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  • FIRST POST
    • RedRuby
    • By RedRuby 10th May 18, 2:28 PM
    • 98Posts
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    RedRuby
    Why aren't properties advertised with all the key facts?
    • #1
    • 10th May 18, 2:28 PM
    Why aren't properties advertised with all the key facts? 10th May 18 at 2:28 PM
    After coming off of a sale falling through, I'm tentatively dipping my toe in the market again.

    This time I'm much more wary when looking at properties online and its really annoying me that a lot of properties are marketed without the relevant facts displayed.

    I think it should be mandatory for marketed properties to display

    If they are freehold or leasehold

    If leasehold, how long the lease is and the number of years remaining.

    How much the service charges are

    How much the ground rent is

    Council tax band

    A floorplan with detailed measurements

    What floor the property is on

    The number of ads I've seen where this basic information isn't listed or they are awaiting this information is ridiculous. It just makes it easier all round if this information is displayed prominently so I can assess if it is suitable.
Page 1
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 10th May 18, 2:39 PM
    • 2,671 Posts
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    ReadingTim
    • #2
    • 10th May 18, 2:39 PM
    • #2
    • 10th May 18, 2:39 PM
    Because property adverts are just that - adverts. Sales literature designed to highlight the positives of a product, not its negatives. Furthermore, whilst there are regulations etc as to the inclusion of information which is inaccurate or misleading, there is nothing similar relating to the omission of said information.

    You seem to think that what's best for the buyer is best for the seller - that's not always the case.
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 10th May 18, 2:48 PM
    • 20,164 Posts
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    agrinnall
    • #3
    • 10th May 18, 2:48 PM
    • #3
    • 10th May 18, 2:48 PM
    Because there's no such thing as the property advertising police to enforce such rules, and even if there was why should it be your list of rules that is enforced rather than somebody else's? As the prospective purchase it is in your interests to do your own due diligence.
    • NaughtiusMaximus
    • By NaughtiusMaximus 10th May 18, 2:49 PM
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    NaughtiusMaximus
    • #4
    • 10th May 18, 2:49 PM
    • #4
    • 10th May 18, 2:49 PM
    IMO EAs are shooting themselves in the foot when the omit basic info like this.

    When we came to sell our house last year, one of the main criteria we used in reducing the myriad of available EAs down to a shortlist of 3 or 4 from which to get a quote was the quality of their existing and recent listings.
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 10th May 18, 2:57 PM
    • 2,671 Posts
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    ReadingTim
    • #5
    • 10th May 18, 2:57 PM
    • #5
    • 10th May 18, 2:57 PM
    IMO EAs are shooting themselves in the foot when the omit basic info like this.
    Originally posted by NaughtiusMaximus
    In which case, you don't understand the role of an agent.

    Whilst an EA can draft a property ad, only the vendor can approve it. Furthermore, in many cases (eg length of lease) only the vendors know the information anyway. An agent can request info and suggest it's included, but if the vendor doesn't know it or fails to supply it, and is happy with what someone might regard as a substandard or incomplete advertisement, then the fault lies squarely and completely with that vendor, not their agent.
    Last edited by ReadingTim; 10-05-2018 at 3:01 PM.
    • dunroving
    • By dunroving 10th May 18, 2:59 PM
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    dunroving
    • #6
    • 10th May 18, 2:59 PM
    • #6
    • 10th May 18, 2:59 PM
    It is frustrating that basic information such as a floor plan aren't provided but consider how much easier it is now that just 10 years ago, and especially compared to 20 years ago. At least these days you have tools like Google Maps and Streetview, and online photos. In the old days you could drive miles to a viewing and as you drive up to the house, be thinking, "Oh, cr*p", whereas now you can eliminate the "oh, cr*p" ones a lot earlier and easier.

    So, things could be a lot worse, and we should be thankful for small mercies.
    (Nearly) dunroving
    • NaughtiusMaximus
    • By NaughtiusMaximus 10th May 18, 3:24 PM
    • 706 Posts
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    NaughtiusMaximus
    • #7
    • 10th May 18, 3:24 PM
    • #7
    • 10th May 18, 3:24 PM
    In which case, you don't understand the role of an agent.

