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  • FIRST POST
    • thebullsback
    • By thebullsback 14th Jan 20, 7:27 PM
    • 429Posts
    • 48Thanks
    thebullsback
    Tracked at work
    • #1
    • 14th Jan 20, 7:27 PM
    Tracked at work 14th Jan 20 at 7:27 PM
    Hi all, my Employer ( A very Large National organisation) Has issued several of us with a smartphone on whichwe will recieve jobs that need doing ect.
    Thing is that the device also Tracks the person.
    How does this sort of thing stand ??
    Keep in your thoughts the poor Beasts of burden around the World and curse All who do them harm.
Page 1
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 14th Jan 20, 7:43 PM
    • 39,820 Posts
    • 164,204 Thanks
    silvercar
    • #2
    • 14th Jan 20, 7:43 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Jan 20, 7:43 PM
    By tracks the person, I assume you mean it monitors the location of the phone? Sounds like the company are monitoring the location of their property, doubt it is illegal.

    You could always turn that app off and see when they notice.
    • polgara
    • By polgara 14th Jan 20, 7:45 PM
    • 435 Posts
    • 431 Thanks
    polgara
    • #3
    • 14th Jan 20, 7:45 PM
    • #3
    • 14th Jan 20, 7:45 PM
    Whatís the issue? Switch it off when not at work or on lunch break.
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 14th Jan 20, 8:42 PM
    • 7,588 Posts
    • 8,096 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    • #4
    • 14th Jan 20, 8:42 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Jan 20, 8:42 PM
    It sounds as if there is a legitimate business reason for tracking your location as it means they can allocate work to the nearest person. All you can do is inform the employer that you will be switching the tracking function off outside working hours.
    • Blatchford
    • By Blatchford 14th Jan 20, 8:45 PM
    • 562 Posts
    • 834 Thanks
    Blatchford
    • #5
    • 14th Jan 20, 8:45 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Jan 20, 8:45 PM
    You aren't lying about where you are or what you are doing. So you have nothing to worry about.
    • Jsacker
    • By Jsacker 14th Jan 20, 9:13 PM
    • 83 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    Jsacker
    • #6
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:13 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:13 PM
    You aren't lying about where you are or what you are doing. So you have nothing to worry about.
    Originally posted by Blatchford
    Could also be a GDPR concern if the data collected can identify an individual (the poster) and therefore be considered personal data.

    thebullsback, could be worth speaking to the ICO for some guidance if that is your worry. Some fairly relevant advice from GOV as a starting point: here and here
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 14th Jan 20, 9:21 PM
    • 10,426 Posts
    • 12,611 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #7
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:21 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:21 PM
    Could also be a GDPR concern if the data collected can identify an individual (the poster) and therefore be considered personal data.

    thebullsback, could be worth speaking to the ICO for some guidance if that is your worry. Some fairly relevant advice from GOV as a starting point: here and here
    Originally posted by Jsacker
    No. It's no different to monitering a log in on a PC. It's not personal data when you're at work.
    • Dox
    • By Dox 14th Jan 20, 9:37 PM
    • 1,899 Posts
    • 1,424 Thanks
    Dox
    • #8
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:37 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:37 PM
    Could also be a GDPR concern if the data collected can identify an individual (the poster) and therefore be considered personal data.

    thebullsback, could be worth speaking to the ICO for some guidance if that is your worry. Some fairly relevant advice from GOV as a starting point: here and here
    Originally posted by Jsacker
    The links you've given relate to monitoring. Knowing where your staff are during working hours isn't the same thing.

    OP, why are you bothered?
    • Blatchford
    • By Blatchford 14th Jan 20, 9:44 PM
    • 562 Posts
    • 834 Thanks
    Blatchford
    • #9
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:44 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:44 PM
    Could also be a GDPR concern if the data collected can identify an individual (the poster) and therefore be considered personal data.

    thebullsback, could be worth speaking to the ICO for some guidance if that is your worry. Some fairly relevant advice from GOV as a starting point: here and here
    Originally posted by Jsacker
    If the employer is tracking them - pretty much all technology can track people these days, but it doesn't mean that is what is happening- it is with their knowledge (the OP says it's tracking them) for business reasons during business hours. What exactly do you see as wrong with that? And where they are working, during working hours, is definitely not personal data! If they are working from the pub or their bedroom when they are supposed to be somewhere else, I think you'll find that isn't "personal data" but "evidence".
    • Jsacker
    • By Jsacker 14th Jan 20, 9:49 PM
    • 83 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    Jsacker
    No. It's no different to monitering a log in on a PC. It's not personal data when you're at work.
    Originally posted by Comms69
    If the PC log can identify me or you as an individual, how would that not be considered personal data?
    • Jsacker
    • By Jsacker 14th Jan 20, 9:52 PM
    • 83 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    Jsacker
    The links you've given relate to monitoring. Knowing where your staff are during working hours isn't the same thing.
    Originally posted by Dox
    Knowing where your staff are during working hours seems like monitoring to me?

