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  • FIRST POST
    • lindylootoo
    • By lindylootoo 8th Aug 18, 12:42 PM
    • 7Posts
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    lindylootoo
    Making Tax Digital
    • #1
    • 8th Aug 18, 12:42 PM
    Making Tax Digital 8th Aug 18 at 12:42 PM
    I'm given to understand that MTD becomes compulsory by April 2019 - can anyone confirm that?

    Isn't there a cutoff for small business? Many VAT registered companies are still too small for accounting software and many who have moved to accounting software do not want to be dictated to by software suppliers to upgrade (and increase fees) just to have software which sends VAT returns automatically? For very many years I have used my Government Gateway for this........it suits my purpose very well and I really don't want the issues to transferring to newer, fancier, bells and whistles, , software.

    TIA
Page 1
    • antrobus
    • By antrobus 8th Aug 18, 1:04 PM
    • 16,123 Posts
    • 22,959 Thanks
    antrobus
    • #2
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:04 PM
    • #2
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:04 PM
    I'm given to understand that MTD becomes compulsory by April 2019 - can anyone confirm that?

    ...
    Originally posted by lindylootoo
    As part of MTD, businesses registered for VAT with a taxable turnover above the VAT registration threshold of 85,000 will need to keep VAT records digitally and file their VAT returns using MTD compatible software. This will start from their first VAT period starting on or after 1 April 2019.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/news/hmrc-publishes-more-information-on-making-tax-digital
    • lindylootoo
    • By lindylootoo 8th Aug 18, 1:09 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    lindylootoo
    • #3
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:09 PM
    • #3
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:09 PM
    So using an accountancy package.....which is digital, so appears to be MTD compliant, but submitting returns using the Government Gateway.......this isn't compliant?
    • Pennywise
    • By Pennywise 8th Aug 18, 1:09 PM
    • 10,630 Posts
    • 19,947 Thanks
    Pennywise
    • #4
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:09 PM
    • #4
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:09 PM
    Officially, HMRC are still clinging on to the April 2019 introduction. In reality, it's highly unlikely it will happen. There are still far too many unknowns and the sheer scale of it, so late in the day, means HMRC systems will probably be nowhere near ready for it. Most likely scenario is it being put back a while but having the facility available sometime in 2019 for those who want to do it.

    Don't forget though, it's not ALL vat registered businesses, only those with turnover over the VAT registration thresholds, so HMRC need to keep the old system for smaller businesses who have voluntarily registered for VAT - if they're keeping the old system for smaller voluntary registered businesses, they may as well keep for the others too!

    I'd really wait and see for some news nearer the time. It's already been put back so many times, and watered down so much, I'd put money on nothing being compulsory next year. Under the latest proposals, HMRC will receive nothing more than they do already - the initial proposals for sending the actual transactional data have already been scrapped. All that is required under current proposals is that the same few VAT return figures which you manually enter via their website now have to be transmitted automatically from software - there are many software conversion apps being written which take your desktop software, spreadsheet or whatever and simply convert the totals into the format required by HMRC anyway. So one way or another, highly unlikely you'll need to buy expensive all singing, all dancing software.

    MTD for business is another foul up from HMRC proving yet again they don't actually understand how businesses work. They were told years ago it wouldn't work, and year by year they've been forced to water down their proposals. Just a lot of worry and time wasted for nothing.
    • lindylootoo
    • By lindylootoo 8th Aug 18, 1:15 PM
    • 7 Posts
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    lindylootoo
    • #5
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:15 PM
    • #5
    • 8th Aug 18, 1:15 PM
    Pennywise - your post is wonderful - thank you. BUT......I've have been told that I "MUST" upgrade my current software before the end of August to comply!! When I questioned this on webchat - I was told I had to upgrade to be GDPR compliant. Then I had a message to say it wasn't compulsory. I can't help thinking that some software suppliers are jumping on the bandwagon!
    Even given that.........the hard sell I'm getting is extreme! Do I give in and upgrade or not?
    • antrobus
    • By antrobus 8th Aug 18, 2:12 PM
    • 16,123 Posts
    • 22,959 Thanks
    antrobus
    • #6
    • 8th Aug 18, 2:12 PM
    • #6
    • 8th Aug 18, 2:12 PM
    ...

    MTD for business is another foul up from HMRC proving yet again they don't actually understand how businesses work. They were told years ago it wouldn't work, and year by year they've been forced to water down their proposals. Just a lot of worry and time wasted for nothing.
    Originally posted by Pennywise
    It works in Estonia.
    • Pennywise
    • By Pennywise 8th Aug 18, 2:14 PM
    • 10,630 Posts
    • 19,947 Thanks
    Pennywise
    • #7
    • 8th Aug 18, 2:14 PM
    • #7
    • 8th Aug 18, 2:14 PM
    Do I give in and upgrade or not?
    Originally posted by lindylootoo
    I'd be VERY wary of upgrading so early as you have no way of knowing if your software will be RTI compliant when the time comes. Already one popular accounting software which originally said they'd be compliant has pulled out of RTI completely. I think you're right to think that they're just doing the hard sell by frightening you into upgrading.

    GDPR is a completely different matter - it's up to you as the business owner to check your own GDPR compliance, not a third party as they won't know what personal information you hold and process nor how you protect it. It's possible (in fact highly likely) that you can be GDPR compliant with your existing system. It would be interesting to know the reasons why they say it's not compliant yet their upgraded version is! Sounds again more like the hard sell than any genuine reason.
    • Pennywise
    • By Pennywise 8th Aug 18, 2:16 PM
    • 10,630 Posts
    • 19,947 Thanks
    Pennywise
    • #8
    • 8th Aug 18, 2:16 PM
    • #8
    • 8th Aug 18, 2:16 PM
    It works in Estonia.
    Originally posted by antrobus
    Yes, and other countries too I believe. The difference being they may have a competent "fit for purpose" tax authority and almost certainly have a less complex tax regime than the UK. Considering RTI for payroll brought in a few years ago is still suffering huge problems, I won't hold my breath for MTD for VAT/accounts working any time soon!
    • lindylootoo
    • By lindylootoo 8th Aug 18, 3:09 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    lindylootoo
    • #9
    • 8th Aug 18, 3:09 PM
    • #9
    • 8th Aug 18, 3:09 PM
    I'd be VERY wary of upgrading so early as you have no way of knowing if your software will be RTI compliant when the time comes. Already one popular accounting software which originally said they'd be compliant has pulled out of RTI completely. I think you're right to think that they're just doing the hard sell by frightening you into upgrading.

    GDPR is a completely different matter - it's up to you as the business owner to check your own GDPR compliance, not a third party as they won't know what personal information you hold and process nor how you protect it. It's possible (in fact highly likely) that you can be GDPR compliant with your existing system. It would be interesting to know the reasons why they say it's not compliant yet their upgraded version is! Sounds again more like the hard sell than any genuine reason.
    Originally posted by Pennywise
    At the present time, I'm using HMRC Basic PAYE Tools.

    I cannot see any reason why my present accounting software should NOT be GDPR compliant and surely any new upgrades which include PAYE with RTI are far LESS likely to be GDPR compliant?

    However, none of this gives me a valid reason for updating before 31st August!

    Thanks for all your help.
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