Scary survey or just scary words?

DazRave · 14 July 2017 at 1:49PM

Hi guys!

Been a lurker of the forums for years, always managed to find the answers I've needed via a search but this problem seems much more specific. So I'm after a collective group of opinions from both past/current buyers and sellers.

I'll try to just summarise to make things easier:

FTB who have found the perfect (1930s) house we both love.
Offer accepted, Mortgage agreed, Our own building survey completed (the one higher then the standard HomeBuyers report).
Pre-Survey concerns around slightly sloping steps near the top of staircase. Other already noticed issues like guttering being a bit poor, old roof, old style double glazing with a few window seals failing causing condensation between glass.
Post-Survey highlighted everything above but also highlighted both landing and bathroom floor is slightly sloped too. Couldn't distinguish why this was but the opinion of Surveyor was that the it's potentially still moving and could be due to the open plan kitchen/dining room not having sufficient support.
Survey ended with an estimate of £8k worth of repairs but this included sorting out a badly laid driveway as well as guttering and other bits and bobs and didn't include repairs/investigation on the sloping issue.

Our opinion:
Other then the (slightly, may I add) sloping floor and top steps the report didn't highlight anything we didn't already know. Regarding the slope, there's some cracking on the internal walls below the sloping floor but none on the external walls.

Friends/Family majority opinion:
Pull out.

Options

Pay for structural engineer to work out reason for sloping and supply estimation of cost of work. Use that estimation to re-negotiate price.
Pull out and don't waste any more money.

Side note.. we received the Report last night (literally) and already the Estate Agent is pushing us to digest it and tell them once we've done reading it. I'm assuming they are just wanting to get things moving. Do we send them the report so they understand what's concerning us at the moment or do we just tell them what's concerning us?

I like gathering facts and opinions from as many sources as I can before I make decisions. So here I am. Please help! :eek:

Update - 15/072017
Since the report was received on Thursday evening, we have managed to get a builder into the property this morning. The builder in question is a family friend.

It seems to me my suspicions have been confirmed. Someone (potentially not the current Vendor) has punched through from Living room to dining room walls and then the dining room to kitchen walls. Not only that but the single story extension to the rear of the house is shoddy too. It just seems like way too many walls have been messed with.

The most concerning find was that the side external wall is certainly bulging. When looking at the bulge on the wall myself with the builder, I'm out right shocked that nothing at all was said by the Surveyor about it.

We're gutted, to say the least. The work needed could easily go as high as £15k with their being no way of telling what else is hidden between those walls once they are stripped back.

Unless the Vendor's willing to knock £20k off the agreed £190k (listed at £198k, reduced from £205k) I think we'll just have to walk.

shortcrust · 14 July 2017 at 1:56PM

I wouldn't pull out yet. When you're sitting in a home that you don't both love the fact that the floors are dead level won't be much of a consolation.:)

Get it looked at. Might be nothing (I have sloping floors which are no bother other than having to wedge things under furntiure legs...), or easily fixed.

G_M · 14 July 2017 at 2:01PM

I assume an internal wall between living/dining rooms was removed sometime?

If this was a load-bearing wall, and insufficient support was added, this could explain movement, and hence sloping floors, cracks etc.

If the movement is ongoing, I'd be concerned. You'd need to add a load-bearing beam across the gap between the walls. Cost and disruption. If you are prepared to put up with both those, fine, include it in your budgetting.

How long ago was it done? Any idea? Any Building Regulations certification?

On the other and it might be an idiosyncracy of an old house and nothing more........

Returntosender · 14 July 2017 at 2:05PM

We're buying a house that has subsidence problems, but it was underpinned by the vendor, so we're not too bothered by a house that has historical subsidence.

However, if there is movement in the house, internal walls are cracking, then it may be that it just hasn't moved enough for the outside to crack yet. Personally, I would employ a subsidence firm to check it over - do you know of any historical leaks to the property? I would also get a quote for structural strengthening of the open plan rooms.

