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  • FIRST POST
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 10th Jul 18, 2:00 PM
    • 15Posts
    • 3Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    Letter of Claim Recieved- BW Legal
    • #1
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:00 PM
    Letter of Claim Recieved- BW Legal 10th Jul 18 at 2:00 PM
    Hi in 2012 my partner and I parked in a car park for P&O ferries operated by Premier Parking Solutions and received a parking fine.

    You had to display both parts of the ticket in the windscreen as the one ticket on its own didn't actually show the expiration time. I cannot remember if we did show both (I only know both were needed as googling brought up another thread in the same car park). To me knowledge we never had a response to the appeal.

    At the time I emailed an appeal (naively)- I wasn't driving and I wasn't the registered keeper.
    I do know that at the time we paid the full amount for the parking to be valid and I still have photos of the tickets.

    I would like advice on where to go from here, should I just pay this now as i really don't want a CCJ against my name. Or can I request all the information that BW Legal have on the case prior to me responding?

    Thanks
Page 1
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 10th Jul 18, 2:06 PM
    • 3,261 Posts
    • 5,468 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:06 PM
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:06 PM
    Is this Hull?

    Also BW don't usually work with PPS so check to see if it is BW acting as debt collectors.
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 10th Jul 18, 2:17 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:17 PM
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:17 PM
    Yes Hull and definitely BW Legal acting on behalf of BW Legal. Letter is titled Letter or claim
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 10th Jul 18, 2:36 PM
    • 3,261 Posts
    • 5,468 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #4
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:36 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:36 PM
    Hull should be Associated British Ports and covered by Byelaws so search the site. Also it appears P&O can help.

    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5794414&highlight=hull#10
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 10th Jul 18, 2:44 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    • #5
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:44 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:44 PM
    Thanks but isn't it a tad late to get P&O Ferries to now step in and help?

    Also just noticed that the Vehicle registration on the letter is written wrong, it has a 1 rather than a I, does this help me?
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 10th Jul 18, 2:55 PM
    • 3,261 Posts
    • 5,468 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #6
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:55 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Jul 18, 2:55 PM
    Thanks but isn't it a tad late to get P&O Ferries to now step in and help?
    You'll only know when you call them.

    And even then you'll only know when they explain why they think they can't help. They clearly can, so an explanation of why they can't help (after you have asked) can be debated - when we know the outcome.
    If you want to win - avoid losing first. Here are a few examples
    1. Failing to Acknowledge or Defend https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5760415
    2. Template defences that say nothing https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5818671&page=5#86
    3. Forgetting about the Witness Statement
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 10th Jul 18, 4:10 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    • #7
    • 10th Jul 18, 4:10 PM
    • #7
    • 10th Jul 18, 4:10 PM
    Ok thank you. I have emailed them requesting help as unable to call whilst at work.

    In the meantime have I messed up by appealing in my name at the very beginning and does the incorrect reg make any difference?
    • Le_Kirk
    • By Le_Kirk 10th Jul 18, 4:18 PM
    • 3,206 Posts
    • 2,120 Thanks
    Le_Kirk
    • #8
    • 10th Jul 18, 4:18 PM
    • #8
    • 10th Jul 18, 4:18 PM
    In whose name did you submit the appeal, did you receive a notice to driver or notice to keeper? Incorrect reg is usually covered by de minimis non curat lex (the law does not concern itself with thrifles). You will only get a CCJ against you if you go to court and lose and then fail to pay as instructed by a judge.
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 10th Jul 18, 4:24 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    • #9
    • 10th Jul 18, 4:24 PM
    • #9
    • 10th Jul 18, 4:24 PM
    I submitted the appeal in my name. I don't recall ever receiving any notice. I don't have any of the paperwork relating to this ticket, I either binned it thinking it had gone away or have never received anything.
    • Le_Kirk
    • By Le_Kirk 10th Jul 18, 4:37 PM
    • 3,206 Posts
    • 2,120 Thanks
    Le_Kirk
    I don't recall ever receiving any notice.
    Originally posted by zoe_h2004
    Why then did you appeal? What has caused you to open this thread, have you received further letters from debt collectors or a letter before claim or a letter from Northampton Court business centre
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 10th Jul 18, 4:42 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    I appealed in December 2012 immediately after receiving the ticket as I didn't understood why we had ever got a ticket and thought it should have easily been removed (I didn't do any research). I do not have record of ever having received a response regarding the appeal I submitted. I've opened this thread as BW Legal have now sent me a Letter of Claim
    Last edited by zoe_h2004; 10-07-2018 at 4:45 PM.
    • Le_Kirk
    • By Le_Kirk 10th Jul 18, 5:46 PM
    • 3,206 Posts
    • 2,120 Thanks
    Le_Kirk
    Can you post the letter on here. Use a hosting service such as tinypic or imgur and post the URL. You should be able to post links but if not just post a broken link or use hxxp(s) instead of http(s) and someone will fix it for you.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 10th Jul 18, 6:15 PM
    • 61,449 Posts
    • 74,328 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    At the time I emailed an appeal (naively)- I wasn't driving and I wasn't the registered keeper.
    That's good.

