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  • FIRST POST
    • DillyDee
    • By DillyDee 11th May 18, 2:27 AM
    • 6Posts
    • 0Thanks
    DillyDee
    Gambling of tens of thousands can I sue?
    • #1
    • 11th May 18, 2:27 AM
    Gambling of tens of thousands can I sue? 11th May 18 at 2:27 AM
    Hi there, sorry if this is the wrong section, but I just wanted some advice on best way to proceed and how to format an email to send to the gambling company in question on the losses I've racked up gambling on their site. As I've emailed a number of firms that specialize in gambling disputes around 10 in total and none other that one, who stated to send the emails correspondence across over to them between me and this company, they'll review the communication and send them a letter across, would be a number of hours and overall cost would be about 1k, there's no guarantee this may work to be recompensated though they may sit up and take note from a legal firm..

    Anyway.. this isn't your average gambling website, like a bookies, sadly as no action has been taken against them yet I need to limit exactly what I say to limit my identity being exposed and the website in question..

    Anyway early 2015, I played on this website with real money and won, a lot of money, just under 50,000 worth. Shortly after winning, I placed a few small bets, nothing major.. shortly after that (a few weeks) their account manager phoned me up stating if I wanted to play through him, he can get me better discounts through him then if I played through the website.. I said thank you very much but no, I'm trying to be sensible with my winnings and that I did not want to spent a certain amount, which was quite a lot in order to qualify for his discounts.

    However he kept phoning and phoning me stating he's helped a number of people to win and I just fell for his words and said ok go on then..

    This accounts manager who works/worked for the website in question that I won this amount from claimed that players who have played through him, a number of them have won, and these amounts in question is a minimum of tens of thousands of pounds EACH.

    Me being young, naive and seen the appeal for another win, taken in by someone who claimed has helped a number of players who played on the site in question and won. (I mean this is a major plus as you would think this guy gave of the impression he had insider knowledge and another win would be on the cards if I just kept sticking to him by the reasons explained below) kept playing through him, racking up around 10,000 worth of transactions playing through him and about 4/5000 extra playing on my own..

    From the time I won in 2015, I spend that 15000 amount back on the website in the space of about a year and a half. Shortly before the end of that time period word got from a few small number of other players on social media who had never been in contact by this account manager were made aware that he had this thing going on with a number of players with the website in question whereby he was providing discounts on the competition costs overall AND (THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT) giving his insights on what the result would turn out to be to do with this competition and if it happened you'd win thosuands. The results of the daily competitions are determined by third parties, not software, HUMANS...

    The majority of the time I played through this accounts manager he provided his thoughts/insights on the outcome of the competition, I then went away, did what I had to do on the website and wait for the results to come in. Throughout the emails he mentioned a number of times that he's had a number of winners and I think the one week very early on playing through him, a week I didn't play or did play, he helped someone won, which made me extremely depressed as I was spunking thousands back on the site through him where he was obviously getting commission through each time I played through him and he wasn't delivering he's diagram insights were way off. Shortly afterwards of word getting back to themselves, that other playing members were made aware of this arrangement of their account manager helping others to win by providing insights on the outcome of the results, the emails between me and account manager stopped.

    This left me feeling cheated and felt that they, the company/the account manager targeted me shortly after my win so they could essentially get their winnings back. Now because the arrangement stopped with the accounts manager and having lost hope of winning again. I turned to other forms of gambling to try recover my losses, football betting, horse races, these wins never happened so I ended up spending more and more money placing these football/horse racing bets in the hope of reclaiming my losses and be done once and for all.

    As a result, from when I won the tens of thousands of pounds through this website, come the end of late 2017, I practically gambled it all away. (the original winnings from the company in question)

    I'm just wondering on what's the best course of action should I take by what I've stated and if anyone could help in the approach on what I should state when emailing the company, as whilst spent around 14000 on the website over the space of the year and a half, I felt like if that person who works/worked for the company should never contacted me and gave of the impression that he's helped others win, when he knew A, this was wrong, B, I believe is against company policy. (Well It must of been if they stopped this arrangement to continue with a number of players) I just feel I would of been more sensible and not frittled it all away. My spend before contact from the account manager was very small after the win before he contacted me and when it did, that's when the spend got bigger and bigger. I am wanting to recoup all of the winnings approx 50,000 back them as I feel they played a major role in me losing a lot of money.

