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The recession, benefits, the safety net, and the learning curve

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Max_Headroom_3
Max_Headroom_3 Posts: 1,597 Forumite
Mortgage-free Glee!
The one thing this recession is going to do is wake people like myself up to what the benefit system is actually about.

I've worked full time in continuous employment since I left school 25 (is it really that long!?) year ago. And I've been fortunate enough never to need to claim anything, I've just jogged along earning my money, paying my taxes, living my life.

And naively (as it turns out) I've paid those taxes in part in the belief that I'm contributing to the countries benefit system which is helping out those that need help, safe in the knowledge that there but for the grace of God go I. And that should I ever be in the unfortunate position of being unable to support myself, that very same benefit system will be my safety net should I need it.

Sure, I've had the odd rant in the past like everyone else about the benefit scroungers of society. It seems every other month the Daily Mail unearths another family of eight pulling in £30K a year worth of benefits and living in a five bedroom detached house all at the expense of Joe Taxpayer. and on a more personal level, I know of several people seemingly able to live life quite happily without a thought toward getting a job, nice little terraced house, secondhand car, treats for the kids and a modest holiday once a year. And that irks, but as is often said, that's the price we pay in this country for a safety net that keeps everyone afloat. The system is bound to be open to some abuse, that's just how it is.

Ok so, recession hits, the business I'm working in almost completely flat-lines, and after a year of sitting in my office staring out of the window and wondering how long they're going to continue to pay me for doing nothing I get my answer. They're not. I'm out. Fair enough, I can cope with that, honestly can't blame them. The business isn't there and only a major re-structure is going to save the company. Unfortunately I'm (along with many others) re-structured out the door.

I hit the ground running, my CVs are in the post like confetti, I'm all over the job sites, I'm on the phone, I'm Mr. Proactive, I've got history, I've got experience, I'll get another job and we'll keep the plates spinning.

No.

Two months and one deafening silence later and I've not had a single offer of an interview. The enormity of all those hours of BBC news broadcasts and reams of newsprint hit home. This is serious. And this isn't happening to somebody else, this is happening to me, now.

So thank god for the benefit system this country proudly boasts. Thank god for the safety net that has it's problems, but doesn't allow anyone to slip through, a cradle of support for those in dire need. And I am in dire need.

So I find myself on the phone and I find myself in the job centre and I find myself answering question after question and I'm signed on.

And what do I get? £64-30/week. That's less than £3.5K a year. That's £279 a month. I can also claim help with my council tax. And that, I'm told, is it.

And for that I have to trot down to the job centre once a fortnight with my homework for marking. What jobs have I applied for? Who've I phoned? Where've I looked? After all, they don't want me putting my feet up and retiring on this bountiful income do they?

So what happened to this safety net? What, in fact, am I supposed to live on? Ok I'm fortunate, I've got a small amount of savings. But what if the roof falls off tomorrow and the builder tells me it's going to cost all of that to fix it? What, actually, will I live on then? I live very modestly but the JSA barely covers the bills. I can't actually therefore afford to eat. Pretty basic stuff I'd have thought.

So, like many others, I find myself questioning.

Why is this "safety net" failing a hard working tax paying single man? What were all those tens of thousands of pounds I've put into the system for?

And how is the single girl I know who's been living on benefits as long as I've known her (several years) able to afford to run a car and has just bought a pair of £130 Nike trainers for her sons birthday? I can't afford to eat on my benefits!

There is something very messed up with this system. And I think that as this recession bites deeper and deeper and people like myself suddenly become face to face with a reality they thought would never affect them, there's going to be a sharp learning curve as to what the benefit system actually is and a lot of people like myself are going to have the benefit system brought into sharp focus.

And what they (we) will see is that it's not a safety net at all. It won't save you when you need it, it won't provide temporary support at all, it just doesn't work that way. But yet it does at the same time allow many many people to live quite happily for years carving out a reasonable standard of living from it.

Something here is very very wrong.

