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CEL ticket - 4 days left of POPLA appeal

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Hi there,

I have read the newbies page however i couldnt see anything that might help.

I found this site late and my appeal (not the one i could have used here) as been rejected. I've been directed to POPLA.

My case in summary:

Used a CEL cark
I registered a new mobile number to make a payment and later found the payment wasn't authorised. It transpired the payment details were incorrect. (recieved a textregarding this)
I figured that out called the payment number several times (frantically) to see if i could change the card details they had. No joy as there's no option.
Tried contacting the head office several times couldn't get through - they were closed.
Spoke to main reception of head office the following day to provide the infomation. Can't make the payment the day after.
I contacted CEL via email asking for audit information. record of phone calls, time etc
Sent my appeal including evidence and was rejected.

My question:

My appeal email may have messed things up for me. as i'm conscious of putting info up on the site. If anyone has time could you view my email privately.

I have 4 days left of the 28 days Popla appeal time. Yea i messed up.

Let me know if i've missed anything.
«13

Comments

  • Umkomaas
    Umkomaas Posts: 41,357 Forumite
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    The NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #3 provides you with template appeal points to copy and paste and build into a winning POPLA appeal.

    Also do a forum search on (CEL POPLA) and look at recent POPLA appeals, which all win, because CEL pull out when they see a forum-based appeal.

    It's easy.
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .

    I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.

    Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street
  • nosferatu1001
    nosferatu1001 Posts: 12,961 Forumite
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    Given youve already sent them your appeal, precisely what are you worried about showing here?

    We need to know exactly what you put. If you dont do that, you cant be helped.
  • The_Deep
    The_Deep Posts: 16,830 Forumite
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    [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences. [/FONT]


    [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Parking Eye, Smart and a smaller company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (who take hundreds of these cases to court, and nearly always lose), who have also been reported to the regulatory authority. [/FONT]


    [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the HofC recently.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41[/FONT]


    [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind most of these companies may well be put out of business by Christmas.[/FONT]
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
  • twinkle13
    twinkle13 Posts: 17 Forumite
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    thanks for responding. I have an update i received a notice to owner.

    So, to explain, i used a parking space thought i paid however my the details were incorrect. I then received a text to say the payment was unauthorised, it also said i should call the number back to pay. Which i did a hour or so later. I called 6 times and started to pay for another time slot but couldn't change my card details still. I left a contact message on CEL customer service and left a voicemail. Had no response then called the following day. Argued with the csutomer service woman because there was no way to correct my card details; she couldn't provide with an answer as to how and you apparently can't pay the day after, then was told to speak to CEL.

    Email them copied of the call audit, my calls the text's sent explained the situation and was rejected as by there book i didn't follow the terms.

    My issue is now that i sent all this info to CEL and from my understanding i have pretty much confirmed who was driving at the time. Although, I did not literally say it. Can i still contest this ticket consider all of the shenanigans already?

    I wanted to appeal to POPLA but the options didn't fit my situation.

    What can i do now?
  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 37,655 Forumite
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    Last Friday afternoon, yes a whole week ago, you were given good advice.

    That was to search for a CEL PoPLA appeal, there are literally hundreds here, and send one.

    Have you done that? Clearly not!

    You were also asked to post your original appeal here.
    You didn't do that either.

    A whole week wasted.

    What date do you reckon your PoPLA appeal is due by?


    Tell us more about this 'notice to owner' you have received.
    Who sent it?
    What does it say?
  • Fruitcake
    Fruitcake Posts: 58,251 Forumite
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    You appeal using all the template points available to you from post 3 of the NEWBIES.

    Post your draft here for checking before you submit it.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister. :D
    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 131,777 Forumite
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    Can i still contest this ticket consider all of the shenanigans already?

    Of course, who cares about what happened? Where do you see any CEL one we've lost at POPLA?

    Never.

    It's a huge shame you said who was driving (learn for next time NOT to do that!) but it's not terrible.

    No poster here has ever had to pay CEL, not even if they lose at POPLA because of saying who the driver was, and not even if they get a court claim (all discontinued when defended well).
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • twinkle13
    twinkle13 Posts: 17 Forumite
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    Fruitcake wrote: »
    You appeal using all the template points available to you from post 3 of the NEWBIES.

    Post your draft here for checking before you submit it.


    Thanks for the response. I'll follow your recommendation. Appreciate the effort.
  • twinkle13
    twinkle13 Posts: 17 Forumite
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    Coupon-mad wrote: »
    Of course, who cares about what happened? Where do you see any CEL one we've lost at POPLA?

    Never.

    It's a huge shame you said who was driving (learn for next time NOT to do that!) but it's not terrible.

