Universal credit is a nightmare!

nomad2017 · 7 January 2018 at 12:05PM

Good morning everyone and sorry if my English is not so perfect. I am seeking for some advices. I lived before in France and I moved in UK for professional reasons. I heard about "universal credit". I thought to myself that perhaps I could go and claim for it why not? I had nothing to lose and it's never a bad idea to have some extra money, the answer would be either yes or no, end of story. It was not clearly showing on universal credit website which conditions are required to obtain universal credit (eg: you can get UC if you are on a low income.. but they don't tell you the amount of this low income!)

Anyway I went to JobCentre in August 2017 to claim, I gave them my work contract with the annual salary written on it (19 000 pounds), my ID, my tenancy agreement etc.. I've been told that my application will be studied. 6 weeks later I received 598 pounds from them. I was like: wow! I can have universal credit + my work salary. I was really happy about it. Then next month the "nightmare" began.. They began to ask me my payroll details every month (or I could face a 50 pounds civil penalty), which I did. According to them I was too rich for them, so they stopped paying me universal credit. Last month I gave them my payroll detail as usual (the amount hasn't changed) and.... they sent me 598 pounds again:mad::mad::mad:. I called them to say that I have probably been overpaid and they told me that in fact I have been overpaid 1196 pounds (598+598) and that a decision maker will be assigned to my case to tell me how I can repay the money back.. it's been a month and no one came back to me.. Plus I asked them to freeze my account meanwhile so I won't get a third 598 pounds overpayment, the froze the account but this morning I saw that they will pay me in 6 days.... I'm afraid of having a third overpayment...
As for me I don't want to repay them back 1196 pounds, it is clearly their fault, I gave them all documents required and they made the decision to pay me, knowing that my annual salary is 19 000 pounds (approx 1300 pounds a month), plus they want me to pay a civil penalty because they can't do their job properly..... did someone here encountered the same thing with universal credit? if they ask me to pay back THEIR mistakes, is theire any solution so I can keep their money and most important avoid paying a civil penalty? I never attempted fraud, It was supposed to be simple: "yes you can have UC" or "no you can't have UC".. If I knew this system was so terrible I wouldn't even walk to JobCentre.. Thank you for reading me and any advice would be highly appreciated

BorisThomson · 7 January 2018 at 12:40PM

nomad2017 wrote: »

Good morning everyone and sorry if my English is not so perfect. I am seeking for some advices. I lived before in France and I moved in UK for professional reasons. I heard about "universal credit". I thought to myself that perhaps I could go and claim for it why not? I had nothing to lose and it's never a bad idea to have some extra money, the answer would be either yes or no, end of story. It was not clearly showing on universal credit website which conditions are required to obtain universal credit (eg: you can get UC if you are on a low income.. but they don't tell you the amount of this low income!)

Anyway I went to JobCentre in August 2017 to claim, I gave them my work contract with the annual salary written on it (19 000 pounds), my ID, my tenancy agreement etc.. I've been told that my application will be studied. 6 weeks later I received 598 pounds from them. I was like: wow! I can have universal credit + my work salary. I was really happy about it. Then next month the "nightmare" began.. They began to ask me my payroll details every month (or I could face a 50 pounds civil penalty), which I did. According to them I was too rich for them, so they stopped paying me universal credit. Last month I gave them my payroll detail as usual (the amount hasn't changed) and.... they sent me 598 pounds again:mad::mad::mad:. I called them to say that I have probably been overpaid and they told me that in fact I have been overpaid 1196 pounds (598+598) and that a decision maker will be assigned to my case to tell me how I can repay the money back.. it's been a month and no one came back to me.. Plus I asked them to freeze my account meanwhile so I won't get a third 598 pounds overpayment, the froze the account but this morning I saw that they will pay me in 6 days.... I'm afraid of having a third overpayment...
As for me I don't want to repay them back 1196 pounds, it is clearly their fault, I gave them all documents required and they made the decision to pay me, knowing that my annual salary is 19 000 pounds (approx 1300 pounds a month), plus they want me to pay a civil penalty because they can't do their job properly..... did someone here encountered the same thing with universal credit? if they ask me to pay back THEIR mistakes, is theire any solution so I can keep their money and most important avoid paying a civil penalty? I never attempted fraud, It was supposed to be simple: "yes you can have UC" or "no you can't have UC".. If I knew this system was so terrible I wouldn't even walk to JobCentre.. Thank you for reading me and any advice would be highly appreciated

If this is for real ...

Universal Credit is for those on a low income, unless you have very high housing costs you are not on a low income.

When you received the payments you should have had a breakdown of how the amount was calculated. Did you check this, was your salary taken into account? It is up to you to check this information. You'll also have received information on the overpayment notification, what does this tell you?

