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  • FIRST POST
    • Lostgirl1234
    • By Lostgirl1234 9th Jan 18, 7:23 PM
    • 6Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Lostgirl1234
    Intestate Estate
    • #1
    • 9th Jan 18, 7:23 PM
    Intestate Estate 9th Jan 18 at 7:23 PM
    Hello, I was wondering if anyone could offer some advice? My aunt passed away leaving an intestate estate. She was never married or had any children and both grandparents also passed away many years ago. My father would ordinarily be NOK through intestacy succession, however he has been missing for over 10 years. Frequent professional traces have found nothing. I wondered if I will encounter issues applying for a Grant if Representation given I have no death certificate for my father, although do strongly believe he is no longer with us. We just want to be able settle my aunts affairs. Thanks in advance
    Last edited by Lostgirl1234; 09-01-2018 at 7:37 PM.
Page 1
    • Yorkshireman99
    • By Yorkshireman99 9th Jan 18, 7:43 PM
    • 4,246 Posts
    • 3,469 Thanks
    Yorkshireman99
    • #2
    • 9th Jan 18, 7:43 PM
    • #2
    • 9th Jan 18, 7:43 PM
    Hello, I was wondering if anyone could offer some advice? My aunt passed away leaving an intestate estate. She was never married or had any children and both grandparents also passed away many years ago. My father would ordinarily be NOK through intestacy succession, however he has been missing for over 10 years. Frequent professional traces have found nothing. I wondered if I will encounter issues applying for a Grant if Representation given I have no death certificate for my father, although do strongly believe he is no longer with us. We just want to be able settle my aunts affairs. Thanks in advance
    Originally posted by Lostgirl1234
    The chain of inheritance stretches further than siblings. You cannot just assume that your father is dead. That would have to be determined by application toi the court that is time consuming and costly. Not a DIY job. If you apply for LOA you still can't distribute the estate unless you can establish those entitled under intestacy. Did your aunt have any other siblings?
    • Lostgirl1234
    • By Lostgirl1234 9th Jan 18, 7:59 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Lostgirl1234
    • #3
    • 9th Jan 18, 7:59 PM
    • #3
    • 9th Jan 18, 7:59 PM
    No, she didn!!!8217;t have any other siblings, only my father and I!!!8217;m an only child. I appreciate, I can!!!8217;t assume my father has passed but there is literally no trace of him at al and there has been no contact over the past 10 years, which is extremely unlike him. I have looked at court proceedings in relation to Presumption of Death Orders, however as you state, they are very costly. I!!!8217;ve instructed a significant number of traces by professional agencies but nothing is turning up at all. It!!!8217;s quite a difficult situation. I was thinking, given the circumstances, about instructing a solicitor to support if the Probate Office were not in agreement with my application. I wasn!!!8217;t sure if succession rules (to allow for grant of rep) can be challenged in certain circumstances?
    • Yorkshireman99
    • By Yorkshireman99 9th Jan 18, 8:34 PM
    • 4,246 Posts
    • 3,469 Thanks
    Yorkshireman99
    • #4
    • 9th Jan 18, 8:34 PM
    • #4
    • 9th Jan 18, 8:34 PM
    No, she didn!!!8217;t have any other siblings, only my father and I!!!8217;m an only child. I appreciate, I can!!!8217;t assume my father has passed but there is literally no trace of him at al and there has been no contact over the past 10 years, which is extremely unlike him. I have looked at court proceedings in relation to Presumption of Death Orders, however as you state, they are very costly. I!!!8217;ve instructed a significant number of traces by professional agencies but nothing is turning up at all. It!!!8217;s quite a difficult situation. I was thinking, given the circumstances, about instructing a solicitor to support if the Probate Office were not in agreement with my application. I wasn!!!8217;t sure if succession rules (to allow for grant of rep) can be challenged in certain circumstances?
    Originally posted by Lostgirl1234
    Since you are the only living blood relation then nobody is going to challenge it. What you do after the grant is up to you. Of course if your father does reappear then you would be liable.
    • Lostgirl1234
    • By Lostgirl1234 9th Jan 18, 8:48 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Lostgirl1234
    • #5
    • 9th Jan 18, 8:48 PM
    • #5
    • 9th Jan 18, 8:48 PM
    Thanks for your advice. Iíve never dealt with any probate issues before so am quite clueless about what needs to be done, albeit from what I have read, this case is probably not straightforward. Itís not been the greatest situation; losing my aunt and then revisiting my fathers disappearance at the same time. I think Iíll see what response I receive from the Probate Registry and decide from there
    • Yorkshireman99
    • By Yorkshireman99 9th Jan 18, 8:57 PM
    • 4,246 Posts
    • 3,469 Thanks
    Yorkshireman99
    • #6
    • 9th Jan 18, 8:57 PM
    • #6
    • 9th Jan 18, 8:57 PM
    Thanks for your advice. I!!!8217;ve never dealt with any probate issues before so am quite clueless about what needs to be done, albeit from what I have read, this case is probably not straightforward. It!!!8217;s not been the greatest situation; losing my aunt and then revisiting my fathers disappearance at the same time. I think I!!!8217;ll see what response I receive from the Probate Registry and decide from there
    Originally posted by Lostgirl1234
    It might be best not to tell them! They will expect you to go the legal route but on this occasion it does not seem sensible.
    Last edited by Yorkshireman99; 10-01-2018 at 6:49 AM.
    • Tom99
    • By Tom99 10th Jan 18, 6:39 AM
    • 2,241 Posts
    • 1,520 Thanks
    Tom99
    • #7
    • 10th Jan 18, 6:39 AM
    • #7
    • 10th Jan 18, 6:39 AM
    You will however have to state on the probate form whether your father is alive or dead.
    • Lostgirl1234
    • By Lostgirl1234 10th Jan 18, 6:51 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Lostgirl1234
    • #8
    • 10th Jan 18, 6:51 PM
    • #8
    • 10th Jan 18, 6:51 PM
    Iíve written a lengthy letter explaining the situation. Iíd rather keep myself right and not get into trouble. Iíll see what response I get and take it from there. Thank you for all the advice !!!128077;
    • Keep pedalling
    • By Keep pedalling 10th Jan 18, 7:24 PM
    • 5,094 Posts
    • 5,680 Thanks
    Keep pedalling
    • #9
    • 10th Jan 18, 7:24 PM
    • #9
    • 10th Jan 18, 7:24 PM
    I think the first thing i would be doing is to see if i could find a record of his death.
    • nom de plume
    • By nom de plume 11th Jan 18, 9:58 AM
    • 695 Posts
    • 646 Thanks
    nom de plume
    It may be worth approaching a couple of specialist insurers in the field of missing beneficiaries. If nothing else you may pick up a few tips. https://www.angliaresearch.co.uk/for-solicitors/missing-beneficiary-indemnity-insurance/

