Appealing a fair fine?

_Omc_ · 21 September 2019 at 2:48PM

Hello all,

Sorry, I did read the newbie thread and various others, and I'm hesitant to start a new thread for this, but here we are.

I just received a NTK through the post, for exceeding the maximum period at a retail park about 12 days ago, from ECP. Parking is free for 3 hours and could have been extended by an hour, which would have covered the time, if my car reg was entered at a machine as I left the cinema. However, we simply forgot; it was only our second cinema visit, I'd done it last time and the machine simply said "£0.00 to pay", this time we were talking about the movie we'd just seen and simply didn't think to enter my VRN as we went past when we knew there was nothing to pay (a mistake, not to be made again).

I was about to post the "I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle" template from the Newbie thread verbatim onto their online appeals site (even leaving in the PDT bit though I know it's ANPR), but trying to find threads seem to suggest this is pointless as ECP will reject and then POPLA will reject also as they're PoFA compliant, not late, clearly signed, etc.

So, I thought to complain to the retail park owners about the lack of clarity, but I will essentially be admitting that we didn't follow the process we knew about as we'd done it last time. Is that shooting myself in the foot when it comes to appealing, or does that not matter given the appeal seems likely to fail anyway? Or should I maintain that the process was followed and can they prove it wasn't a machine malfunction, coz I have bank transactions for the cinema (didn't keep ticket from back then, oddly)? Or should I just skip the entire process completely and just prepare to throw away letters from ECP forever?

(I have already left "feedback" for the cinema regarding how this £100 fee will put me off ever returning, without specifying the details of me not entering the code, not sure that'll do anything but why not.)

Any advice greatly appreciated, thank you for your time.

fisherjim · 21 September 2019 at 3:27PM

Forget all that rambling tripe send the blue appeal as is, yes it will be rejected, but will get you a POPLA code.

The newbies thread has been compiled from years of experience and your personal experiences don't really matter, and how on earth does anyone know unless you tell them that you have been there before?

Oh and it's not a "fine", it's a speculative invoice, and £100 is not a "fair" price to pay for a small overstay is it?

The_Deep · 22 September 2019 at 8:56AM

A £100 for a ten minute overstay is far from "fair", I could mug an OAP for that.

Why are you calling it a fine? It is an invoice from an ex-clamper for recompense for the harm they allege you have caused them, aka a scam.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies

Coupon-mad · 23 September 2019 at 1:12AM

I thought to complain to the retail park owners about the lack of clarity,

Yep

but I will essentially be admitting that we didn't follow the process we knew about as we'd done it last time.

No, you don't mention last time.

You simply talk about how horrified you are to be penalised for an extortionate £100 and can they step in and cancel this charge and review the placement of the suppose keypad which drivers who have been to see an absorbing film, may overlook.

You do this complaint WELL BEFORE any appeal (you have 28 days to appeal - loads of time to get it cancelled).

_Omc_ · 15 October 2019 at 10:33PM

Hello! I tracked down my login to update this, just in case anyone in a similar predicament finds this post in the future.

I appealed on the website, provided a screenshot of the bank payment to the cinema, and didn't explicitly state that I entered my registration, but definitely didn't say I hadn't, and just generally queried why I'd received this notice in a vaguely indignant manner.

I recently received a response essentially saying that I had been sent the notice correctly as I'd overstayed without payment or notification of patronage, but they'd let me off, but wouldn't if they had a second notice for the same address. Done.

Coupon-mad · 15 October 2019 at 11:39PM

OK that's good to know, thanks for updating the thread with your success!

Appealing a fair fine?

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