And it desperately needs to change.
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Comments

  • Graham_Devon
    Graham_Devon Posts: 58,560 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    edited 18 May 2009 at 10:49AM
    The single girl has a kid of two I would assume, and you don't?

    Therein lies your problem. It's harsh, and many a single man and women without children are feeling it right now.

    I look out of the office window right now, and what do I see? 3 single mothers, 2 prams. Right outside the pub, 2 smoking, 1 talking on her mobile. Ones scoffing a pasty she just bought for £2 from spar.

    They are there every day, this pub still doesnt open until 11am, but once 11am comes, they will be in there propping up the bar, kids in the prams being fed scampi fries while they play pool and start their routine of standing outside the door 30 times each day.
  • Max_Headroom_3
    Max_Headroom_3 Posts: 1,597 Forumite
    Mortgage-free Glee!
    Graham, you're spot on of course.

    But does not having kids mean I'm not entitled to eat..? :confused:

    And does she not need to get a job?

    Because in a nutshell, that's how it stands as the system is at the moment.
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  • Mr_Mumble
    Mr_Mumble Posts: 1,758 Forumite
    The inequality of the benefits system is very stark and was brought into sharp focus for me by this piece:
    In a subway outside the sleek new tower of turquoise glass that houses the Radisson SAS hotel The Times found a personable, articulate young man named Michael Hancock, 29, selling copies of the Big Issue. Until recently he earned £1,400 a month as a panel beater in a garage that restored classic cars, lived in a comfortable two-bedroom flat in Dudley, and ran up £11,000 in credit card debts while he enjoyed himself — “I’m a young lad. I like to party.”

    In December the garage went bust. In January his landlord threw him out. As a single male he stood no chance of getting council accommodation and he now lives on the streets. His spare clothes and sleeping bag have been stolen. Each day he and his friend July try to sell enough copies of the Big Issue to spend a night in a cheap bed-and-breakfast — they make 80p a copy, but their earnings are deducted from their jobseeker’s allowance. As a homeless man, and in the present climate, Mr Hancock’s chances of finding a job are negligible.


    “I never thought I’d end up like this,” he said. “If I had, I’d have saved my money. I get that depressed that sometimes I feel like I want to end it. I can’t live like this.”
    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/money/borrowing/article6194436.ece
    "The state is the great fiction by which everybody seeks to live at the expense of everybody else." -- Frederic Bastiat, 1848.
  • lostinrates
    lostinrates Posts: 55,283 Forumite
    I've been Money Tipped!
    Max Headroom, I'm so very sorry to hear this news. I sincerely hope things pick up for you soon.

    One of the many problems with judging equality in th welfare system is that children do need parents. I am uncomfortable with suporting two parent familes doing nothing, and I'm uncomfortable with supporting people who see this as a lifestyle choice, but on the other hand, I do feel that GOOD fulltime parenting by one parent, whether thats in a single parent scenario or as part of a couple, is not necessarily something not to support, particularly of preschool children, and primry school children, of children with difficulties of their own. The difficulty then is that the emphasis on good supportive parenting, requires a judgement evaluation: neither easy (or perhaps possible?) and certainly not politically correct or popular, and terrifying to think who could be in a position to control what is seen as good or bad parenting. Gives me goosebumps.

    Good luck Max.
  • Max_Headroom_3
    Max_Headroom_3 Posts: 1,597 Forumite
    Mortgage-free Glee!
    Scarily, that homeless guy is effectively me.

    The only difference between us is that I was lucky enough to earn more than him, and I ploughed it into clearing my mortgage which means I own my home, and I have no debts.

    That doesn't make me cleverer, that makes me luckier in that I'm old enough to have bought when house prices were on the floor, and I'm cautious enough to try and avoid debt (though it's not always possible). That's it.

    So where's the safety net we're constantly told is the reason we're all supporting those who are able (generally by having kids) to create a comfortable life for themselves on benefits?