    Some key points:

    - I win approx 50,000 in 2015

    -Accounts manager of website called me a number of weeks after winning this amount asking if I wanted to play through him. I said no, trying to be sensible with my winnings. Kept phoning telling me he's helped a number of other players to win. I fall for his words and kept on playing to win again. He provided his thoughts ([B]diagrams) [/B ]each time when playing through him on the results of the daily competitions, results are determined by third parties, humans not software.

    - He constantly through email mentioned how many players he's helped win.

    - I rack up over 10,000 worth of losses playing through the accounts manager, over the space of a year to 1 and half.. this shortly ended after other playing members on found out of the arrangement between him and other players and went ballistic.

    - Me desperate to win again after spending so much on the website continued to play, as a result racked up further losses around 5000. Stopped playing but continued to play very small amounts in the hope of sealing another win.

    - Tried to make the 15,000 worth of losses back through other gambling channels, football, horsebetting, continued to rack up losses which meant I have practically lost it all.

    A few months after I won, they introduced a rule where the winner could no longer play for 2 years. There has NEVER been any self exclusion steps one can take through there website to this day.

    I aim to seek full losses of approx 50,000 even though I spent around 15,000 of my winnings through them. My argument is that they took advantage of me, their accounts manager gave the impression that he would make me win again if I stood by his advice on playing strategy even though the winner is not determined by him, this spiralled out of control, I mentioned through email and phone conversations through him a number of times a few months after playing through him that, I needed to watch my money but he continued to call and email me asking if I wanted to play.

    The company in question is constantly fighting on social media to prove the legitimacy of the competition and I believe this emails would be damaging to their brand if they got out, especially if a person who works/worked from them directly and is high up has stated a number of times through email that he has personally helped a number of players win by them following his strategy on how to win by the form of digraphs.

    Thanks for reading this long winded post, please don't judge me, I just want some sound advice on how to proceed,

    (Text removed by MSE Forum Team)

    Thank you
    Last edited by MSE ForumTeam3; 12-05-2018 at 9:10 AM.
Page 1
    • photome
    • By photome 11th May 18, 7:07 AM
    • 13,094 Posts
    • 8,651 Thanks
    photome
    • #2
    • 11th May 18, 7:07 AM
    • #2
    • 11th May 18, 7:07 AM
    Sorry, not read it all as it is rather long

    Is the jist of it , you have lost money gambling but its not your fault?
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 11th May 18, 7:10 AM
    • 15,715 Posts
    • 21,584 Thanks
    pinkshoes
    • #3
    • 11th May 18, 7:10 AM
    • #3
    • 11th May 18, 7:10 AM
    You agreed, you gambled, you lost.

    The only winners are the company owners.

    Learn your lesson and move on.

    You have no case.
    Last edited by MSE ForumTeam3; 12-05-2018 at 9:11 AM. Reason: Quoting edited post
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 11th May 18, 7:53 AM
    • 1,842 Posts
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    Aylesbury Duck
    • #4
    • 11th May 18, 7:53 AM
    • #4
    • 11th May 18, 7:53 AM
    You didn't lose anything though. You simply gambled money you had already won, so you're no worse off than when you started. Presumably you were entirely happy with the way their website operated and the way they looked after you when you won 50,000? I can't see how you can sue a firm that hasn't caused you a loss. Surely every gambling firm would go out of business pretty quickly if punters were able to sue to recover their peak position?

    I hope you are seeking professional help for your addiction? Perhaps part of coming to terms with the situation will be to sit back and view the story as a whole. You talk about your "losses" but there's only the initial mention of your "winnings". Had you not been involved with this firm at all, you would be financially in the same position you are in now - i.e. a net zero.

