Help needed - First Direct charges

glasvegas12 · 5 February 2018 at 10:25PM

Hi everyone, firs time poster here - I need some advice about charges from First Direct, so thank you in advance!

I had a current account with them to have access to their regular saver. After a year, this ended. I transferred my money to my usual account, and thought that I had cancelled the outward standing order from my FD current account. Well, I obviously hadn't:( One month later, I get a call, a text and an email telling me I'm £1400 overdrawn and being fined at a rate of £5 a day, and have been for the past month, racking up £135 worth of charges overall. They claim that they sent me two texts a month ago, saying that I was about to go overdrawn, but I never received them. They did not try to call, email, send a letter, anything - just two measly texts for a whole month.

After speaking to multiple people at FD who have all been unhelpful, I am unable to get anywhere. My issue is the lack of contact. I know the origin sin is my own, managing my account somewhat incompetently, but if they had even sent me a letter in the post, 5 days later on receipt, the fine would be £25, which is certainly more palatable.

So; advice - is this worth pursuing with the ombudsman, or just leave it? Just one other thought - if FD had not allowed the payment, and had not 'offered' me the unauthorised overdraft, none of this would have happened. How do they get away with this blatant rip off?

eskbanker · 6 February 2018 at 1:06AM

I don't understand the figures - a standing order to fund their regular saver wouldn't be more than £300 per month and unauthorised overdraft charges (they're not fines btw) are capped at £80 per month, so if you neglected your account for a month the most you should be at is £380 overdrawn rather than £1400?

Most banks will permit accounts to go into unauthorised overdraft at their discretion, and many find it a useful facility rather than a 'blatant rip-off'.

However, read through the account Ts & Cs to see what they say about unauthorised overdrafts but I'd be surprised if there was anything in them that guaranteed that they'd contact you by other means beyond texts (and statements of course) - if they've breached their Ts & Cs then you'd have a case with the ombudsman (after following FD's own complaints process first) but if not then I doubt you'd get anywhere....

Superscrooge · 6 February 2018 at 8:35AM

I too am puzzled by your figures and explanation for the £1400 overdraft.

As eskbanker explained, fees are capped at £80 per month.

In addition whenever I have opened a First Direct Regular Saver, the standing order has been automatically set up as part of the opening process to make 12 monthly withdrawals. No further withdrawals have been made after the regular saver matures.

Are you sure there isn't some other withdrawal that has caused you to go £1400 overdrawn?

mrmajika · 6 February 2018 at 10:45AM

FD setup the standing order to their regular saver themselves. You can't amend it online, it's locked in. If the standing order hasn't been cancelled, then the error is with them.

You should follow their complaints process in the first instance. They should see the error of their ways. First tier telephone operatives have the ability to waive fees when there's errors or as goodwill gestures, subject to having not been charged by them previously. I'm surprised you've been met with such resistance.

[Deleted User] · 6 February 2018 at 11:06AM

glasvegas12 wrote: »

Hi everyone, firs time poster here - I need some advice about charges from First Direct, so thank you in advance!

I had a current account with them to have access to their regular saver. After a year, this ended. I transferred my money to my usual account, and thought that I had cancelled the outward standing order from my FD current account. Well, I obviously hadn't:( One month later, I get a call, a text and an email telling me I'm £1400 overdrawn and being fined at a rate of £5 a day, and have been for the past month, racking up £135 worth of charges overall. They claim that they sent me two texts a month ago, saying that I was about to go overdrawn, but I never received them. They did not try to call, email, send a letter, anything - just two measly texts for a whole month.

After speaking to multiple people at FD who have all been unhelpful, I am unable to get anywhere. My issue is the lack of contact. I know the origin sin is my own, managing my account somewhat incompetently, but if they had even sent me a letter in the post, 5 days later on receipt, the fine would be £25, which is certainly more palatable.

So; advice - is this worth pursuing with the ombudsman, or just leave it? Just one other thought - if FD had not allowed the payment, and had not 'offered' me the unauthorised overdraft, none of this would have happened. How do they get away with this blatant rip off?

Don't believe a word of it. Sorry.

WorldTraveller_2 · 6 February 2018 at 11:29AM

After the 12 monthly payments have come out to a regular saver account the account is then closed and the balance (plus interest) transferred to another First Direct account, normally a savings account (which they open for you if you haven't already got one). There would be no more payments from your bank account as you would have to set up another regular saver account to save for the next year - it's not automatic.

meer53 · 6 February 2018 at 2:29PM

Your post doesn't make sense. The standing order for a Regular Saver account is automatically cancelled after 12 payments have been made, it must be something else that made you overdrawn.

glasvegas12 · 6 February 2018 at 9:34PM

Hi, sorry to have have confused you with the figures.

When I opened it, I set up a transfer for 1000 across, then returning 700, and 300 into the regular saver. I cancelled the 1000 funding the account in December, but forgot to cancel the 700 leaving it. The regular saver sum I had already withdrawn.
The fees are capped at £80 in one month, but my fees straddled two months, hence they added up to £135.

The relevant clauses in the T&Cs, I can't copy and paste it...
- they will send a message on any day they agree an unarranged overdraft, or if there isn't enough money in your account to make payments you have asked to make
- regarding statements, it says whenever they charge fees they'll give details by updating information via online banking
- that they'll make payment out of the account if you ask them to, unless you don't have enough money in the account (and they don't agree an unarranged overdraft)
- they'll always give 14 days notice before taking any charges out of the account

I think they have only breached the last one, but they are all quite vague. Is there not a statutory duty to keep the customer informed of matters such as these? I don't think sending two flimsy text messages is a robust defense IMO.

YorkshireBoy · 6 February 2018 at 9:51PM

Didn't you notice the additional £1,400 (2 x £700, one in December and the other in January) in the destination account and wonder where it had come from? So that's two accounts you're not monitoring! Any more?

Whatever happens here at least you've learned a very valuable lesson.

But I still can't see £1,400. I can see a £1,535 O/D balance...but not £1,400...unless they haven't added the £135 yet, ie it's only notified at this stage.

If you didn't want text messages you should not have allowed them in your profile.

The fees are in line with their published tariff. However, you may have success through an apologetic secure message or letter asking for leniency. Maybe read any published 'fair fees policy' first.

meer53 · 6 February 2018 at 9:53PM

So they sent you an email, a text and called you ? You didn't get the first texts but got the second one ? I don't know what else you are expecting them to do ? Come round to have a quiet word ?

glasvegas12 · 6 February 2018 at 10:08PM

I got the royal service a month later when I had racked up £135 in fees. Prior to that, they say they sent two texts, but I didn't receive any.

(Incidentally, after being overdrawn for 31 days they do not continue to charge, so they made maximum sum off me, when looking at it cynically)

Help needed - First Direct charges

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