catalogues?

Mimi_Arc_en_ciel · 26 August 2008 at 9:56AM

Do you have to sign a credit agreement for catalouges or do you automatically except the conditions?

(old debt cropping up, was with a catalouge the DCA said that you dont sign agreements but automatically accept them?)

salster · 26 August 2008 at 9:58AM

The majority of the time there is nothing to sign, but sometime they send you an agreement through the post. I've never signed one yet, so if you've never signed one they'll be hard pressed to have a signature.

Mimi_Arc_en_ciel · 26 August 2008 at 10:06AM

salster wrote: »

The majority of the time there is nothing to sign, but sometime they send you an agreement through the post. I've never signed one yet, so if you've never signed one they'll be hard pressed to have a signature.

i know i never signed one. I sent a letter requesting signature and the DCA sent this reply back:

"We refer to your recent corrospondence requesting a signed agreement, under the consumer act 1974

As with most home shopping accounts you will not have signed a credit agreement. You are deemed to have agreed to the terms and conditions of the credit, which were relayed in the catalouge itself when you placed your first order.

By requesting goods in exchange for money you are liable for payment of those goods. If you are denying responsibility for the payment of these goods we would ask what steps you have taken to return the goods if you did not intend paying for them?

As a simple assignee from the origional creditor we have aquired the rights but not the duties of the creditor as defined 189 (1) of the CCA 1974 and accordingly are entitled to persue the customer for the monies that remain due by reason of section 136 of the Law of property act 1925

However if you dispute this account please provide proof of residency of where you were between 2004 - 2005

Yours sincerly"

Now the DCA never contacted me origionally, i called them as they defaulted on my account and i didnt know what for. When i origionally phoned the women was a right cow and said "you MUST pay now!" which i said "I will be writing a letter in, im not paying anything" because i wanted a signed sgreement. If i hadn't of called them then they wouldnt of contacted me.

I did send them a P.O for the £1 but they have sent it back.

GeorgeUK · 26 August 2008 at 10:40AM

ANY credit agreement is required to comply with the Consumer Credit Act. Just because the DCA don't have a copy of the CCA does not mean they are not legally obliged to provide a copy. It doesn't matter that they aren't the original creditor - they are requesting payment for the debt and must still comply with the legislation.

It may however depend on the date of the agreement (although you say you didn't sign, so there is no agreement) as the legislation was updated for agreements signed after 01/04/2007

Did you send one of the template letters requesting a copy of the CCA or just requested the signature?

Usually it's best not to contact them.
They usually try to ignore you and their obligations, but here's and example of someone else who has tried to get a CCA for a catalogue.
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=929431

Mimi_Arc_en_ciel · 26 August 2008 at 10:46AM

GeorgeUK wrote: »

ANY credit agreement is required to comply with the Consumer Credit Act. Just because the DCA don't have a copy of the CCA does not mean they are not legally obliged to provide a copy. It doesn't matter that they aren't the original creditor - they are requesting payment for the debt and must still comply with the legislation.

It may however depend on the date of the agreement (although you say you didn't sign, so there is no agreement) as the legislation was updated for agreements signed after 01/04/2007

Did you send one of the template letters requesting a copy of the CCA or just requested the signature?

Usually it's best not to contact them.
They usually try to ignore you and their obligations, but here's and example of someone else who has tried to get a CCA for a catalogue.
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=929431

The debt is around 4 years old. I sent them a template letter from the DFW thread requesting a CCA and they sent the above letter back saying they dont need one

Shall i fire off another letter??

Mimi_Arc_en_ciel · 26 August 2008 at 10:52AM

will read that thread later george (just gotta nip out) but the DCA filed a default on my credit (thats why i contacted them origionally as i saw the default and didnt know what it was)

GeorgeUK · 26 August 2008 at 10:57AM

That thread i linked to has a little more detail about defaults.
Basically when you sign an agreement, you give permission for that party to share your details with the Credit Reference Agencies. As you didn't sign the agreement you did not give permission and so they are in breach of the Data Protection Act. Difficult to argue this though as most DCA's just ignore it and the OFT or TS do little about it.

Just stick to the timescale and wait 12+2 working days before sending off the next letter.
If the DCA put the default on after the 12 working days had passed, then they have put a default onto a debt that was in dispute and unenforcable. Not sure if that gives you a little extra clout to get it removed.

Mimi_Arc_en_ciel · 26 August 2008 at 7:42PM

GeorgeUK wrote: »

That thread i linked to has a little more detail about defaults.
Basically when you sign an agreement, you give permission for that party to share your details with the Credit Reference Agencies. As you didn't sign the agreement you did not give permission and so they are in breach of the Data Protection Act. Difficult to argue this though as most DCA's just ignore it and the OFT or TS do little about it.

Just stick to the timescale and wait 12+2 working days before sending off the next letter.
If the DCA put the default on after the 12 working days had passed, then they have put a default onto a debt that was in dispute and unenforcable. Not sure if that gives you a little extra clout to get it removed.

theres already a default on my credit - this was BEFORE i had even spoken to them or they had bothered to get in touch

They have stated they do not need a signed agreement - what letter do i send now? (they did reply in the time scale but just sent a fob of letter - have typed it out above)

dolally_2 · 26 August 2008 at 8:02PM

mommyme wrote: »

theres already a default on my credit - this was BEFORE i had even spoken to them or they had bothered to get in touch

They have stated they do not need a signed agreement - what letter do i send now? (they did reply in the time scale but just sent a fob of letter - have typed it out above)

As I understand the letter you typed was from a DCA and not the original creditor?

Anyway, you will need to wait for somebody who has done the cca requests before but from what I understand you do not have to do anything until they prove you owe the money and, furthermore, that they have the legal right to collect it. I suspect that they are hoping you are not going to fight this until the bitter end but I sugest you carry on following the cca request procedure.

I feel you will have to right back blinding them with law and hopefully somebody will be along soon to help you out with just what to say.

Best of luck anyway, I shall be watching with interest as I am thinking of doing a cca request on an old debt, I have repaid it in full but was going to try and get the default removed - well nothing ventured nothing gained!!

mbaz · 26 August 2008 at 8:17PM

I have just joined Littlewoods and they have sent me a credit agreement to sign

GeorgeUK · 26 August 2008 at 10:07PM

After you sent the original CCA request, they had 12 working days (+2 for postage) to provide a valid signed copy of the agreement. After this time elapsed, the debt was unenforcable and will remain so until they produce a copy of the CCA. Any money you were paying towards the debt could be stopped as the debt is officially in dispute.

When the debt becomes unenforcable, the next letter to send is the 12+2 day letter (or this one). This is basically making them aware that you know the debt is unenforcable and you also inform them that you are withdrawing any permission you have given them to share your information with a 3rd party, such as a CRA.

After a further month, you send the 12+2+30 day letter. I am not sure if there has been a change to the legislation - that if they have still not complied they are committing a criminal offence. I have only read a comment about it but have not looked into it so this letter may require a bit of tweeking if this is the case.

Replying to your letter is not enough. Even if they are not the creditor but are acting on behalf of the creditor, as they are requesting the payment, it is up to them to supply the documents. They should produce a copy of the CCA or pass the debt back to their client to deal with. If they then request payment then you can ask them for a copy of the CCA.

If there is a period of 6 years (5 in Scotland) where you have not made any payments towards the debt or acknowledged the debt in writing, the debt will become statute barred and unenforcable even in court.

Also as the original creditor never had an agreement with you (signed CCA) to allow them to pass on your details to a 3rd party, they were in breach of the Data Protection Act and i would ask them to remove the default placed on your file.

catalogues?

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