    Get help, and not the legal kind.
    Last edited by Aylesbury Duck; 11-05-2018 at 9:26 AM.
    Please forgive the deliberate omission of apostrophes on some posts whilst I await MSE to do something about the daft codes that appear in their place when typing on certain devices.
    • dacouch
    • By dacouch 11th May 18, 8:13 AM
    • 20,429 Posts
    • 12,652 Thanks
    dacouch
    • #5
    • 11th May 18, 8:13 AM
    • #5
    • 11th May 18, 8:13 AM
    This guy will help you for free if you have a genuine case and you are UK based

    https://justiceforpunters.org/
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 11th May 18, 9:08 AM
    • 3,526 Posts
    • 2,707 Thanks
    AndyPix
    • #6
    • 11th May 18, 9:08 AM
    • #6
    • 11th May 18, 9:08 AM
    Intrigued - What kind of competitions were you gambling on ?


    It all sounds very shady
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • soolin
    • By soolin 11th May 18, 9:53 AM
    • 60,306 Posts
    • 42,964 Thanks
    soolin
    • #7
    • 11th May 18, 9:53 AM
    • #7
    • 11th May 18, 9:53 AM
    Another preposterous dilemma post.

    OK, assuming this is genuine (and frankly I gave up after the first chunk) I echo the advice above- you lost money gambling, that is your fault and no one else's unless you have any proof that the website does not comply at all with UK regulations. However, I think the main point here is to get help, try gambling anonymous as a starter:

    https://www.gamblersanonymous.org.uk/

    stop this habit before it gets any further out of hand.

    Also, you appear to mention getting third party assistance to sue someone (not entirely clear about that?) if you are paying someone to help - STOP, that in itself could be a scam. There are a lot of unscrupulous sites out there conning addicts or persons who may be vulnerable, into parting with more money with no ultimate benefit.
    I'm the Board Guide for the Ebay Board , Charities Board , Dosh & Disability , Up Your Income and the Local MoneySaving-England board which means I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum running smoothly. However, do remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com
    New to Forum? Guide
    • wesleyad
    • By wesleyad 11th May 18, 10:33 AM
    • 206 Posts
    • 162 Thanks
    wesleyad
    • #8
    • 11th May 18, 10:33 AM
    • #8
    • 11th May 18, 10:33 AM
    If you hadn't won in the first place I'd say the company would have been on shaky ground. You can't encourage someone to lose this amount, if anything they are meant to be actively helping stop large losses nowadays.

    The ABB publish this and if this bookie is a member you can complain to them directly

    http://abb.uk.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Responsible-Gambling-Code-2015.pdf

    However as they have a record of your win, they are just trying to get their money back, this probably won't apply.

    As others have said you may need to think about help, it's not a weakness to do so.
    • thebigstillmeister
    • By thebigstillmeister 11th May 18, 11:13 AM
    • 111 Posts
    • 90 Thanks
    thebigstillmeister
    • #9
    • 11th May 18, 11:13 AM
    • #9
    • 11th May 18, 11:13 AM
    This accounts manager who works/worked for the website in question that I won this amount from claimed that players who have played through him, a number of them have won, and these amounts in question is a minimum of tens of thousands of pounds EACH.
    Originally posted by DillyDee
    If I ever set up a gambling website I will definitely ensure I hire a whole team of account managers to help all my customers win large amounts of my money and ensure I am left out of pocket, sounds like a foolproof business model to me,
    • steampowered
    • By steampowered 11th May 18, 11:39 AM
    • 2,487 Posts
    • 2,407 Thanks
    steampowered
    It sounds like you are trying to shift responsibility for your actions onto somebody else.

    Sorry, but you decided to gamble that money. Not the account manager.

    It sounds like you have a gambling problem. You should not gamble in future. If you do gamble, restrict it to the odd tenner for fun. Not large sums of money. And never try to win back your losses, that won't happen.
    • newatc
    • By newatc 11th May 18, 12:04 PM
    • 230 Posts
    • 268 Thanks
    newatc
    I'm not sure you have a case sadly unless you can prove that because of the account manager's knowledge, you had no chance of winning.
    I'm not sure from what you have written that you need gamblers anonymous but you have found that chasing losses is what moves bettors to reckless gamblers. If you still think that you can get your money back by gambling then certainly contact GA.