    No poster here has ever had to pay CEL, not even if they lose at POPLA because of saying who the driver was, and not even if they get a court claim (all discontinued when defended well).

    Thanks for the response. I'll follow your recommendation. Appreciate the effort.
  • twinkle13
    twinkle13 Posts: 17 Forumite
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    Hi Guys,

    Here is the letter i'd like to send. I'm not certain if i should include the 'landonwer authority' section or not.

    Thanks for your advance and time.

    In the County Court Business Centre
    Claim Number XXX Between:
    Civil Enforcement Limited (Claimant) v XXX (Defendant)





    Defence Statement




    I am XXX, the Defendant in this matter and the registered keeper of vehicle XXX. I currently reside at XXX.


    I deny I am liable to the Claimant for the entirety of the claim on the following grounds, any of which are fatal to the Claimant!!!8217;s case:
    1. The Claim Form issued on the 30th January 2018 by Civil Enforcement Limited was not correctly filed under The Practice Direction as it was not signed by a legal person. The claim does not have a valid signature and is not a statement of truth. It states that it has been issued by !!!8220;Civil Enforcement Limited!!!8221; as the Claimant!!!8217;s Legal Representative. Practice Direction 22 requires that a statement of case on behalf of a company must be signed by a person holding a senior position and state the position. If the party is legally represented, the legal representative may sign the statement of truth but in his own name and not that of his firm or employer.

    2. This Claimant has not complied with pre-court protocol. And as an example as to why this prevents a full defence being filed at this time, a parking charge can be for trespass, breach of contract or a contractual charge. All these are treated differently in law and require a different defence. The wording of any contract will naturally be a key element in this matter, and a copy of the alleged contract has never been provided to the Defendant.


    a) There was no compliant !!!8216;Letter before County Court Claim!!!8217;, under the Practice Direction.


    b) This is a speculative serial litigant, issuing a large number of identical 'draft particulars'. The badly mail-merged documents contain very little information.


    c) The Schedule of information is sparse of detailed information.


    d) The Claim Form Particulars were extremely sparse and divulged no cause of action nor sufficient detail. The Defendant has no idea what the claim is about - why the charge arose, what the alleged contract was; nothing that could be considered a fair exchange of information.

    The Claim Form Particulars did not contain any evidence of contravention or photographs. These documents, and the !!!8216;Letter before County Court Claim!!!8217; should have been produced, pursuant to paragraph 6 of the Practice Direction !!!8211; Pre Action Conduct. This constitutes a deliberate attempt to thwart any efforts to defend the claim or to !!!8220;take stock!!!8221;, pursuant to paragraph 12 of the Practice Direction. Again, this totally contradicts the guidance outlined in the new Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (2017), the aims of which are:
    i. !!!8216;early engagement and communication between the parties, including early exchange of sufficient information about the matter to help clarify whether there are any issues in dispute
    ii. enable the parties to resolve the matter without the need to start court proceedings, including agreeing a reasonable repayment plan or considering using an Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR) procedure
    iii. encourage the parties to act in a reasonable and proportionate manner in all dealings with one another (for example, avoiding running up costs which do not bear a reasonable relationship to the sums in issue) and
    iv. support the efficient management of proceedings that cannot be avoided.!!!8217;



    e) The additional particulars of claim are signed purportedly by Ashley Cohen, Mr Cohen was reported to sign off witness statements under London Councils POPLA on behalf of landowners, for CEL POPLA cases falsely stating authority. It is submitted that he is a director of another company, Bemrose Mobile Limited which supplies the pay by phone payment methods for parking. Mr Cohen was a former director of Creative Contracts Ltd but has since resigned. Mr Cohen is therefore put to strict proof the capacity and authority he has in signing such statements.


    f) The Defence therefore asks the Court to strike out the claim as having no reasonable prospect of success as currently drafted.


    g) Alternatively, the Defendant asks that the Claimant is required to file Particulars which comply with Practice Directions and include at least the following information;
    (i) Whether the matter is being brought for trespass, breach of contract or a contractual charge, and an explanation as to the exact nature of the charge
    (ii) A copy of any contract it is alleged was in place (e.g. copies of signage)
    (iii) How any contract was concluded (if by performance, then copies of signage maps in place at the time)
    (iv) Whether keeper liability is being claimed, and if so copies of any Notice to Driver / Notice to Keeper
    (v) Whether the Claimant is acting as Agent or Principal, together with a list of documents they will rely on in this matter
    (vi) If charges over and above the initial charge are being claimed, the basis on which this is being claimed
    (vii) If Interest charges are being claimed, the basis on which this is being claimed


    h) Once these Particulars have been filed, the Defendant asks for reasonable time to file another defence.