    Whilst an EA can draft a property ad, only the vendor can approve it. Furthermore, in many cases (eg length of lease) only the vendors know the information anyway. An agent can request info and suggest it's included, but if the vendor doesn't know it or fails to supply it, and is happy with what someone might regard as a substandard or incomplete advertisement, then the fault lies squarely and completely with that vendor, not their agent.
    Originally posted by ReadingTim
    Unless they have an uncooperative vendor, a competent EA would not draft a substandard or incomplete advertisement in the first place.

    I accept there are some vendors who would choose not to state if a property is freehold or leasehold and if the latter may not want to disclose on the listing the length of the remaining lease or details of charges/fees. There are possibly also a few who may refuse to allow an EA to take measurements, take photos of every room or produce a floorplan but when the vast majority of their listings omit these details, the only logical conclusion is the EA aren't asking the vendor for this at all.
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 10th May 18, 3:42 PM
    • 15,633 Posts
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    • #8
    • 10th May 18, 3:42 PM
    • #8
    • 10th May 18, 3:42 PM
    I can only agree that these items should be there listed clearly right at the outset.

    Why waste anyone's time having to find out such basic stuff?

    It is beyond time the Government legislated on minimum standards of what must be stated at the outset.

    Otherwise - if nothing is said about any of these details, then obviously the buyer "knows" the property is freehold, in a standard (ie Council-maintained) road, no service charges, etc - as they haven't been told otherwise and so therefore will assume The Norm applies.
    WAY TO GO IRELAND! - WELCOME TO THE 21ST CENTURY

    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 10th May 18, 3:45 PM
    • 2,671 Posts
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    ReadingTim
    • #9
    • 10th May 18, 3:45 PM
    • #9
    • 10th May 18, 3:45 PM
    Unless they have an uncooperative vendor, a competent EA would not draft a substandard or incomplete advertisement in the first place.

    I accept there are some vendors who would choose not to state if a property is freehold or leasehold and if the latter may not want to disclose on the listing the length of the remaining lease or details of charges/fees. There are possibly also a few who may refuse to allow an EA to take measurements, take photos of every room or produce a floorplan but when the vast majority of their listings omit these details, the only logical conclusion is the EA aren't asking the vendor for this at all.
    Originally posted by NaughtiusMaximus
    No mate, the only logical conclusion is that you're completely unaware of the principle of caveat emptor.
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 10th May 18, 3:46 PM
    • 4,372 Posts
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    Cakeguts
    If the seller is a relative of an old person they might not know if it was leasehold or freehold or which council tax band it was in. I wouldn't have been able to tell you any of that if I had been selling an aunt's house or my grandmother's house all the information would be sorted out in the searches.
    • RedRuby
    • By RedRuby 10th May 18, 3:55 PM
    • 98 Posts
    • 70 Thanks
    RedRuby
    ReadingTim
    Because property adverts are just that - adverts. Sales literature designed to highlight the positives of a product, not its negatives. Furthermore, whilst there are regulations etc as to the inclusion of information which is inaccurate or misleading, there is nothing similar relating to the omission of said information.

    You seem to think that what's best for the buyer is best for the seller - that's not always the case.

    I'm not asking for a list of subjective faults about the property that the seller would want to hide. Just facts that will will be asked for anyway. Facts that would be best for both parties to know, that way the seller won't get any time wasters and the buyer won't waste time inquiring about an unsuitable property.

    agrinnall
    Because there's no such thing as the property advertising police to enforce such rules, and even if there was why should it be your list of rules that is enforced rather than somebody else's? As the prospective purchase it is in your interests to do your own due diligence.

    A property sale is in the interests of all parties involve. The seller wants to sell , the buyer wants to buy and the EA gets commission for the sale. Its in everyone's interest to lay all the facts on the table. If you are selling a property then guess what its time to dig out all the paperwork and information from when you bought and say how long the lease is, how much your service charge is, buildings insurance etc. These are things you can't hide if you truly want a sale so why omit them?

    Estate Agents when they are advertising a property surely ask for the details of the property, 'earn' their fee and commission by doing a floorplan taking photos etc. They want a sale to go through so why wouldn't they market it fully. If they omit details, they just end up with people calling and asking these questions and not bothering to view.


    Last edited by RedRuby; 10-05-2018 at 4:11 PM. Reason: spelling
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 10th May 18, 4:05 PM
    • 7,685 Posts
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    davidmcn
    If the seller is a relative of an old person they might not know if it was leasehold or freehold or which council tax band it was in.
    Originally posted by Cakeguts
    Well, how would they even know who the owner was? It's not too much to expect the sellers to make a cursory glance at the title before putting the property on the market, surely?