    Good luck.
    • Blackbeard of Perranporth
    • By Blackbeard of Perranporth 11th May 18, 12:22 PM
    • 5,028 Posts
    • 30,294 Thanks
    Blackbeard of Perranporth
    Hi there, sorry if this is the wrong section, but I just wanted some advice on best way to proceed and how to format an email to send to the gambling company in question on the losses I've racked up gambling on their site. As I've emailed a number of firms that specialize in gambling disputes around 10 in total and none other that one, who stated to send the emails correspondence across over to them between me and this company, they'll review the communication and send them a letter across, would be a number of hours and overall cost would be about 1k, there's no guarantee this may work to be recompensated though they may sit up and take note from a legal firm..

    Anyway.. this isn't your average gambling website, like a bookies, sadly as no action has been taken against them yet I need to limit exactly what I say to limit my identity being exposed and the website in question..

    Anyway early 2015, I played on this website with real money and won, a lot of money, just under 50,000 worth.
    Originally posted by DillyDee
    I have highlighted in red where caution should have been exercised. I stopped reading when you should have stopped!
    Commemorate Celebrate Inspire
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    • DillyDee
    • By DillyDee 11th May 18, 12:36 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    DillyDee
    I can!!!8217;t respond to you all individually as the quote button isn!!!8217;t working on my site. Thanks for your responses and most notably Wesleyan and soolin.

    Yes I agree at the end of the day, I made that decision to part with my money and yes I would of been in the same position as I was before if I didn!!!8217;t win but, I feel like I!!!8217;ve been taken advantage of.

    I was naive to believe the account managers words that was documented throughout various email conversations that he had a number of winners who had won playing through him, each time I played through him, he sent me diagrams on what he thought the results would end up being, I then followed his recommendations - these results after each play which are decided by a set humans and not software all ended up being well off the mark.

    Surely the accounts manager/the company knew his arrangements was totally wrong hence why they swiftly put this to bed after the backlash they received from other players who found out of the arrangement this account manager had with a number of players.

    They work hard to prove people this is an open and legit competition and whilst it is as I!!!8217;ve won and a number of other people have won, I don!!!8217;t think the accounts manager should of gone there in the first place contacting someone who!!!8217;s won asking if they wanting to continue to play through them, it!!!8217;s wrong.

    It!!!8217;s not like they are loss makers, they make I assume easily triple the prize giveaway costs each time the competition is played.

    I don!!!8217;t need to speak to a charity in regards to my gamabling addiction, I have stopped gamabling huge amounts, I haven!!!8217;t been sensible obviously here, but I am sensible in the case that I haven!!!8217;t used credit cards that I have in my possession to gamble, I have essentially gambled what!!!8217;s in my current account.

    I would be happy to get back 10,000 of my winnings back from them, this may sound naive but this amount is a drop in the ocean to them.

    The communication between me and the accounts manager stating he has helped a number of players who have played through him seems like a massive conflict of interest to me and surely this information being widely put out in the public of players who play this game is something they wouldn!!!8217;t want to be known.

    Like I said I acknowledge it was my fault I didn!!!8217;t have a gun sticked to my head but I just feel the accounts manager shouldn!!!8217;t of gone there.

    Had he not mention how he!!!8217;s had a number of winners or showed me diagrams predicting the result, or had I played on the website myself then I would say yes, this is totally on me.
    • waamo
    • By waamo 11th May 18, 12:50 PM
    • 3,180 Posts
    • 4,207 Thanks
    waamo
    To sue for anything over 10k (which this would be when costs and interest is added) can be eye wateringly expensive.

    Over 10k means you could be liable for the other parties expenses if you lose. They will undoubtedly hire expensive lawyers for that kind of money which you could be liable for.

    I think you need to consider if you feel your case is strong or not and could you afford to lose?
    This space for hire.
    • DillyDee
    • By DillyDee 11th May 18, 12:58 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    DillyDee
    Hi Waamo thanks for your response.

    Yes I have been reading up about this, I think small claims court for the max limit of 10k would be very cheap to file.

    Anything else is up to a limit there!!!8217;s 25k, then another stage of over 25,000 which takes a year or so to get to court..

    If I!!!8217;m honest, it would be nice to recoup all my losses but it would be hard as it!!!8217;s not like I!!!8217;ve spent 50,000 back on their website only approx 15,000..

