Starty
    • By Starty 12th Apr 17, 10:26 AM
    • 1 Posts
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    Starty
    • #6
    • 12th Apr 17, 10:26 AM
    Yes, via PayPal
    • #6
    • 12th Apr 17, 10:26 AM
    We purchased approx £300 worth of TotsBots reusable nappies which failed in less than a year.

    The retailer refused our claim and so did Natwest as the transaction went through Paypal.
    • BaldacchinoR
    • By BaldacchinoR 12th Apr 17, 4:36 PM
    • 111 Posts
    • 45 Thanks
    BaldacchinoR
    • #7
    • 12th Apr 17, 4:36 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Apr 17, 4:36 PM
    What about chargeback claims - under £100? Can they be rejected if made via a 3rd party, whether payment was made via a debit or a credit card?


    To answer the question, yes, my S75 claim was rejected once because the purchase was made over 90 days ago, not because payment was made via a 3rd party.
    Last edited by BaldacchinoR; 12-04-2017 at 4:53 PM. Reason: Clarification
    • wealdroam
    • By wealdroam 12th Apr 17, 5:58 PM
    • 18,096 Posts
    • 14,857 Thanks
    wealdroam
    • #8
    • 12th Apr 17, 5:58 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Apr 17, 5:58 PM
    What about chargeback claims - under £100? Can they be rejected if made via a 3rd party, whether payment was made via a debit or a credit card?
    Originally posted by BaldacchinoR
    No, they can't.

    The chargeback however, will be attempted/made against the intermediate party.
    For example, if one makes a purchase from eBay using Paypal where Paypal takes the money from a debit/credit card, them the chargeback will be against Paypal. Paypal will defend this simply because they have done everything they were requested to do - send the money to the eBay seller.

    That all of course assumes that the card issuer accepts the chargeback reason.

    Do remember though that the chargeback process is not enshrined in law.
    • Rhode
    • By Rhode 12th Apr 17, 9:52 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Rhode
    • #9
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:52 PM
    • #9
    • 12th Apr 17, 9:52 PM
    I paid wit PayPal to stay in a hotel in Sydney Australia via Hotels.Com. When I got to hotel, they tried to charge me an extra $80 Aud for checking in after 10.00pm even though I booked room at 11pm and I was not advised by Hotels.Com on their website. I left and stayed at another hotel. I contacted hotels.com who advised they had contacted hotel for a refund on my behalf and as hotel would not give a refund and they were only a booking agent, there was nothing they could do.
    I then contacted PayPay, they investigated and refunded the cost of the hotel charge and taxi fee to next hotel.
    • Mike7485
    • By Mike7485 13th Apr 17, 12:01 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Mike7485
    Yes
    Tesco Mastercard refused a refund for £495 for a bike I purchased for my grandson (years ago). They stated they had completed their transaction correctly, and I obviously had no redress against the 3rd party payee.
    • MSE Faye
    • By MSE Faye 13th Apr 17, 1:40 PM
    • 146 Posts
    • 55 Thanks
    MSE Faye
    Tesco Mastercard refused a refund for £495 for a bike I purchased for my grandson (years ago). They stated they had completed their transaction correctly, and I obviously had no redress against the 3rd party payee.
    Originally posted by Mike7485
    Mike, would you be happy to drop me an email with a few details of what happened? I'm an MSE news reporter. faye.lipson@moneysavingexpert.com.

    Many thanks,
    MSE Faye
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    • wealdroam
    • By wealdroam 13th Apr 17, 2:04 PM
    • 18,096 Posts
    • 14,857 Thanks
    wealdroam
    Tesco Mastercard refused a refund for £495 for a bike I purchased for my grandson (years ago). They stated they had completed their transaction correctly, and I obviously had no redress against the 3rd party payee.
    Originally posted by Mike7485
    How long ago was 'years ago'?

    Section 75 of The Consumer Credit Act didn't come into effect until 1st July 1977.
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 13th Apr 17, 2:17 PM
    • 2,056 Posts
    • 1,979 Thanks
    DoaM
    £495 for a bike (I'm reading as pushbike) ... highly unlikely to have been more than 40 years ago.
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    • Agricolae
    • By Agricolae 13th Apr 17, 6:13 PM
    • 361 Posts
    • 188 Thanks
    Agricolae
    The root cause of uncertainty over whether third party payment providers prevent a successful Section 75 claim is probably down to the failure of the OFT test case around 10 years ago to clear up this point (it was asked to look at whether acquirers caused issues, not additional third parties as well).

    The industry position since then has settled into something along the following lines: "If the name on your credit card transaction isn't the same as the company you bought the item from, we will reject your claim." That's a generalisation though and it's more nuanced than that.

    For a big change to happen though, there would probably have to be another court case or a change in the law.
    • Agricolae
    • By Agricolae 13th Apr 17, 6:16 PM
    • 361 Posts
    • 188 Thanks
    Agricolae
    By " the authorities" who exactly are you referring to The FSA?
    Originally posted by hollydays
    Apologies for double post, but I'm guessing they mean FOS. They end up looking at the claims the banks reject of course.
    • UK-Panda
    • By UK-Panda 14th Apr 17, 3:04 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    UK-Panda
    Capital One refused to refund me although on a fraudulent transaction. Although other banks have refunded me in full plus interest. Please help!!
    • airhostess
    • By airhostess 19th Apr 17, 12:15 AM
    • 213 Posts
    • 80 Thanks
    airhostess
    I had this exact problem.

    Typed my card details in to pay for a mobile phone, it wasn't as advertised and I couldn't get my money back because the seller unbeknownst to me used PayPal to process my card payment. I typed my card details in directly and didn't log into my PayPal account.

    The main issue is:

    As a purchaser, you are unaware a to how exactly the merchant will process your card payment, often after you've paid already. The seller is under no obligation to tell you they use sage pay, world pay or PayPal to process your purchase and you won't be covered in event of dispute.
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