Solar ... In the news

Martyn1981 · 1 February 2016 at 3:07PM

Alan_Brown wrote: »

I was thinking about this over the weekend and was wondering if you were on mains gas and whether you'd thought of trying to go off-grid with that?

That was my thought regarding the CHP boiler, but from what I've read elsewhere, and Zeup has explained in detail on several threads on MSE, it's simply not a good enough balance (high heat, low leccy) at the moment.

When I checked my postcode on a wind checker it laughed at me, and since then I've chatted with off-gridders with wind, and it's not easy.

I like the idea/challenge of being off-grid (staying on gas) but it seems pretty hard. I might just be able to do it if I added 2kWp of SSW panels in the garden at a steep pitch (50 to 60d), plus a large batt, perhaps 40kWh lead acid ..... but ..... this is a money saving site, and whilst the idea appeals to me, the economics don't add up yet (and might never for me). The additional PV would work well in the GMT months with the sun mainly in the SE to SW, but would get a lot of shading in the BST months in the morning and evening - not a problem for me, as I have too much leccy then already, but it would be a little inefficient and that's something to ponder too when considering the bigger picture, and an economical solution for UK households.

Perhaps the long-term solution is staying on grid, supply side wind, storage (at all scales, domestic, industrial and grid) and an EV that supports the grid in the evening peak, but gets charged by the grid (ideally PV in the day or wind at night).

Mart.

zeupater · 1 February 2016 at 3:15PM

Alan_Brown wrote: »

I was thinking about this over the weekend and was wondering if you were on mains gas and whether you'd thought of trying to go off-grid with that?

For example, someone with a well insulated home with electric showers and air sourced heat pump technology, etc. who also had solar PV and an immersun device could move away from gas and go completely electric. Whether the savings on the gas standing charge vs the fact that gas is cheaper than electricity works out financially, is one point, but the other would be the potential that you coul dgo clean energy with your home, especially if you could add to your generation with additional solar or wind turbine.

Another potential for going off grid would be water. With a borehole providing drinking water with rainwater or greywater recycling and and a cesspit, you could go off grid.

It might cost you a little more to be off grid rather than on, but it'd be good to get away from the money grabbing utility companies.

Hi

We're extremely low grid-energy users, below 1000kWh/year for gas and a little more than that for electricity, obviously living in a highly thermally and energy efficient home which also includes solar pv and solar thermal whilst relying on a log-stove as the primary heat source, so fit your example pretty well. It wouldn't be that much expense and comparatively little effort for us to move off mains gas, it's just loss of convenience and not currently cost-viable ...

Both renewables and mCHP generation would be relatively low wattage, so you'd need a battery bank which could deliver power at a reasonable 'peak' rate, probably somewhere around 2kW-3kW would be in the right ball park for most which immediately strikes the electric shower off your list, but that's easily remedied by a thermal store utilising various inputs (log-burner, pv, solar thermal, heat-pump) .... you'd also need to be careful on appliances/kettles etc, but this would come down to product selection.

I know a number of people who have boreholes and no mains sewerage and with absolutely no chance of ever having a mains gas supply have recently moved from LPG or oil to heat-pumps to save cost and already have back-generators for mains failure Given an efficient LPG fuel-cell mCHP and a decent battery bank there's probably no reason why they couldn't go completely off grid .... I doubt that it would be anything more than an aspiration for anyone in an urban setting though .... masses of boreholes, septic tanks, bulk LPG storage and biomass burning in an urban environment would likely result in a recipe for disaster ...

.

HTH
Z

Alan_Brown · 1 February 2016 at 3:16PM

It's a little slow at work, so I was googling a bit more. I read about a thermal storage tank that allowed solar thermal and a boiler stove to be connected to supply hot water. The same tank allowed input from a heat pump and also had an immersion heater, so would allow a PV connection.

I read that the average standing charge was around £200, which could buy a decent amount of wood. I'm really starting to wonder if this is workable?

Ha:) Just seen your post Z, I half typed mine and then had lunch, so our posts crossed. It sounds like your setup is exactly what I'm thinking of doing (we are semi rural and neighbours have wood burning stoves), but I think we would add a heat pump for convenience. Have you ever considered going off gas? I assume as a low gas user, you have a tariff on higher kw/h rates but zero standing charge, would the comparison between Heat Pump and Natural Gas add up in your case (especially if you add in the Heat Incentive payments)?

zeupater · 1 February 2016 at 3:58PM

Alan_Brown wrote: »

It's a little slow at work, so I was googling a bit more. I read about a thermal storage tank that allowed solar thermal and a boiler stove to be connected to supply hot water. The same tank allowed input from a heat pump and also had an immersion heater, so would allow a PV connection.