    But the link, as stated, was only "semi-relevant" and I was more pointing towards the ICO bit (second link) as any concerns in that respect can be run past them.
    • Blatchford
    • By Blatchford 14th Jan 20, 9:54 PM
    • 562 Posts
    • 834 Thanks
    Blatchford
    If the PC log can identify me or you as an individual, how would that not be considered personal data?
    Originally posted by Jsacker
    Because the definition of personal data isn't about simply identifying individuals but about legitimate ownership of the information. If you are working on your employers employer's computer then what you are doing is not your personal data. If you doubt that, download a load of porn and see how that works out for you.
    • FtbDreaming
    • By FtbDreaming 14th Jan 20, 9:55 PM
    • 169 Posts
    • 299 Thanks
    FtbDreaming
    Our housing association have trackers in their vans.. so the workers now sit outside the house for 2 hours after doing the job so it looks like they're still on the job.
    • Marvel1
    • By Marvel1 14th Jan 20, 9:58 PM
    • 4,681 Posts
    • 5,300 Thanks
    Marvel1
    Employer is paying you too work, not skive, do your job and be where you are suppose too and nothing to worry about
    • Jsacker
    • By Jsacker 14th Jan 20, 9:59 PM
    • 83 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    Jsacker
    If the employer is tracking them - pretty much all technology can track people these days, but it doesn't mean that is what is happening- it is with their knowledge (the OP says it's tracking them) for business reasons during business hours. What exactly do you see as wrong with that? And where they are working, during working hours, is definitely not personal data! If they are working from the pub or their bedroom when they are supposed to be somewhere else, I think you'll find that isn't "personal data" but "evidence".
    Originally posted by Blatchford
    I have no opinion on the rights and wrongs here. It is what it is and likely nothing wrong with the employer's approach. But tracking location of employees is very likely creeping into GDPR territory (personal data or not) and any such concerns can be run past the ICO if the poster wishes.
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 14th Jan 20, 10:12 PM
    • 7,588 Posts
    • 8,096 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    My brother-in-law works for Royal Mail and the new generation PDA's they will be getting can be tracked. Employees aren't too happy but there's not much they can do about it.
    • JReacher1
    • By JReacher1 14th Jan 20, 10:12 PM
    • 3,258 Posts
    • 4,570 Thanks
    JReacher1
    There is nothing wrong with tracking your employees. Some places make you “clock in” and “clock out” of your place of work to prove you’re there. This is just a more advanced way of doing that.

    I was watching my amazon courier yesterday as he travelled to my house with my parcel. If tracking was illegal this wouldn’t be allowed.

    Basically when you’re at work there is nothing wrong with your employer wanting to know where you are.
    • Jsacker
    • By Jsacker 14th Jan 20, 10:15 PM
    • 83 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    Jsacker
    Because the definition of personal data isn't about simply identifying individuals but about legitimate ownership of the information. If you are working on your employers employer's computer then what you are doing is not your personal data. If you doubt that, download a load of porn and see how that works out for you.
    Originally posted by Blatchford
    Do you have a link with more info, preferably the ICO?

    I'd be eager to have a read as I am (perhaps falsely, it may seem) under the impression that a PC log which tracks my use of a work PC is usually going to be provided to me via a Subject Access Request. Has worked in terms of punch-in/out times in the past, which is a similar principle.

    Not sure why you brought up porn, as that wouldn't be my data to request (I don't appear on any porn sites, sadly).
    • Ozzuk
    • By Ozzuk 15th Jan 20, 8:37 AM
    • 1,720 Posts
    • 2,468 Thanks
    Ozzuk
    Because the definition of personal data isn't about simply identifying individuals but about legitimate ownership of the information. If you are working on your employers employer's computer then what you are doing is not your personal data. If you doubt that, download a load of porn and see how that works out for you.
    Originally posted by Blatchford
    Actually for once you aren't quite right on this. Under the ICO the definition of personal data is anything that can identify an individual - so for a computer logon it could be logon account or IP address.

    IMO the tracking isn't illegal, however as you can likely identify the individual (or what would be the point) then it would indeed be personal data. This isn't an issue though, it would be very easy for the company to supply a reason why they needed this data, and it would need to be included in the company privacy policy and staff should be made aware (and give consent). There is also provision under GDPR that you must make it easy to not give consent - but the counter would be no consent, no employment.

    Downloading porn would come under the computer misuse act 1990.
    Last edited by Ozzuk; 15-01-2020 at 8:41 AM.
    • ohreally
    • By ohreally 15th Jan 20, 10:29 AM
    • 7,250 Posts
    • 5,707 Thanks
    ohreally
    What is the purpose and scope of the monitoring?

    If large employer, what has been the union feedback?
    Donít be a canít, be a can.
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