    Lets have one thing or the other. A genuine safety net for those in need (which clearly in fact we haven't got), or scrap the whole bloody thing and save billions upon billions of pounds.

    At the moment we seem to have the worst of all worlds, a "safety net" that many seem to be able to live off of at a cost of billions, but that doesn't actually support you when you need it (as both I and the big issue homeless guy amongst many others have discovered).
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  • Max_Headroom_3
    Max_Headroom_3 Posts: 1,597 Forumite
    Mortgage-free Glee!
    Max Headroom, I'm so very sorry to hear this news. I sincerely hope things pick up for you soon.

    One of the many problems with judging equality in th welfare system is that children do need parents. I am uncomfortable with suporting two parent familes doing nothing, and I'm uncomfortable with supporting people who see this as a lifestyle choice, but on the other hand, I do feel that GOOD fulltime parenting by one parent, whether thats in a single parent scenario or as part of a couple, is not necessarily something not to support, particularly of preschool children, and primry school children, of children with difficulties of their own. The difficulty then is that the emphasis on good supportive parenting, requires a judgement evaluation: neither easy (or perhaps possible?) and certainly not politically correct or popular, and terrifying to think who could be in a position to control what is seen as good or bad parenting. Gives me goosebumps.

    Good luck Max.

    But do we need a system that encourages the wrong sort of people to become parents and bring often unwanted children in the world in order to latch onto the benefit gravytrain?

    It strikes me that at the moment we have the very worst of all worlds, a system that encourages certain elements of society to breed (and then not effectively parent), whilst not supporting those that need it.
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  • Generali
    Generali Posts: 36,411 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Having lost my job a while back and having struggled to find a new one I wish you all the best.

    It does seem odd that the welfare state is set up to support some individuals with a living amount of money almost indefinitely and others with not enough to survive beyond the shortest term.
  • Max_Headroom_3
    Max_Headroom_3 Posts: 1,597 Forumite
    Mortgage-free Glee!
    I agree, and I think the thing is, people (like myself) are going to suddenly realise this.
    Hi, we’ve had to remove your signature. If you’re not sure why please read the forum rules or email the forum team if you’re still unsure - MSE ForumTeam
  • lostinrates
    lostinrates Posts: 55,283 Forumite
    I've been Money Tipped!
    But do we need a system that encourages the wrong sort of people to become parents and bring often unwanted children in the world in order to latch onto the benefit gravytrain?

    It strikes me that at the moment we have the very worst of all worlds, a system that encourages certain elements of society to breed (and then not effectively parent), whilst not supporting those that need it.


    I tentatively agree: I think there are exceptions though, there are some mothers who have had life happen after thay have had children, can't get work easily, can't fit work round children easily: I'd rather those good parents (I sy mother as force of habit, it could be a father left with children) were allowed to parent and produce worthwhile members of society than forced out to work and, especially where children are of particular need, they grow up with out the guidance they need: morally, educationally. As I say the hard thing here is who could possibly make the judgement as to who is a good parent whose use to society is bringing up children? I don't have much faith on the current system without bring more of judgement into it: the vontrol, the political influence etc etc that this would lead to is simply terrifying.

    Do I think its right now? no, but I think it could be much, much worse too. That the system is least provident to those who have been most ''model'' members of our society seems unfair and bizarre: I can't think of a way to make the system, in my eyes faultless. Certainly not a vote winning way!
  • Out,_Vile_Jelly
    Out,_Vile_Jelly Posts: 4,842 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts
    Your post raises a lot of uncomfortable questions that many more people are likely to find themselves asking in the future. I've always supported the welfare system, with a vague idea that it's how a civilised society helps those afflicted with misfortune, but without ever having any direct experience with it. Is there a country that has managed to get the right balance between workhouse poverty and benefits as a lifestyle choice, I wonder?

    Wishing you all the best Max- without knowing much about your personal circumstances, perhaps you are well placed to retrain/work abroad- something those with outstanding mortgages and kids could do less readily?
    They are an EYESORES!!!!
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