I read that the average standing charge was around £200, which could buy a decent amount of wood. I'm really starting to wonder if this is workable?

Hi

We've got a multi-coil cylinder due to having the solar thermal - it also has the facility to fit an immersion heater.The log burner also has the facility to retro-fit water heating if we wanted.

Depending on where you are and the facilities to have a bulk log delivery (tipped, bag, pallet, box etc) £200 should buy you somewhere between 1 & 3 cubic metres of wood. We take tipped loads of ~3cubic metres (~2tonnes) of barn-dried hardwood logs (mainly ash & oak) which equates to somewhere around 8000kWh.t. However, there are alternative gas & electricity supplier tariffs offerings available which address the standing charge issue ....

HTH
Z

zeupater · 1 February 2016 at 4:22PM

Alan_Brown wrote: »

... Ha:) Just seen your post Z, I half typed mine and then had lunch, so our posts crossed. It sounds like your setup is exactly what I'm thinking of doing (we are semi rural and neighbours have wood burning stoves), but I think we would add a heat pump for convenience. Have you ever considered going off gas? I assume as a low gas user, you have a tariff on higher kw/h rates but zero standing charge, would the comparison between Heat Pump and Natural Gas add up in your case (especially if you add in the Heat Incentive payments)?

Hi

With the cost of the heat-pump and either U/F or oversized radiators even with the RHI over 7 years, it makes absolutely no sense for us (and probably most others) to move from gas to either an ASHP or even GSHP at current prices .... a small inverter based air/air unit (non-RHI) may suit to compliment pv for the shoulder months though, more for ready-controllable comfort when necessary than saving, but you'd need to be prepared to negotiate a decent price.

Z

Alan_Brown · 2 February 2016 at 2:59PM

Cardew wrote: »

Personally I don't think the Government could, or should, reduce the FIT for those already in receipt of that subsidy. The government made a deal - albeit a stupid deal - and should stick with the consequences; even though it is other electricity customers and not the tax-payer that foots the bill.

I've been thinking about the Spanish reduction in Tariff payments and wondering whether this could happen in the UK?

I had assumed not, and this might be dodgy logic on my part, but I was reading about Martin Lewis' fight against the changes to student loans and connected the two.

The student loan deal was a legal agreement that students signed up to and the government have torn up the agreement and changed the repayment criteria as, I assume, they decided it was too generous.

Can we trust the government not to renege on their solar FIT agreements, especially if energy keeps getting cheaper with fracking and the like?

pinnks · 2 February 2016 at 7:28PM

As far as I am aware the student loan changes are prospective, not retrospective. My kids have such delightful credit facilities which pre-date the recent changes and their terms remain in place. Student loans work like the FIT digression changes.

buildacareer · 11 February 2016 at 11:04AM

Yes, I found that this tread is really very good and informative. I have spent lots of time and read few posts related to solar pv and thermal.

My question is does anyone get the energy job in UK easily? Because its really hard to get energy jobs in Birmingham, UK.

Does anyone give their professional reviews on it.

Thanks in Advance !!

Martyn1981 · 14 February 2016 at 9:11AM

Fun graph comparing solar prices to solar installs. BTW the figures are annual, not cumulative.

Is This The Best Solar Chart Yet?

Mart.

silverwhistle · 14 February 2016 at 12:32PM

Alan_Brown wrote: »

I read that the average standing charge was around £200, which could buy a decent amount of wood. I'm really starting to wonder if this is workable?

Um.. My total gas and electricity bill for the year is only c. £250, which explains why I'm on a tariff with zero standing charge. :-)

The unit rate is high though, so not suitable for many, and it makes every unit saved more worthwhile. Then I spend the savings on wine..

It's a nice sunny day here, and as I've already had over 2.5kwh shoved into the immersion tank it should be OK for a nice hot bath when I get back from playing football over an hour away.

Solar ... In the news

Comments

Categories

Get our FREE Weekly email full of deals & guides - and it’s spam-free