    Have any of the searches looked at DVLA, HMRC, Passport Office and etc. records? I have no idea how an individual would go about getting access to information held on a 3rd party although the Police should presumably be able to do so.
    • eddyinfreehold
    • By eddyinfreehold 11th Jan 18, 10:12 AM
    • 159 Posts
    • 118 Thanks
    eddyinfreehold
    If your father is registered with the Police as a missing person you could check back with them about all the usual id documents: passport, driving licence, benefits, national insurance number, death certificate etc. It would for them be a simple search if he is using his own name. If he is alive in this country it is very unlikely he is living on fresh air.

    It is also worth noting that the Salvation Army have a very good missing persons tracing service, both in the UK and overseas. Well worth asking them too:

    https://www.salvationarmy.org.uk/reuniting-families
    • Keep pedalling
    • By Keep pedalling 11th Jan 18, 11:00 AM
    • 5,094 Posts
    • 5,680 Thanks
    Keep pedalling
    If your father is registered with the Police as a missing person you could check back with them about all the usual id documents: passport, driving licence, benefits, national insurance number, death certificate etc. It would for them be a simple search if he is using his own name. If he is alive in this country it is very unlikely he is living on fresh air.

    It is also worth noting that the Salvation Army have a very good missing persons tracing service, both in the UK and overseas. Well worth asking them too:

    https://www.salvationarmy.org.uk/reuniting-families
    Originally posted by eddyinfreehold
    I was going to suggest the SA but their terms do state the following.

    When we can!!!8217;t help:

    When adoption has taken place
    We cannot search for children under 18 or other !!!8216;vulnerable!!!8217; missing people, where a physical search or police involvement would be more appropriate
    We cannot search for !!!8216;possible!!!8217; relatives or friends
    We cannot conduct searches for estate, legal or other business purposes
    • Brighty
    • By Brighty 11th Jan 18, 11:34 AM
    • 739 Posts
    • 382 Thanks
    Brighty
    I don't think you'll have much trouble getting the LOA, the problem is what do you do with the money once you have it all. Under intestacy, your father inherits her estate, so do you hold onto it forever hoping he'll reappear? Even if you assume he has already died, you can't assume you inherit in his place, as he could theoretically of had more children in the last 10yrs who would be entitled to an equal share
    • Lostgirl1234
    • By Lostgirl1234 11th Jan 18, 11:52 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Lostgirl1234
    Thanks all. I!!!8217;m not sure what sources the tracing agencies have used, however they did all say they were conducting robust searches (ive used various companies over the years). One did make mention of financial/credit related info but there was no trace of any accounts apparently and no electoral roll records. I haven!!!8217;t tried SA, however, prior to this probate issue arising, I did liaise with the Red Cross a number of years ago but they were unable to trace either. I made contact with DWP a few years back in relation to my fathers pension to check if it was still being paid (he would be 80 now if still alive) but they would not entertain any discussion citing DPA; I also was unable to provide his NI number. I!!!8217;ve also checked online as much as I can in relation to death certs but can find nothing, however online sources only appear to go up to 2005. I did contact the registry service but they were unable to provide info on name and DOB alone; I apparently would need to visit each locality and ask permission to view records but that would be a hefty undertaking and isn!!!8217;t feasible. I can!!!8217;t think of any other things to try at the moment. That said I will look at getting some advice from insurers as mentioned above.
    • Savvy_Sue
    • By Savvy_Sue 11th Jan 18, 11:58 PM
    • 38,615 Posts
    • 35,341 Thanks
    Savvy_Sue
    I think the first thing i would be doing is to see if i could find a record of his death.
    Originally posted by Keep pedalling
    Is that not the first thing any tracing service would do?
    Still knitting!
    Completed: 1 adult cardigan, 3 baby jumpers, 3 shawls, 1 sweat band, 3 pairs baby bootees,
    1 Wise Man Knitivity figure + 1 sheep, 2 pairs socks, 2 hats 2 balaclavas for seamen, 1 balaclava for myself ...
    Current projects: Poppies, mohair cardigan pattern arrived and going strong!
    • Lostgirl1234
    • By Lostgirl1234 12th Jan 18, 12:13 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Lostgirl1234
    They told me they had as well as looking for any records of marriages too but nothing recordered that they could find. I have also looked too but itís constantly a dead end.
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