    You should reply to the LBC saying VERY CLEARLY at the start, that you were neither the driver nor the keeper of the car, just a passenger and happen to be the person in the family who is the main letter-writer.

    But as you were neither driver nor keeper, PPS have no cause of action.

    Then you can continue with this case law, plagiarised from a version written by (solicitor regular poster) LOC123 re another case:

    Your client must now be informed by BW Legal that it cannot succeed in its planned claim against me.

    I refer you and your client to the following case law - and in case you have skim-read up to this point, I suggest you/your client re-read what I have just explained above, so there can be no doubt that you have the wrong Defendant in your sights and need to take your hand off the trigger of your scatter-gun:

    1. Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch): in which the court reiterated that the aim of the pre-action requirements was to enable an early exchange of information so that a potential claim could be fully investigated and, if possible, resolved without the need for costly litigation. Not only did the successful Claimant not recover its costs, it was ordered to pay the Defendant's. This case clearly demonstrates that litigation should be a last resort.

    2. Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20); Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872: in which the court made a punitive costs order against the Claimant because it had not complied with the Practice Direction.

    Your attention is drawn to the following paragraphs of the judgment:

    Paragraph 11: ''It is abundantly clear to me that [...] this is not a series of allegations that had been properly or thoroughly investigated until [...].'' {after proceedings had been issued}.

    Paragraph 14: ''...the object of the protocol is [...] to get people to put their cards on the table and to honestly and rationally discuss matters. To that end meetings are provided for, and there is a requirement [...] which prescribes that there should be a rational and sensible response; the protocol provides the framework for a sensible discussion, or the chance for a sensible discussion so that the option is available to a party to avoid the need for litigation.''

    3. Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855:

    This case confirmed that the purpose of the pre-action obligations imposed by the Practice Direction were so that parties could make a real attempt to resolve matters at an early stage. In the case, the Defendant was awarded costs arising from the Claimant's failure to comply with the Practice Direction, and your attention is drawn to paragraph 46 of the judgment, in which the punitive costs order was justified by the ''exchange of information taking place, not in the lower-cost atmosphere of pre-action protocol procedure, but in the higher-cost atmosphere of court proceedings.''
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 10-07-2018 at 6:19 PM.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 11th Jul 18, 7:41 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    Sorry I think I may have confused you Coupon-mad. In my original appeal, I used the following sentence....

    "I am extremely annoyed to discover that an member of your staff has issued my car with the following ticket when we had paid the full amount and the tickets were clearly displayed on the dashboard"

    It was my boyfriends car and he was the driver, by using the sentence above have I lost all ability to say the claim doesn't belong to be?

    I will try attach letter now.
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 11th Jul 18, 8:16 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004


    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 11th Jul 18, 8:34 PM
    • 1,772 Posts
    • 2,237 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    as well as the by law aspect ,what date was the ticket issued?
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 11th Jul 18, 8:39 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    13th December 2012.

    What do you mean by by law please?
    • twhitehousescat
    • By twhitehousescat 11th Jul 18, 8:41 PM
    • 1,772 Posts
    • 2,237 Thanks
    twhitehousescat
    13th December 2012.

    What do you mean by by law please?
    Originally posted by zoe_h2004
    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=74511821&postcount=4

    if the land comes under bylaws then only the land OWNER can bring charges , in a magistrates court and within 6 mths of the offence
    Time pretending I was asleep whilst under his desk , has given me insight to this sordid world
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 11th Jul 18, 8:55 PM
    • 8,424 Posts
    • 11,082 Thanks
    beamerguy
    They are asking for 160 but the debt does not carry
    that amount .... it's 100

    They are adding on a debt collectors fee which BWL
    hide it as an admin fee

    Were the debt collectors DRP ???

    The estimate shows this as legal fees
    and .... 44.45 interest ????

    At a nominal 8% p.a. possibly allowed by
    the court that's 8 a year on 100

    How long has this been going on for ???

    BWLegal forget that this is small claims
    stuff and NOT RIP OFF BRITAIN

    Serious questions need to be directed
    to BWL when you reply. You must reply

    No need to use their income form, it's
    none of their business, you never provide
    personal data to anyone regardless what
    they call themselves

    IMPORTANT: DID YOU RECEIVE LETTERS
    FROM DRP (DEBT RECOVERY PLUS)
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • zoe_h2004
    • By zoe_h2004 11th Jul 18, 9:06 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    zoe_h2004
    I do not have any letters or remember receiving any correspondence. I think that I may have binned the stuff a while ago after I split up with my ex as I figured it was his problem and it had gone away seen as I hadn't heard anything for years. Equally I may never have received any letters. This is my problem- I cannot see how I fight this without seeing all the info that they have on the case. Plus I cannot afford the risk of a CCJ as im about to get a mortgage. I need to be certain that I can put this to bed.

    I also believe we showed both tickets on the windscreen, but cant be 100% certain. I am 100% certain that the correct amount was paid and we didn't exceed the time. If both of these statements are true then I have no idea how they can even claim that the parking ticket still stands. But I would need photo evidence from the parking warden.
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