Being charged for care - please help

Mark_b_2 · 1 September 2007 at 12:16AM

I already posted this in Anything Else Moneysaving ...

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=541203

And i was advised to post it here for more advise

Hi there
I have read all the rules and guidelines, so i hope this is the correct place to post.

So my dad is in care (living in someones home and the local social services paying the lady (a nurse) to care for him). And all I know is that my dad is having to pay the £300 a week charge in full as he has more than £21 grand to his name. His social worker has told him that if he has less than £21 grand the council will have to pay all/some of this care money.

My question is, if he gives me this excess money, will he no longer have to pay or not pay as much, with out any problems. Sadly my dad is not mentally well so he cant sort this out him self.

I hope that made sense. Any help would be amazing.
Regards
Mark

Savvy_Sue · 1 September 2007 at 1:38AM

Short answer, no he can't, it will be seen as 'intentional deprivation of assets'.

Longer answer, have a look at similar posts on this board because if there is anything he needs then spending money on that to reduce his capital would usually be fine, eg an adjustable bed to make getting in and out easier, safer etc. You would also get good advice from Help the Aged and similar organisations - links in the other threads.

seven-day-weekend · 1 September 2007 at 1:40AM

If he gives you money in order to claim a benefit and/or care home fees, that is classed as deliberate deprivation of capital and he will be treated as thlough he still has it.

So no, giving you some money will not mean the council will pay his care fees.

Mark_b_2 · 1 September 2007 at 11:42AM

Thank you very much for the replies!

So even if he doesn’t give me all the money (i.e. they still have a couple years to drain his savers) and he say, gave me £16 grand to pay off my student loan (I’m still at uni)?? I mean he wanted to do this anyway before he went into care, so just because he is in this situation, means he will be penalised for it, if that’s the case its disgusting.

Thank you for that link "Attendance Allowance", sadly my dad is under 65, but I did see a link on that site for "Disability living allowance", he should be able to claim that.

Its quite difficult to talk to my dad about it with him being unwell and in his state he doesn’t like discussing his money issues, but I have found out he owes the grandparents some money. So would you advise I just get him to give his parents their money back, or talk to social services about this? Make sure my grandparents have proof that they are in his debt?

Its really weird having to sort out his problems, I'm only 21 and at this age I didn’t expect to see my 55 year old father (who a few years ago was a working functioning man) go mad and be put in a home. I'm only home a couple weeks a year from uni and I'm the only one who can sort this out.

Cheers for any more help

hayleythedaisy · 1 September 2007 at 12:02PM

Hello,

Firstly sorry you have to be dealing with this at such a young age.

I work in housing benefits which also mean test and exclude people by their capital amounts.

The law on deprivation of capital is very difficult to prove, and often even if an application for state help is turned down the decision will be often be overturned by a tribunal. Obviously I cannot give you 100% clear advice but I would say if you can present a clear case for why your fathers capital has decreased not to take advantage of state help then there is a very high chance that at least at appeal stage if not sooner you would not be turned down.

Also, (and this is just a comment and I am in no way recommending you do this because I may loose my job for doing so) however, ordinarily means tested state grants, benefits etc request 3 months bank statements to check the amount of capital, and if no previous claim has been made, the administrating body has no way of knowing the account balances prior to the 3 months statemtents provided.

Hope this helps.

Hayley

Mark_b_2 · 1 September 2007 at 12:43PM

Thanks again for the info...

Found this in an age concern leaflet file from another thread in this forums section

What is deprivation

a lump sum payment such as a gift or to pay off debt

If thats the case, I see no way to save his funds

seven-day-weekend · 1 September 2007 at 1:00PM

He can pay for things he needs and buy things that will help him with his disability. This is not classed as deliberate deprivation.

If he is able to claim DLA then this could go towards his care fees.

Savvy_Sue · 1 September 2007 at 1:08PM

Mark, I do feel for you, and understand how hard it must be to have to sort this out when most of your friends seem to be worried about nothing more serious than where the cheapest beer is to be found. Are your grandparents able to support you with any of this, even just talking things over with them? It must be hard for them too.

If you have a local branch of Age Concern, see if you can make an appointment face to face to discuss things. (The fact that your dad is only 55 won't matter, I am sure they are for over 50s.) They will know how things work in your area.

Also you suggest it's your dad's mental health which has made this care necessary: if there's a clear diagnosis have you found a support group for that condition?

But I do also want to make another point, which has been made in other places as well. Your dad needs care. Care costs money. Your dad has money. That may not be how he intended to spend that money, that may not be how he wants to spend that money, BUT can you honestly think of a better use for that money right now than getting him the care he needs?

Also, as long as your dad's money is being used to pay for this care, he has a lot more choice. If his current arrangements become unsuitable, if he needs more care than one person can give, he will have more choices if it is HIS money funding the care than if the local authority is paying.

I agree it's unfair if capital can't be used to pay off valid debts, but I wonder if the argument is that he needn't have borrowed money in the first place? And the regulations may have been set up to avoid a family debt conveniently being found in such circumstances. I'm not suggesting that this is what you're doing, but unless your dad was already making regular repayments of the debt you can see why it might look 'strange'.

EdInvestor · 1 September 2007 at 1:15PM

Mark_b wrote: »

Its really weird having to sort out his problems, I'm only 21 and at this age I didn’t expect to see my 55 year old father (who a few years ago was a working functioning man) go mad and be put in a home.

When you say "go mad", was your dad ever sectioned under the Mental Health Act?If so, the NHS will pay all his care fees.

seven-day-weekend · 1 September 2007 at 1:22PM

Yes Mark, I do agree that YOU need support tooo, maybe from your grandparents as Savvy Sue has mentioned, or from a support group, and even here on this forum.

Don't get yourself isolated.

And I agree that your Dad's money is best spebnt to give him the care he needs.

Apply for DLA, he'll have more income to put towards it then.

Wishing you well.

Mark_b_2 · 1 September 2007 at 1:25PM

Hi Sue
Sadly my grandparents live 5 hours north and granddad didnt have a stroke long ago, so grandma cant really do much

I shall investigate a local age concern and try find a support group, ta

I really understand you're point saying he needs the care and he has the money. I guess I just think that we shouldnt have to pay for being cared for and just hate that he has worked all his life to have a nice retirement and have money for his children. He is only a youngin' in the big scale of things, so all his money will be gone, he will have £21 grand for him self and to spend on his kids, so leaving £10 grand each to his two sons. instead of say £50 grand or more, he sure isnt happy about it.

About the debt to the grandparents, he had to borrow quite alot to buy his house, when he was being put into care, he decided to sell his house, so now the money borrowed is free to give back, yet it seems that it isnt hehe!

EDIT///

EdInvestor wrote: »

When you say "go mad", was your dad ever sectioned under the Mental Health Act?If so, the NHS will pay all his care fees.

I dunno, I shall find out. They gave him shock treatment, without my knowledge, so he must of been pretty screwed up, that rather annoyed me to say the least. That and the drugs he is on, makes him hardly seem like my dad anymore

Being charged for care - please help

Comments

Confirm your email address to Create Threads and Reply

🚀 Getting Started

Categories

Is this how you want to be seen?

Get our FREE Weekly email full of deals & guides - and it’s spam-free