    I!!!8217;d be happy with 10,000 back it would bring some sort of closure. I plan on sitting down and sending an email to their accounts manager (not the one I played through this) and just let that person know how I feel and show them the screenshots of the conversations through the other account manager stating how he stated he had got a number of winners by playing through him and I naively fell for this when ultimately he didn!!!8217;t make the decisions that counted - As in me winning.. I followed his diagrams on strategy when playing and they were well off the mark.

    I guess it!!!8217;sworth a try, they can either tell me to do one, or willing to recompensate me for some of my losses.

    Personally I think the conversations are damaging to their business, one that they work hard to prove people wrong and that they are open and legit and not a scam, they are not a scam but it!!!8217;s clear they operate dubiously in the sense of taking advantage of players when they knew or should I say the account manager, was wrong to do.
    Last edited by DillyDee; 11-05-2018 at 1:02 PM.
    • reason2
    • By reason2 11th May 18, 1:18 PM
    • 230 Posts
    • 229 Thanks
    reason2
    Its notoriously difficult to get money back from gambling due to the terms and conditions and nature of the game.

    i have had a few refunds in my time when i had a problem, but this was because i was a self excluded customer and they still let me log in and bet.

    this to me sounds like you just didnt get lucky again and got betters remorse, which unfortunately happens and isnt refundable
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 11th May 18, 1:57 PM
    • 1,842 Posts
    • 2,484 Thanks
    Aylesbury Duck
    I'm pleased that you don't have a gambling problem, however, you mentioned feeling suicidal so there is still an issue there that requires professional help.

    I still don't understand your reasoning.
    If I'm honest, it would be nice to recoup all my losses
    You haven't lost anything!
    I'd be happy with 10,000 back it would bring some sort of closure
    I bet it would! But you're using the wrong terminology. It's not 10,000 'back'. You are in the same position you were in when you started this whole process! If they were to give you 10,000, you'd be up - 10k richer than when you started. How on earth is that justified?

    You talk as if gambling should be a one-way process where any gains you make have been rightfully earned, yet consequent losses are someone else's fault.

    I am genuinely glad you're not a gambling addict. You are, however, delusional. You do need to seek help because by your own admission, you feel low and suicidal and hopefully professional help will assist in coming to terms with the whole scenario which thankfully, hasn't resulted in you losing any money at all. It could have ended up so differently.
    Last edited by Aylesbury Duck; 11-05-2018 at 2:08 PM.
    Please forgive the deliberate omission of apostrophes on some posts whilst I await MSE to do something about the daft codes that appear in their place when typing on certain devices.
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 11th May 18, 2:23 PM
    • 3,526 Posts
    • 2,707 Thanks
    AndyPix
    I dont understand how you can gamble, through an account manager employed by the firm you are gambling with - who gives you tips to win ..


    It doesnt make sense - what would the account manager gaining out of this ?
    Was he promised a share of the spoils by you ?


    If not then it's obviously in his best interest that you lose


    confused
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • bris
    • By bris 11th May 18, 2:49 PM
    • 7,582 Posts
    • 6,600 Thanks
    bris
    So basically If your not a troll and this is no a copy and paste (its a bit long winded tbh), you got in with a guy who claimed to have insider information and you thought great I can cheat my way to a fortune.


    You can see why you would never have a case right? it's basically fraud, you would be shooting yourself in the foot.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 11th May 18, 2:55 PM
    • 2,522 Posts
    • 4,023 Thanks
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    I dont understand how you can gamble, through an account manager employed by the firm you are gambling with - who gives you tips to win ..


    It doesnt make sense - what would the account manager gaining out of this ?
    Was he promised a share of the spoils by you ?


    If not then it's obviously in his best interest that you lose


    confused
    Originally posted by AndyPix
    I think...and I stress, think, it's so rambling it's very unclear - that it's more a "somebody has to win" kind of thing - every week some of the the people who pay in get back a percentage of the total. So it doesn't matter to the company who that is.

    Therefore by telling people he had a scheme that would make it more likely for them to win, they paid in more and increased the pot. Even if the OP won 5K every week for a 5 stake, it was better for the company to have their 5 than not, as someone else was getting the 5K if it wasn't them. Encouraging people to spend is the important thing.

    It's all very bizarre though. And of course, the "inside information" was nothing of the kind. What the OP claims happened is surely illegal.
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