    3. The Claimant failed to meet the Notice to Keeper obligations of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (!!!8220;POFA 2012!!!8221;). Such a notice was not served within 14 days of the parking event and when the notice was served, did not fully comply with statutory wording. The Claimant is therefore unable to hold me liable under the strict !!!8216;keeper liability!!!8217; provisions:


    The Claimant did not comply with POFA 2012 and give the registered keeper opportunity at any point to identify the driver. A Notice to Keeper can be served by ordinary post and the Protection of Freedoms Act requires that the Notice, to be valid, must be delivered no later than 14 days after the vehicle was parked. No ticket was left on the windscreen and no notice to keeper was sent within the 14 days required to comply with POFA 2012 only a speculative invoice entitled !!!8220;Parking Charge Notice!!!8221; which was sent outside of the 14 day period, which did not comply with POFA 2012. This would exclude the registered keeper being liable for any charges.



    4. This case can be distinguished from ParkingEye v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67 (the Beavis case) which was dependent upon an undenied contract, formed by unusually prominent signage forming a clear offer and which turned on unique facts regarding the location and the interests of the landowner. Strict compliance with the BPA Code of Practice (CoP) was paramount and Mr Beavis was the driver who saw the signs and entered into a contract to pay £85 after exceeding a licence to park free. None of this applies in this material case.

    5. In the absence of any proof of adequate signage that contractually bound the Defendant then there can have been no contract and the Claimant has no case.


    a) The Claimant is put to strict proof that at the time of the alleged event they had both advertisement consent and the permission from the site owner to display the signs.


    b) In the absence of strict proof I submit that the Claimant was committing an offence by displaying their signs and therefore no contract could have been entered into between the driver and the Claimant.


    c) Inadequate signs incapable of binding the driver - this distinguishes this case from the Beavis case:
    (i) Sporadic and illegible (charge not prominent nor large lettering) of site/entrance signage - breach of the POFA 2012 Schedule 4 and the BPA Code of Practice and no contract formed to pay any clearly stated sum.
    (ii) Non existent ANPR 'data use' signage - breach of ICO rules and the BPA Code of Practice.
    (iii) It is believed the signage was not lit and any terms were not transparent or legible; this is an unfair contract, not agreed by the driver and contrary to the Consumer Rights Act 2015 in requiring a huge inflated sum as 'compensation' from by an authorised party using the premises as intended.
    (iv) No promise was made by the driver that could constitute consideration because there was no offer known nor accepted. No consideration flowed from the Claimant.
    (v) The signs are believed to have no mention of any debt collection additional charge, which cannot form part of any alleged contract.


    d) BPA CoP breaches - this distinguishes this case from the Beavis case:
    (i) the signs were not compliant in terms of the font size, lighting or positioning.
    (ii) the sum pursued exceeds £100. (mine currently stands at £100 - !!!8220;received a PCN reminder!!!8221; stating this)
    (iii) there is / was no compliant landowner contract.

    6. No standing - this distinguishes this case from the Beavis case:
    It is believed Civil Enforcement do not hold a legitimate contract at this car park. As an agent, the Claimant has no legal right to bring such a claim in their name which should be in the name of the landowner.

    7. The Beavis case confirmed the fact that, if it is a matter of trespass (not breach of any contract), a parking firm has no standing as a non-landowner to pursue even nominal damages.


    8. The charge is an unenforceable penalty based upon a lack of commercial justification. The Beavis case confirmed that the penalty rule is certainly engaged in any case of a private parking charge and was only disengaged due to the unique circumstances of that case, which do not resemble this claim.


    The Defendant denies any liability whatsoever to the Claimant in any matter and asks the Court to note that the Claimant has:


    a) failed to disclose any cause of action in the incorrectly filed Claim Form issued on 30th January 2018. (not certain of this date due to misplacing the original letter - I got this date from the!!!8221;response to representations letter)


    b) Sent a template, well-known to be generic cut and paste 'Particulars' of claim relying on irrelevant case law (Beavis) which ignores the fact that this Claimant cannot hold registered keepers liable in law, due to their own choice of non-POFA documentation.


    c) failed to issue a compliant notice to keeper within 14 days under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 such that Claimant is unable to hold me liable under the strict !!!8216;keeper liability!!!8217; provisions.

    The vague Particulars of Claim disclose no clear cause of action. The court is invited to strike out the claim of its own volition as having no merit and no reasonable prospects of success.

    I confirm that the above facts and statements are true to the best of my knowledge and recollection.


    Signed XXX
    Date XXX
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