I would be put off, personally, because it sounds like a lot of uncertainty in the years ahead.

cattie · 14 July 2017 at 2:05PM

I'd certainly not consider pulling out yet. With one house I bought a few years ago the surveyor noted that an area of landing upstairs had a floor that bounced when trod on. Floor was fully carpeted. Anyway I bought house & it turned out that all the floorboards needed were a couple of noggins, so a very small job. There is nothing stopping you trying to negotiate a lower price by stating the surveyors estimate for works needed.

All older houses will have some negative remarks made by surveyor, but a lot of the time they are just covering themselves as they don't actually do much other than make remarks about getting specialists in to check things & this is pretty general to all surveys.

DazRave · 14 July 2017 at 2:28PM

@G_M
"I assume an internal wall between living/dining rooms was removed sometime?"
Correct. There's been a wall taken out between kitchen and dining room.

"How long ago was it done?"
We think it pre-dates the Vendor, so sometime before 1998, but we're checking this.

"Any Building Regulations certification?"
None was present for the Surveyor to look at, but that doesn't mean there isn't one and so we are going to ask the Vendor to provide.

There's a small single story extension to the rear of the house which extends the dining room and kitchen. The removed wall creates a large U shaped room. The bottom of the U section is the original section of the house. Therefore it's one of the original walls which has been removed. It's also worth noting that a W/C has been installed under the stairs too close to the area of the cracks and directly under the top 2 steps that are sloping.

@Returntosender
"do you know of any historical leaks to the property?"
None at all that we know of. The building survey report also didn't suggest there had been leaks. However, it did highlight that where some of the guttering needed repairs, water was able to run down the external wall of the house. However this is around another side of the house away from the where the sloping floors are.

@Cattie
"There is nothing stopping you trying to negotiate a lower price by stating the surveyors estimate for works needed."
Interesting point.. the Surveyors report listed the urgent repairs at a estimate of £8k. However this list even included the driveway being re-laid because the concrete is a mess. Not something I'd thought would make it onto the urgent list. Weirdly, what didn't make the urgent list was the slope on the floors. The report does earlier on highlight a Structural engineer should be hired though.

Again, thanks all for the replies. I think we'll certainly get someone in to check out the floors... but what do we tell the EA etc in the meantime? Should we be open and honest, perhaps even send them the report?

Clutterfree · 14 July 2017 at 3:06PM

Personally, I wouldn't send them the report.
Tell them that the survey brought up a few issues and that you may need to employ an expert to investigate further.

DazRave · 15 July 2017 at 3:56PM

Update
Since the report was received on Thursday evening, we have managed to get a builder into the property this morning. The builder in question is a family friend.

It seems to me my suspicions have been confirmed. Someone (potentially not the current Vendor) has punched through from Living room to dining room walls and then the dining room to kitchen walls. Not only that but the single story extension to the rear of the house is shoddy too. It just seems like way too many walls have been messed with.

The most concerning find was that the side external wall is certainly bulging. When looking at the bulge on the wall myself with the builder, I'm out right shocked that nothing at all was said by the Surveyor about it.

We're gutted, to say the least. The work needed could easily go as high as £15k with their being no way of telling what else is hidden between those walls once they are stripped back.

Unless the Vendor's willing to knock £20k off the agreed £190k (listed at £198k, reduced from £205k) I think we'll just have to walk.

societys_child · 15 July 2017 at 4:58PM

work needed could easily go as high as £15k

Could go as high as 15k (but may not) and you want a £20k reduction :huh:
Got to ask, what the extra £5k is for?

DazRave · 15 July 2017 at 5:08PM

societys_child wrote: »

Could go as high as 15k (but may not) and you want a £20k reduction :huh:
Got to ask, what the extra £5k is for?

Sorry, forgot to mention the £15k very rough estimate would be what I'd be charged via the family friend. I'd dread to actually think what it could raise to from anyone else.

EDIT: It's looking most likely to be towards the very top end of the estimate as the boiler, gas meter and water meter have all been placed on the wall that would need rebuilding.

michael1234 · 15 July 2017 at 11:52PM

Perhaps I'll live to regret it one day but unless I'm buying something very old or listed, I don't bother getting a survey at all.
I really don't appreciate paying for someone to itemise the plug sockets and tell me I might need 10 more expensive specialist reports for this and that.

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Scary survey or just scary words?

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