Put the overpayments aside, you will have to pay them back. Please keep in mind that this is not free money, it comes from the public purse - the tax payer.

nomad2017 · 7 January 2018 at 2:47PM

Hi Boris thank you for your reply. Yes this is for real.. I think there have been both misunderstanding on my side and on UC side.. When I was back in France, I had the same salary than in UK, and they considered me like I had a low income.. I thought it would be the same in UK. I don't understand how come I have to check if they did their job properly.. I provided to them every document they needed for my claim (salary, work contract, ID) at that time.. By checking my UC account, it says that I had earned 0 pounds, this is why they paid me 598 pounds the first time in August (I thought that my annual salary written on the payslip would be enough + when I filled the online form I told them that I earn approx 1300 pounds a month).. no one asked me to provide a detailed payslip at that time (they asked for it later), how come I can guess they need it? This is not my job to do that.. and when they paid me 598 pounds for the second time in December, I declared my november earnings (how much I earned, how much tax I paid, how much NI i paid etc), but yet they considered I earned 0 pound and they gave me 598 pounds....there is clearly something wrong with them.. They never officially asked me to repay back the money, I got no official letter from DWP to repay back the money. Advisor told me on the phone: "I think you have been overpaid twice, I will pass your case to the decision maker and you might have to pay also a civil penalty" I have been told this since 15th december, and until today no one came back to me.. I think it should not be that hard to provide me a bank account number so I can refund their mistakes. I am not a thief, I know this is no free money but I'm not the one who made the mistake to transfer this money into my account.. I am not responsible for them being incompetent and paying me because when I say: "I earned approx 1300 pounds", they understand: "I earned 0 pounds"

BorisThomson · 7 January 2018 at 3:10PM

nomad2017 wrote: »

Hi Boris thank you for your reply. Yes this is for real.. I think there have been both misunderstanding on my side and on UC side.. When I was back in France, I had the same salary than in UK, and they considered me like I had a low income.. I thought it would be the same in UK. I don't understand how come I have to check if they did their job properly.. I provided to them every document they needed for my claim (salary, work contract, ID) at that time.. By checking my UC account, it says that I had earned 0 pounds, this is why they paid me 598 pounds the first time in August (I thought that my annual salary written on the payslip would be enough + when I filled the online form I told them that I earn approx 1300 pounds a month).. no one asked me to provide a detailed payslip at that time (they asked for it later), how come I can guess they need it? This is not my job to do that.. and when they paid me 598 pounds for the second time in December, I declared my november earnings (how much I earned, how much tax I paid, how much NI i paid etc), but yet they considered I earned 0 pound and they gave me 598 pounds....there is clearly something wrong with them.. They never officially asked me to repay back the money, I got no official letter from DWP to repay back the money. Advisor told me on the phone: "I think you have been overpaid twice, I will pass your case to the decision maker and you might have to pay also a civil penalty" I have been told this since 15th december, and until today no one came back to me.. I think it should not be that hard to provide me a bank account number so I can refund their mistakes. I am not a thief, I know this is no free money but I'm not the one who made the mistake to transfer this money into my account.. I am not responsible for them being incompetent and paying me because when I say: "I earned approx 1300 pounds", they understand: "I earned 0 pounds"

You are responsible for checking the information they have based the award on is correct. Yes, they made a mistake, but so did you in failing to check your award letter.

There is no suggestion that you are a thief, but failing to pay it back would change that, as you would be intentionally keeping money that does not belong to you.

As already said, keep the money aside for when you are asked to pay it back. You will not be given a penalty (or worse) if you have provided the correct information and continue to communicate with them.

poppy12345 · 7 January 2018 at 3:20PM

If it's an overpayment you'll need to pay it back, simple as that. The onus is on the claimant to make sure the details of the payment are correct. It said your salary was £0 yet you knew it wasn't, why didn't you ring and tell them this?

You had a 2nd payment of £598, which you knew shouldn't have been paid. As you knew it was an error, you must have kept that money so you could pay it back, correct?

I'm not sure why you thought UK would be the same are France, we aren't France. It will have to be repaid, simple as that.

Ames · 7 January 2018 at 5:01PM

Do you get paid on the same date each month? Is it ever paid early or late? Is your wage paid on the 31st of the month?

Your UC should be calculated each months between two dates. Do the months when you got UC correspond to times when you didn't get a wage between the UC dates?

nomad2017 · 7 January 2018 at 5:17PM

well yes I am planning to repay back to stop this. I am still waiting for the decision maker to be assigned to my case. I sent them 2-3 messages a day to try speeding things up they ask me to stop and wait :rotfl:

nomad2017 · 7 January 2018 at 5:22PM

Well I thought the first 598 pounds payment were correct because I thought they paid me knowing how much I win every month (annual salary written on my work contract). This is only when they gave me a second 598 pounds payment (after 2-3 months of 0 pound payment) I realised that I'm being overpaid and that the first 598 pounds payment is also an overpayment. I had to insist myself to say: I'm overpaid, otherwise they would'nt even have noticed. I know I am not in France but I stupidly thought this would be the same principle: you give your work contract, they estimate how much you win each month. They say: you are too rich for benefits or too poor for benefits, end of story. Thought UK would be the same to be honest.

nomad2017 · 7 January 2018 at 5:23PM

and yes I provided correct informations: my work contract, my tenancy agreement, my ID. I complied to everything they asked from me

elsien · 7 January 2018 at 5:26PM

Universal credit has had a lot of problems with its implementation - they've messed things up for a lot of people so putting things right isn't necessarily going to be a quick process.
Stick the money on one side till they get round to asking for it back. You can make a complaint about poor service although whether that would achieve anything is a moot point.

Alice_Holt · 7 January 2018 at 7:29PM

elsien wrote: »

Universal credit has had a lot of problems with its implementation - they've messed things up for a lot of people so putting things right isn't necessarily going to be a quick process.
Stick the money on one side till they get round to asking for it back. You can make a complaint about poor service although whether that would achieve anything is a moot point.

This ^

All UC overpayments are repayable - even if it arose through official error.

I would print off and keep all relevant UC journal entries / letters.

Universal credit is a nightmare!

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