Can a non beneficiary relative witness a will?

Panda78 · 31 March 2014 at 11:40AM

Morning All,

I'm completing DIY will forms and wondering if 2 relatives could witness my will, as long as they are not beneficiaries? I've read conflicting views online.

Also, would my will still be valid if a witness died before i did?

Thank you.

RAS · 31 March 2014 at 11:41AM

Can we just check whether you are in England, Wales or Scotland? The law can be different.

cte1111 · 31 March 2014 at 11:44AM

The will should not be witnessed by a beneficiary or a spouse of a beneficiary. This is my understanding of the law in England.

https://www.gov.uk/make-will/witnessing-your-will

Panda78 · 31 March 2014 at 12:01PM

RAS wrote: »

Can we just check whether you are in England, Wales or Scotland? The law can be different.

England, thank you.

Panda78 · 31 March 2014 at 12:03PM

cte1111 wrote: »

The will should not be witnessed by a beneficiary or a spouse of a beneficiary. This is my understanding of the law in England.

https://www.gov.uk/make-will/witnessing-your-will

Thank you, so by reading the link, seems that i can have 2 relatives witness my will as they will not be beneficiaries (or the spouse of)?

Icey77 · 31 March 2014 at 2:04PM

As I understand it (having completed my new will last last week) the witnesses must not be beneficiaries or married to beneficiaries, they must also be over 18.

There are no rules that they have to be relatives though, so you can ask anyone that you trust such as friends, neighbours etc.

getmore4less · 31 March 2014 at 3:25PM

Is it not the other way round,

anyone(over 18) can sign BUT they lose their rights as a benificiary.

A benificiary can sign on behalf of the testator.

Wills act section 15.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Will4and1Vict/7/26/section/15

If any person shall attest the execution of any will to whom or to whose wife or husband any beneficial devise, legacy, estate, interest, gift, or appointment, of or affecting any real or personal estate (other than and except charges and directions for the payment of any debt or debts), shall be thereby given or made, such devise, legacy, estate, interest, gift, or appointment shall, so far only as concerns such person attesting the execution of such will, or the wife or husband of such person, or any person claiming under such person or wife or husband, be utterly null and void, and such person so attesting shall be admitted as a witness to prove the execution of such will, or to prove the validity or invalidity thereof, notwithstanding such devise, legacy, estate, interest, gift, or appointment mentioned in such will

unless someone find something that superceed this.

Mojisola · 31 March 2014 at 3:57PM

Icey77 wrote: »

As I understand it (having completed my new will last last week) the witnesses must not be beneficiaries or married to beneficiaries, they must also be over 18.

getmore4less wrote: »

Is it not the other way round,

anyone(over 18) can sign BUT they lose their rights as a benificiary.

This is right - the will would still be valid if a beneficiary's spouse signed as a witness but the legacy to the spouse would fail.

Savvy_Sue · 2 April 2014 at 2:15AM

Panda78 wrote: »

Also, would my will still be valid if a witness died before i did?

Yes. Imagine the difficulty if wills were invalidated by the death of a witness, given that no-one can predict when anyone will die.

madbadrob · 2 April 2014 at 11:21AM

In England & Wales, you need two witnesses over the age of 18 to witness your signature and to sign your will; in Scotland, you need only one witness over the age of 16. The spouse of a testator (person making a will) cannot witness a will, nor can beneficiaries of the will (or their spouses). Taken from http://www.lawpack.co.uk/wills/item1797.asp

can an executor also be a beneficiary
The answer is yes, provided the Will contains the appropriate wording. However executors, beneficiaries, or the spouses of executors, beneficiaries, MUST not witness Wills as gifts to witnesses or their spouses will not be allowed to stand, Save for exceptional cases.

Taken from http://www.wisewills.co.uk/faq.htm and concur's with getmores post

Which is again contradicted by

8. Who can witness my Will?

Any independent person may witness your Will. Independent means that they must not be related to the maker of the Will or be a beneficiary under the Will. It does not have to be a solicitor; it can be a neighbour or friend.
taken from http://www.simpsonmillar.co.uk/services/willsandprobate/wills-frequently-asked-questions.aspx#witness

I suspect that these law firms are saying this as they would expect the spouse and relatives to be beneficiaries which witnesses cannot be.

legalcenter.co.uk say in answer to who can witness my will
He or she must not be a beneficiary under the Will or the husband, wife or civil partner of a beneficiary or that beneficiary will lose his/her entitlement.

I can see why the OP is confused and mentions conflicting information. Having read a large number of sites now on this subject I would have to concur with getmore4less when he posted the statutory instrument on this and say yes anyone over 18 in England and Wales can witness a will but they cannot benefit from the will.

Rob

Panda78 · 2 April 2014 at 2:41PM

madbadrob wrote: »

In England & Wales, you need two witnesses over the age of 18 to witness your signature and to sign your will; in Scotland, you need only one witness over the age of 16. The spouse of a testator (person making a will) cannot witness a will, nor can beneficiaries of the will (or their spouses). Taken from http://www.lawpack.co.uk/wills/item1797.asp

can an executor also be a beneficiary
The answer is yes, provided the Will contains the appropriate wording. However executors, beneficiaries, or the spouses of executors, beneficiaries, MUST not witness Wills as gifts to witnesses or their spouses will not be allowed to stand, Save for exceptional cases.

Taken from http://www.wisewills.co.uk/faq.htm and concur's with getmores post

Which is again contradicted by

8. Who can witness my Will?

Any independent person may witness your Will. Independent means that they must not be related to the maker of the Will or be a beneficiary under the Will. It does not have to be a solicitor; it can be a neighbour or friend.
taken from http://www.simpsonmillar.co.uk/services/willsandprobate/wills-frequently-asked-questions.aspx#witness

I suspect that these law firms are saying this as they would expect the spouse and relatives to be beneficiaries which witnesses cannot be.

legalcenter.co.uk say in answer to who can witness my will
He or she must not be a beneficiary under the Will or the husband, wife or civil partner of a beneficiary or that beneficiary will lose his/her entitlement.

I can see why the OP is confused and mentions conflicting information. Having read a large number of sites now on this subject I would have to concur with getmore4less when he posted the statutory instrument on this and say yes anyone over 18 in England and Wales can witness a will but they cannot benefit from the will.

Rob

Thanks Rob, OP here, i've continued to research this online and there are still conflicting reports, mostly on how you interpret "independent witness", but most of the obvious places to check - govt websites, CAB etc, seem to say anyone over 18 can witness, as long as they are not a beneficiary.

Can a non beneficiary relative witness a will?

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