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Postal PPC PCN and I said my partner was driving
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Patrickthedog
Posts: 5 Forumite
Hello lovely well savvy people. Help needed please...postal PCN and I said my partner was driving.
I recently received a PCN from a private parking firm(DSFP) in the post. It was for £100 (reduced to £60 for 14 days) for an overstay in a carpark 1 month previous. The postcode was not local and when I looked it up I realised that it must have been when my partner took our young daughter on a trip to meet family. I asked him about it and he vaguely remembered that there had been some minor incident with our daughter on the way back to the car and that they had been slightly late. The letter from the PCN only mentioned the time of exit to the carpark so I had no idea the actual length of overstay but he guessed that it would not have been more than 10 mins or so.
I did a small amount of online research (oh how I wish id found the mountains of advice on this forum and read the newbies thread first!, but sadly found this later on) I came across some info saying that parking ‘charges’ should be fair and representational of any loss incurred by the PPC as a result of the offence. I used their online appeal form to write a simple response saying that my partner thought he could remember our small daughter having a minor accident which held them up slightly on their return and that a £100 fine was an excessive and unfair amount to charge for a short overstay. I’m so angry with myself now for having been so naïve. I realise now how stupid this was.
I inevitably received a further letter saying that my appeal had been denied and they detail in this letter the time of entry (16:10) time of ticket purchase(16:15) time of exit (16:31) and say I have a further 14 days to pay the reduced amount etc. They are an IPC member and as such I was directed to make any further appeal to the IAS.
I have since done my research properly and found that I could have dealt with this so much better in the first instance and I would very much appreciate any advice on what to do next. I’ve found the schedule 4 and POFA and realised that the first letter they sent was not within the specified 14 days since the incident. I received the first letter 31 days after the parking ‘offence’. The appeal response letter they sent was still addressed to me so I guess they are going down the pursuing me as the RK route despite mentioning my partner. Also they only mention the time of exit in their first letter, should it have had the other details they only supplied following appeal?
I am wondering how much what I have done already has shot myself in the foot? I did not mention my partner by name. Just that he remembered the parking event. But far from not naming the driver or giving excuses I have managed to do both. Should I just suck it up? Or is this in any way still salvageable?
Many Thanks to any one with expertise in this who can give me some advice .
I recently received a PCN from a private parking firm(DSFP) in the post. It was for £100 (reduced to £60 for 14 days) for an overstay in a carpark 1 month previous. The postcode was not local and when I looked it up I realised that it must have been when my partner took our young daughter on a trip to meet family. I asked him about it and he vaguely remembered that there had been some minor incident with our daughter on the way back to the car and that they had been slightly late. The letter from the PCN only mentioned the time of exit to the carpark so I had no idea the actual length of overstay but he guessed that it would not have been more than 10 mins or so.
I did a small amount of online research (oh how I wish id found the mountains of advice on this forum and read the newbies thread first!, but sadly found this later on) I came across some info saying that parking ‘charges’ should be fair and representational of any loss incurred by the PPC as a result of the offence. I used their online appeal form to write a simple response saying that my partner thought he could remember our small daughter having a minor accident which held them up slightly on their return and that a £100 fine was an excessive and unfair amount to charge for a short overstay. I’m so angry with myself now for having been so naïve. I realise now how stupid this was.
I inevitably received a further letter saying that my appeal had been denied and they detail in this letter the time of entry (16:10) time of ticket purchase(16:15) time of exit (16:31) and say I have a further 14 days to pay the reduced amount etc. They are an IPC member and as such I was directed to make any further appeal to the IAS.
I have since done my research properly and found that I could have dealt with this so much better in the first instance and I would very much appreciate any advice on what to do next. I’ve found the schedule 4 and POFA and realised that the first letter they sent was not within the specified 14 days since the incident. I received the first letter 31 days after the parking ‘offence’. The appeal response letter they sent was still addressed to me so I guess they are going down the pursuing me as the RK route despite mentioning my partner. Also they only mention the time of exit in their first letter, should it have had the other details they only supplied following appeal?
