OH attitude towards money/debt

little_green · 28 May 2019 at 8:50PM

have posted this in a seperate thread on the debt section seeking advice but also posting here bc of the toll it's taking on my relationship. As stated below my OH is just bury your head in the sand type. They have taken little action in regards to resolving this. Whenever I mention it the response is something along the lines of "don't start with that now unless you want to start an arguement" "i said i'm dealing with it so let it be". OH did say if worst comes to worst they would just pay it & don't get me wrong it's not a huge amount so would be manageable but what concerns me is where this alleged debt has come from. If we were to pay it who's to say we wont get another similar bill later down the line. I mean there is obviously something dodgy going on with the account, shouldnt OH want to resolve that?
And it's not just this. I guess that's what bothers me most. Their attitude to money is appalling & they do have significant other debt (debt that is actually theirs & we know where it's from/why). Whereas myself (clearly as a member of this forum!) try to be more disciplined with money. I'm tired of arguing over the "make small sacrifices now & we can have a better life in the future" ... i feel OH should be able to see that by themselves.

posted a thread back in april re other half getting back details stolen - basically 3 x unauthorized payments of varying amounts were taken from their bank account. On the statement it showed as Paypal followed by retailer (cdkeys & kerrymaid). However on paypal under account activity/summary the transactions did not appear.
Upon realizing what had happened my OH immediately closed the paypal account (not sure why) & contacted them asking to investigate. A response was never received. The paypal account was linked to my OH debit card hence the money was taken form that account.

It was also reported to the bank who investigated reimbursed the money (hence i assume confimed they were fraudulent). The original debit card was cancelled/blocked & a replacement sent out.

A few days ago OH has received a letter to the home address from ARC Europe.
It states: "this account has been passed to us as our client, Paypayl, has been unable to obtain payment of the above balance from you.
Clearing the balance will life the limitations our client has applied so you continue using your paypal account.
If we don not hear from you within the next 14 days we will obtain our clients further instructions on the recovery of this debt. We therefore urge you as soon as possible to discuss your account."

I am deeply concerned OH is very much bury your head in the sand type & doesn't seem the least bit phased by this., meanwhile i'm freaking out & imagining a cant pay take it away type situation.
OH has reactivated their paypal account & we have been in contact with them via paypal messages asking for clarity however they keep encouraging us to phone & i'm keen to keep a paper trail. They have said they dont know why it would have been sent to the debt collectors as there has never been any transaction on the account.
We have emailed ARC europe advising of the situation however have not had a response.

I'm also worried that IF the debt has been accrued it's clearly by someone else (hence fraud) ... what's the stop them continuing to carry out transactions & accruing more debt?

Have also spoke the bank but they say to deal with paypal direct. I thought they might be able to help since they confirmed fraudulent activity on the account. Couldnt they liaise with paypal given they have proof?

BrassicWoman · 28 May 2019 at 9:37PM

that letter seems barely literate - might be a scammer!

little_green · 28 May 2019 at 9:59PM

BrassicWoman wrote: »

that letter seems barely literate - might be a scammer!

I've edited it down and the typos are my own.
Word for word it states:

Dear X
This account has been passed to us as our client, PayPal, has been unable to obtain payment of the above balance from you.
Benefits of bringing your PayPal back to order.
Clearing the balance will lift the limitations our client has applied to you so you can continue using your PayPal account. You will then be able to close your PayPal account,add or remove finding sources, send or receive money.
What should I do next?
You can secure payment to use 24 hours a day with you debit or credit card by visiting our website https://www.arceurope.co.uk/customer or by calling our automated payment hotline 01342 647693. For details of all payment methods please see the back of this letter. Alternatively please contact our dedicated customer support team on 01932 251300 to discuss your payment proposals.
What if I cannot pay immediately, should I still contact you?
Yes, our customer support team will fully consider your circumstances on order to work with you towards a satisfactory resolution.
What if I do not contact you.
If we do not contact you within the next 14 days, we will obtain our client's further instructions on the recovery of this debt. We therefore urge you to contact us as soon as possible to discuss your account.
Your sincerely
ARC EUROPE LTD

How would they have got the home address?
Also seems strange that there was fraudulent activity on the bank account linked to PayPal and now this hence made me thought it might be genuine. The company appear to be a legit company.

Les79 · 28 May 2019 at 10:21PM

little_green wrote: »

Their attitude to money is appalling & they do have significant other debt (debt that is actually theirs & we know where it's from/why). Whereas myself (clearly as a member of this forum!) try to be more disciplined with money. I'm tired of arguing over the "make small sacrifices now & we can have a better life in the future" ... i feel OH should be able to see that by themselves.

I think there's two things to bring up in regard to this bit:

1. He's not really obliged to live his life your way. There's nothing wrong with spending more in leiu of saving; many people in this world do that (some do it to excess though). Did you not know what you were signing up for when you got married?