    And council tax bands are freely available online anyway:

    https://www.gov.uk/council-tax-bands
    • verybigchris
    • By verybigchris 10th May 18, 4:07 PM
    • 417 Posts
    • 556 Thanks
    verybigchris
    I love shoddy, incomplete listings: they keep the number of rival bidders down to a minimum.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 10th May 18, 4:09 PM
    • 17,395 Posts
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    AdrianC
    It is beyond time the Government legislated on minimum standards of what must be stated at the outset.
    Originally posted by moneyistooshorttomention
    Perhaps there should be some kind of Home Information Pack required by law...?



    Nah, it'll never happen.


    What's that, Skippy?


    Oh, yeh. They were brought in in 2004, canned after the 2010 election, then there was talk of their resurrection after the 2015 election... then the referendum happened, the government changed, and it all sort of got buried under the weight of brexit.
    • Quizzical Squirrel
    • By Quizzical Squirrel 10th May 18, 4:22 PM
    • 170 Posts
    • 4,574 Thanks
    Quizzical Squirrel
    As mentioned above, from the estate agent's point of view: the more the buyer is given then the more reasons for dismissing the property.
    Adverts are a teaser.

    It's certainly better for the buyers to get more information on everything not just freehold status. e.g. it's ridiculous trying to assess the liveable size of a house from the number of bedrooms.
    Better for buyers but not for sellers.
    And the sellers are the ones paying the piper.

    In my area you do get all the details and I've use them to instantly discount houses myself.
    I could say I'm not even going to look at anything less than 4000 square feet, filter those out of the search.
    But I've seen a 3600sq ft house with a really good workable layout and recently rented a 5800 that was very cramped because of its poor design.
    All the facts did in these cases was blinker me.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 10th May 18, 4:29 PM
    • 17,395 Posts
    • 15,762 Thanks
    AdrianC
    I could say I'm not even going to look at anything less than 4000 square feet, filter those out of the search.
    But I've seen a 3600sq ft house with a really good workable layout and recently rented a 5800 that was very cramped because of its poor design.
    Originally posted by Quizzical Squirrel
    What're "square feet", grandad?
    • cloo
    • By cloo 10th May 18, 4:31 PM
    • 1,038 Posts
    • 1,007 Thanks
    cloo
    I do think leasehold and length of leasehold really should be put on specs when relevant. The leasehold usually is declared, but you tend to have to dig around for length.
    • nyermen
    • By nyermen 10th May 18, 4:35 PM
    • 173 Posts
    • 130 Thanks
    nyermen
    I don't expect all information online, but I won't normally consider looking further at a house without a floorplan at least.

    There are some facts I wish they would mention though, eg. I saw a house last month which didn't think it important to mention the railway track right next to the house (no shelter / bank between). That's a deal breaker for me personally, and I could have saved the EA's time.
    Peter

    Debt free - finally finished paying off 20k + Interest.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 10th May 18, 4:35 PM
    • 12,114 Posts
    • 17,061 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    Perhaps there should be some kind of Home Information Pack required by law...?



    Nah, it'll never happen.


    What's that, Skippy?


    Oh, yeh. They were brought in in 2004, canned after the 2010 election, then there was talk of their resurrection after the 2015 election... then the referendum happened, the government changed, and it all sort of got buried under the weight of brexit.
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    I like the Home Reports in Scotland both as a buyer and a seller. You already know if the loft conversion is legit and have the valuation that a mortgage lender will go by before I either party gets too far along the process only to discover that the buyer is 10k short or that there is a lack of planning permission.
    • Tiglet2
    • By Tiglet2 10th May 18, 4:43 PM
    • 117 Posts
    • 89 Thanks
    Tiglet2
    Nyermen, while it might have been helpful to provide you with this information, surely if you'd looked at the property on Streetview, you would have seen the railway line?

    I do agree that more information regarding leasehold/freehold and the length of the lease and/or approximate service charges/ground rent fees would be helpful, but the EA can only rely on the vendor's information. Personally, I would like to see this type of information at the outset, before spending on searches and surveys. Perhaps all vendors should obtain copies of their title deeds to be made available at the EA for viewing by potential purchasers, along with copies of a council tax statement/utility bill - could always blank out vendor's name on these documents.
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