carers allowance and universal credit

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Roundhay23
Roundhay23 Posts: 24 Forumite
in Benefits & tax credits
I understand that if you claim Carers Allowance this will be deducted pound for pound is there any point in claiming this if you also claim Universal Credit. I understand that you can claim the Carers element of Universal Credit without claiming Carers Allowance.
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  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,963 Forumite
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    Roundhay23 wrote: »
    I understand that if you claim Carers Allowance this will be deducted pound for pound is there any point in claiming this if you also claim Universal Credit. I understand that you can claim the Carers element of Universal Credit without claiming Carers Allowance.
    Yes you can claim the carers element of UC without claiming CA. The only advantage to claiming carers allowance is it pays class 1 NI credits and UC pays class 3.



    The disadvantage to claiming carers allowance is you have the earnings limit of no more than £123 per week after deductions.
  • Rubyroobs
    Rubyroobs Posts: 866 Forumite
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    Also you can receive carers allowance weekly which may help budgeting.
  • airliner
    airliner Posts: 112 Forumite
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    Carer's Allowance is deducted pound for pound but part of it is normally offset by the 'Carer Amount'.

    This means that people are generally £37pw better off for claiming Carer's Allowance. (This wouldn't be true if you yourself were getting the limited capability for work related activity element of UC)

    Carers Allowance also affords you a class 1 NIC, as previously stated. Class 1 NICs can count towards the contribution conditions of certain benefits. You may never have to rely on them but at least you would protect your position.
  • calcotti
    calcotti Posts: 15,696 Forumite
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    edited 19 November 2019 at 9:52AM
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    airliner wrote: »
    Carer's Allowance is deducted pound for pound but part of it is normally offset by the 'Carer Amount'.

    This means that people are generally £37pw better off for claiming Carer's Allowance.

    This is not correct. If you are a carer you get the carer element in UC regardless of whether or not you claim Carer’s Allowance. There is therefore no financial gain claiming Carer’s Allowance.

    This differs from legacy benefits for which you did have to claim Carer’s Allowance in order to get a carer premium.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Some rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,963 Forumite
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    calcotti wrote: »
    This is not correct. If you are a carer you get the carer element in UC regardless of whether or not you claim Carer’s Allowance. There is therefore no financial gain claiming Carer’s Allowance.

    This differs from legacy benefits for which you did have to claim Carer’s Allowance in order to get a carer premium.
    Thanks for that. I did already explain in my first comment and i'm not sure why the OP decided to comment with incorrect information after my advice was already given.
  • calcotti
    calcotti Posts: 15,696 Forumite
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    edited 19 November 2019 at 10:04AM
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    poppy12345 wrote: »
    ... not sure why the OP decided to comment with incorrect information after my advice was already given.
    Agreed. The OP had got it right in their opening post too!
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Some rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • airliner
    airliner Posts: 112 Forumite
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    calcotti wrote: »
    This is not correct. If you are a carer you get the carer element in UC regardless of whether or not you claim Carer’s Allowance. There is therefore no financial gain claiming Carer’s Allowance.

    This differs from legacy benefits for which you did have to claim Carer’s Allowance in order to get a carer premium.

    Actually, what I said is completely accurate.

    What you said is correct also.

    We are both right.

    However, it appeared the OP thought they would be no financial gain for claiming Carer's Allowance, when actually there is. They would be £37pw better off.
    They would also be £37pw better off by just asking for the Carer Amount to be included in their UC award without making a claim for CA, but they would miss out on Class 1 NICs.
  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,963 Forumite
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    airliner wrote: »
    A
    However, it appeared the OP thought they would be no financial gain for claiming Carer's Allowance, when actually there is. They would be £37pw better off.
    They would also be £37pw better off by just asking for the Carer Amount to be included in their UC award without making a claim for CA, but they would miss out on Class 1 NICs.


    There's no financial gain at all to claiming carers allowance and UC because as previously stated, you can claim the carers element (£160.20 per month) without claiming carers allowance.



    The disadvantage is that you have the earning limit with carers allowance.
  • airliner
    airliner Posts: 112 Forumite
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    poppy12345 wrote: »
    There's no financial gain at all to claiming carers allowance and UC because as previously stated, you can claim the carers element (£160.20 per month) without claiming carers allowance.

    The disadvantage is that you have the earning limit with carers allowance.

    There is a financial gain, it’s just the same amount as asking for the Carer Element.

    The OP has three options

    1) Not get their caring responsibilities recognised and stay on the same rates of benefits as they are now.

    2) Claims Carer's Allowance. Net gain would be £37pw when compared to option 1

    3) Not claim Carer's Allowance and get Carer Element. Net Gain £37pw when compared to option 1.

    Therefore, there are two options that result in the same financial gain going forwards. Which option is best depends on a number of factors.

    Merits of claiming Carer's Allowance
    - Receive a Class 1 NIC for each week. This can count towards contribution conditions for certain benefits. This protects their position.
    - Carer’s Allowance is not affected by capital, nor by the earnings of a partner. This builds in protection for possible changes in the future.
    - Claim for Carer’s Allowance can be backdated for three months, if the conditions have been met during that period. Therefore, by choosing option three, they could actually lose out on money.


    Merits of asking for Carer Amount to be included in a UC award without claiming Carer's Allowance
    - Quicker process but the Carer Element cannot be backdated for three months on its own.



    The earnings limit for Carer’s Allowance, I feel, is a bit of a red herring. Carer’s Allowance would just stop and the Carer Element of UC would remain if a carer earned over £123 per week.
  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,963 Forumite
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    airliner wrote: »
    There is a financial gain, it’s just the same amount as asking for the Carer Element.

    The OP has three options

    1) Not get their caring responsibilities recognised and stay on the same rates of benefits as they are now.

    2) Claims Carer's Allowance. Net gain would be £37pw when compared to option 1

    3) Not claim Carer's Allowance and get Carer Element. Net Gain £37pw when compared to option 1.

    Therefore, there are two options that result in the same financial gain going forwards. Which option is best depends on a number of factors.

    Merits of claiming Carer's Allowance
    - Receive a Class 1 NIC for each week. This can count towards contribution conditions for certain benefits. This protects their position.
    - Carer’s Allowance is not affected by capital, nor by the earnings of a partner. This builds in protection for possible changes in the future.
    - Claim for Carer’s Allowance can be backdated for three months, if the conditions have been met during that period. Therefore, by choosing option three, they could actually lose out on money.


    Merits of asking for Carer Amount to be included in a UC award without claiming Carer's Allowance
    - Quicker process but the Carer Element cannot be backdated for three months on its own.



    The earnings limit for Carer’s Allowance, I feel, is a bit of a red herring. Carer’s Allowance would just stop and the Carer Element of UC would remain if a carer earned over £123 per week.
    Sorry but there's no financial gain when claiming carers allowance and UC at the same time and i'm not sure why you're insisting that there is. The reason why there's no gain is because you can claim the carers element without claiming carers allowance as advised multiple times.



    Yes, carers allowance can be backdated for 3 months but if the person is claiming UC then that backdated money is pointless because it's still deducted £1 for £1 from any UC entitlement.



    Whether or not the carers element is backdated will depend on whether the person caring reported caring responsibilities, if they didn't it's possible they won't back dated it.



    I've said all i'm going to say on this thread, i'm out.
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