2. There does seem to be a "do it to excess" element here though. What are the reasons for his debt? Overindulging (food/luxuries)? Drug/alcohol/gambling addiction? Depending on the answer, there are probably different ways to approach this. Ultimately, there does seem to be something underlying issue here (even if just poor money management skills) which is causing him to deviate too far from point 1. above. Probably needs addressing above anything else.

God knows what's going on with Paypal, but the following link advises where you MIGHT find the info:

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/Payments/CDkeys-is-taking-money-out-of-my-account/td-p/1691732

If it is linked to the cdkeys.com website then it is probably a code for a video game (www.cdkeys.com); though I'm not entirely sure this is the same seller. A fair chance it could be a fraudulent transaction, and if so a pain in the bum because once the code is emailed then the item cannot be returned.

That being said, if you have been refunded the lost money by the bank then where did the originally lost money end up? Surely that went to paying the seller/Paypal? Or did the bank reverse the transaction?

You can also consider contacting the police, to at least obtain a crime reference number.

unholyangel · 28 May 2019 at 11:00PM

If the charges were on his bank statement but not his paypal account, then (imo) the logical conclusion would be that it was made from a different paypal account.

Have you asked paypal if they can trace the payment if you provide the reference?

However as above, perhaps worth remembering you can't force people to be responsible adults.

little_green · 28 May 2019 at 11:08PM

Les79 wrote: »

I think there's two things to bring up in regard to this bit:

1. He's not really obliged to live his life your way. There's nothing wrong with spending more in leiu of saving; many people in this world do that (some do it to excess though). Did you not know what you were signing up for when you got married?

2. There does seem to be a "do it to excess" element here though. What are the reasons for his debt? Overindulging (food/luxuries)? Drug/alcohol/gambling addiction? Depending on the answer, there are probably different ways to approach this. Ultimately, there does seem to be something underlying issue here (even if just poor money management skills) which is causing him to deviate too far from point 1. above. Probably needs addressing above anything else.

it's probably poor money management more than anything or just plain old delusion. Debt is in relation to studying & taking out loans with stupid rates of interests (one was just over 30% !!!). Alcohol, dining out far too often though sheer laziness - that's another thing that infuriates me, mentality. Eg. If I dont make meals for whatever reason OH use's that as a reason to justify ordering takeout instead of just making something for themselves. It's a total lack of responsibility & i'm tired of it.

Les79 wrote: »

God knows what's going on with Paypal, but the following link advises where you MIGHT find the info:
https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/Payments/CDkeys-is-taking-money-out-of-my-account/td-p/1691732
If it is linked to the cdkeys.com website then it is probably a code for a video game (www.cdkeys.com); though I'm not entirely sure this is the same seller. A fair chance it could be a fraudulent transaction, and if so a pain in the bum because once the code is emailed then the item cannot be returned.

That being said, if you have been refunded the lost money by the bank then where did the originally lost money end up? Surely that went to paying the seller/Paypal? Or did the bank reverse the transaction?

You can also consider contacting the police, to at least obtain a crime reference number.

neither myself or OH has ever purchased anything via CD keys or any sort of gaming code. Again I remain confused as I don't understand why the transactions show up on the bank statement as paypal-retailer but not in transaction/summary on paypal. Due to this it's impossible to report/flag up the transactions via resolution center on paypal.

I dont even know if the money paypal is chasing for is in relation to the money that came out the account bc paypal have no clarified in relation to which transaction(s) the alleged debt is against. I'm only assuming there is some link. My thinking is for the money to have came out OH bank account the payment must have gone though, thus the company got their money & paypal got their money too (as it came out bank account to fund it). Bank reimbursed it hence their loss, not paypal's. All i can think is that someone placed more orders that got processed but when paypal went to take the money from the bank account it couldnt due to bank blocking the card after OH reporting the fraud. However, I use paypal quite often & from my understanding & knowing how things appear on my paypal account, if i had zero paypal balance & tried to pay via paypal to a card that was no longer active (or had insufficient funds) then i think the transaction would fail. Ie it happens in real time, there's no 24-48 hour delay.

Would reporting it to the police do any good?

little_green · 28 May 2019 at 11:12PM

unholyangel wrote: »

If the charges were on his bank statement but not his paypal account, then (imo) the logical conclusion would be that it was made from a different paypal account.

Have you asked paypal if they can trace the payment if you provide the reference?

However as above, perhaps worth remembering you can't force people to be responsible adults.

when you say different paypal account do you mean a paypal account set up by my OH that was also compromised? or one set up by someone else but using OH's details? & which details?
Bc paypal has passed the name of OH & our home address to the debt collector, hence if someone else set up an account they'd have to be using OH name & address.

We are asking paypal for further info but they seem reluctant to investigate.

OH attitude towards money/debt

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