Council Tax

loobs40 · 11 July 2005 at 1:44PM

Not quite sure which forum this goes in, but I'll start here.

My partner lives in a flat (he is a home owner and has a mortgage on it) in Wales where he is entitled to 25% discount on his council tax.

The intention is that he moves down to live with me in a few weeks time (I am the mortgage payer and I will lose my 25% discount as a result of him moving in) , so we wanted to know the council tax situation once he moved out. The flat would not be rented out and we would use it when we came up tp visit his family and children

We didn't know whether

a) situation would stay the same i.e 25% discount
b) He would benefit by paying only 50% (as used to be the way)
c) he would have to pay the full 100% whack

I emailed his local council to ask the question, briefly describing the situation (no names, no pack drill) and they replied saying they would love to help but first they want his name and address before they will answer !!!

All I wanted to know was the rules ! Now we are in a tricky situation in that if it turns out he has to pay 100% they will know who he is and be able to enforce it. We don't know whether we should just keep quiet and stay with the 25% discount as is, or would we be losing out because actually he is entitled to a bigger discount ?

Does anyone know if the rules are consistent accross the country for council tax and 'second homes' ?

Tony_H_3 · 11 July 2005 at 3:13PM

Unsure myself as to where this would be best placed I carried out a quick search of the forums and found that "Benefits, Tax Credits & Housing Benefit" yielded the most results.

I will therefore move this to that board leaving the redirect in place in order that you are able to find the answers to your post in it's new location.

Regards
Tony H
Board Guide - Budgeting & Current Accounts.

mancitychick · 11 July 2005 at 4:38PM

Not sure if it differs from council to council, but Selby (North Yorks) used to allow six months free then a 50% discount of the annual bill.

They have now changed this to just a 10% discount of the annual bill, for an unoccupied property.

Another point to bare in mind is the property has to be empty and unfurnished to receive the discount.

Also you cannot be exempted from your water rates, without the council tax exemption certificate - guess this stops you from claiming the bigger 25% single occupant discount!

Savvy_Sue · 11 July 2005 at 6:42PM

It may seem unhelpful of them not to answer the question without his name and address, but tbh I wouldn't risk not declaring the situation even if it left you out of pocket.

Another thing you need to watch out for is insurance on his (usually empty) property - some policies require it to be lived in or all the services turned off when it's not, and cover is reduced while it's not occupied, I believe.

hodgester · 11 July 2005 at 6:49PM

they will want to identify his sole or main residence. as the family home could reasonably be established as your address. Provided he confiirms to them that the new address is his 'family' home, that his belongings are kept there, that his personal post arrives there and that he is registered for gp and dental services in your neighbourhood then they would accept your address is his main home.

Phone them and ask them in general terms what their 'second home discount'' is. If they say 50% you're laughing. If they say 10% then leave it as is. As long as he doesn't tell them that he's moving then they will struggle very hard to prove that he is not solely or mainly resident elsewhere and the only reviews local authorities do for single person discounts is to send a letter every year or so confiirming that he is the only one resident. And to be fair most authorities struggle to keep on top of exemptions, SPD's are very low priority

Trust me, I'm a professional ! :cool:

loobs40 · 11 July 2005 at 7:34PM

On further investigation I find that there is no discount for a second home in his council area , primarily I think because the area is a tourist area, and I assume there are a lot of second homes there. I think we'll leave things as they are ;-)

Fran · 12 July 2005 at 11:27AM

The Citizens Advice website - Adviceguide has some info re council tax - I would suggest that he contacts his local CAB to find out defininitely what his situation would be. If you carry on as you are as you suggest, are you saying that you would carry on with the single person discount yourself even though he would be living there? Non payment of Council Tax can ultimately end up as a prison sentence so I would strongly advise you take a fully legal route on this. (And we shouldn't be suggesting anything illegal anyway on this site.)

loobs40 · 12 July 2005 at 3:21PM

I wasn't suggesting anything.

there are lots of things we can do that 'ultimately' can end up as a prison sentence. Don't you think you are being a bit melodramatic ?

irs101 · 12 July 2005 at 3:42PM

No, I don't think Fran is being melodramatic. The point is that we can all think of lots of illegal (or at least dodgy) ways of saving money, but this whole website is about legitimate ways of saving money.

On this board in particular, the stalwarts would only ever suggest things that are within the benefit/tax credit rules (and I have got a bit upset in the past when people have accused me of offering illegal or immoral advice

). While it would be difficult to hold any of us to the advice we offer here, I think we are morally obliged to advise you when you are considering doing something illegal & what the consequences could be - and that counts double on this board, because many people who come here are those who can least afford being hastled by the authorities.

irs

hodgester · 12 July 2005 at 6:27PM

luckily however the rules on sole or main residence are so complex and arbitary in there interpretation that there is nothing to stop you claiming rightfully that the welsh address is your partner's main home. If he keeps belongings there, confirms with the local authorities that he is moving elsewhere to work etc then it can still be classified as his main home. One of the questions the authority will ask is;

'if you cease work, or your commitments in that area of the country end, to where will you return?" If the answer is Wales then you friend would often be treated as being solely or mainly resident in Wales.

The thing that confuses so many people with Council Tax, as opposed to any benefits, is that there is far more 'scope' for interpretation in the legislation and case law. There is not, and never has been, a definitive interpretation of sole or main residence throughout our legal history, far pre-dating Council Tax.

I appreciate that nobody want to encourage people to 'break the law' but I would not advocate that. I would just recommend people to demonstrate those principles and definitions in law that highlight their interests. Most local authorities and I've worked in several interpret the law differently, even colleagues in the same office will interpret it differently. The legislation is not hard and fast like Benefit Legislation.

So worry not, and don't be afraid of 'prison' as someone suggests there, please. Prison is a last, last ditch form of penalty used at people accused of either of culapable neglect or wilful refusal. You'd have had to refuse to pay even after bailiffs have been round knocking on your door before you get to that stage and most magistrates won't touch commitals with a barge pole.

Council Tax

Comments

Categories

Get our FREE Weekly email full of deals & guides - and it’s spam-free