I am wondering how much what I have done already has shot myself in the foot? I did not mention my partner by name. Just that he remembered the parking event. But far from not naming the driver or giving excuses I have managed to do both. Should I just suck it up? Or is this in any way still salvageable?
Many Thanks to any one with expertise in this who can give me some advice .
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Comments
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if you did not name the driver (name and address of the driver) then you have not actually named the driver per se
hence why they are after you
if you read the NEWBIES sticky thread you know that appealing to the IAS is a waste of time
and almost all appeals to parking companies are turned down, even if you said a martian drove the vehicle and turned it into a pumpkin !!
it is what it is , IGNORE them now and IGNORE any debt collector loetters too
come back if you receive an LBC or an MCOL in the post , within 6 years
keep all paperwork and evidence etc
10 minutes seems a reasonable grace period to me , hopefully a judge will think the same0 -
If you haven’t actually named the driver and provided an address for service, the PPC will pursue the registered keeper. If this is the case, I wouldn’t make any more contact with them.
That said, nothing you could say to a PPC would see a PCN cancelled, nor would an appeal to the IAS (even on legal grounds like non-PoFA compliance). So you are where you are, just waiting to see what the PPC’s next move is, and whether they will proceed to issue a court claim (which from 1/10/17 has become much more of a faff for them due to the new CPR pre-action protocol).
Are they likely to issue court proceedings? Make your own mind up on that.
https://bmpa.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/208139649-Direct-Solutions-For-Parking-Ltd
http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/Direct_Solutions_For_Parking.htmlPlease note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .
I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.
Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street0 -
I would obviously be in a stronger position had I sent the appropriate response to their first letter and I’m wondering if I will now be flagged up on their radar as being someone likely to give a feeble defence if they were to go ahead and start court proceedings. And would it indeed be the case given what I’ve already said?
Thanks again.0 -
I doubt that it matters
if they go to court , they have to prove they have a case in the first place , landowner contract , IPC CoP compliance , signage , never mind POFA2012 if going after the keeper
had the driver actually been named , they would have issued a notice to the driver for them to appeal (futile though it is)
its their problem , see what comes of it0 -
they detail in this letter the time of entry (16:10) time of ticket purchase(16:15) time of exit (16:31)
So your partner bought a ticket and stayed 21 minutes, what is their problem?You never know how far you can go until you go too far.0 -
That should be the ticket expired at 16:15 so the overstay was actually 16 minutes until he exited0
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Patrickthedog wrote: »That should be the ticket expired at 16:15 so the overstay was actually 16 minutes until he exited
Bought a ticket which expired at 16:15.
Left the car park at 16:31.
That's not right either, is it? A ticket valid for five minutes?
Can you please state again exactly what the appeal rejection letter said about this?
If the overstay really was just sixteen minutes then this is winnable.0 -
OK sorry, start again.
it said, time of entry 14:10,time of ticket purchase 14:15, time of ticket expiry 16:15 time of exit 16:310 -
If you haven’t actually named the driver and provided an address for service, the PPC will pursue the registered keeper. If this is the case, I wouldn’t make any more contact with them.
That said, nothing you could say to a PPC would see a PCN cancelled, nor would an appeal to the IAS (even on legal grounds like non-PoFA compliance). So you are where you are, just waiting to see what the PPC’s next move is, and whether they will proceed to issue a court claim (which from 1/10/17 has become much more of a faff for them due to the new CPR pre-action protocol).
Are they likely to issue court proceedings? Make your own mind up on that.
https://bmpa.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/208139649-Direct-Solutions-For-Parking-Ltd
http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/Direct_Solutions_For_Parking.html
As Umkomaas said above, I wouldn’t make any more contact with them. Small fry.PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
Ok, thank you all for your advice. Very much appreciated.0
This discussion has been closed.
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