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Likelihood of success with POPLA appeal
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Rudedog
Posts: 9 Forumite
Hello! I received a PCN from NCP for overstaying by 12 minutes. I appealed, explaining that my 6 year old who is under the bowel and bladder service for sudden urgency of urination needed the toilet just as I had put the children in their car seats. We had to return to the shopping centre to use the toilet. Whilst there, I repeatedly tried to top up my parking using the RingGo app but kept getting an ‘error’ message. I continued to try until I reached the car, again secured kids in car seats and left. I did not have any other method of payment- I use the car park frequently and have never had an issue with the app. My question is is it worth appealing to POPLA? I don’t want to have to pay £100 instead of £60 if my chances are low. It just feels very unfair given the circumstances. Many thanks for your time, I realise the experts here get hundreds of these queries.
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The crystal ball we have has been returned to the manufactures as the mists do not clear, we have not a clue. POPLA is not based on mitigating circumstances. You need to put points of law, i:e signs not readable, grace periods, disability rights etc.0
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If you are asking for a steer on those points winning at Popla then no chance
But read up on popla appeals in the newbies FAQ thread, construct yours and put it up for comments before sending it.
And losing at Popla doesn't mean that you have to then pay!0 -
download and read the BPA CoP , january 2018, especially read clause #13
ask yourself if they failed to stick to clause #13
construct a popla appeal with clause #13 as the number 1) item (grace periods , one before , one after)
add no contract, signage issues etc onto this popla appeal as well as grace periods
it should win on grace periods alone
also email the BPA AOS team with a copy of the NTK and a copy of the refusal, and say that NCP are yet again in breach of clause #13 because they failed the overstay time allowed as there are 2 periods of time, one before , one after. ask the BPA to sanction NCP for this continuing practice which is making a mockery of their CoP
forget about what happened on the day, its not relevant at all
legal points will win this case, probably at popla0 -
Thank you, that’s really helpful.0
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Clause #13 has no mention of a grace period ‘before’ though that would have been used buying a ticket presumably. NCP’s grace period ‘after’ is 10 minutes so I was still 2 minutes over. :mad:0
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Clause #13 has no mention of a grace period ‘before’ though that would have been used buying a ticket presumably. NCP’s grace period ‘after’ is 10 minutes so I was still 2 minutes over. :mad:
Clause 13.2 and 13.4 of the BPA CoP cover the 'before' and 'after' ten minute periods respectively:13.2 If the parking location is one where parking is normally permitted, you must allow the driver a reasonable grace period in addition to the parking event before enforcement action is taken. In such instances the grace period must be a minimum of 10 minutes.13.4 You should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the private car park after the parking contract has ended, before you take enforcement action. If the location is one where parking is normally permitted, the Grace Period at the end of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes.0 -
Both of those sound like ‘after’ to me, the same thing written in different ways? Besides, could they not argue that it is the ‘after’ period that is beyond the 10 minutes grace as I was Phptographed leaving 12 minutes after the ticket expiration? Thanks again for you help with this.0
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Google Kelvin Reynolds grace periods BPA operators.
This has all been said before. There is a 'before and after time'; read the BPA article you find when you do that Google search, telling you that 'observation period' is separate, and it talks about the time taking longer, for reasons including a disability.
Yes it is if you do it properly like all the other POPLA grace periods Equality Act threads (search this forum - not a Google search this time).My question is is it worth appealing to POPLA? I don’t want to have to pay £100 instead of £60 if my chances are low.
What on earth makes you think anyone here pays, just because they might lose at POPLA? You do not then have to pay!
If this went to court (after a rare POPLA loss) in any case, your son meets the definition of disability in the Equality Act 2010, meaning he has 'protected characteristics'. This means the retail park had to allow a reasonable adjustment added to the usual grace period offered to people without protected characteristics.
But POPLA do not consider EA arguments because they don't understand them.
A court would! And a retailer would, as well!
So, put the POPLA appeal on the back burner (the code lasts 32 days, please don't reply telling me it only lasts 28, please don't. It lasts 32, believe us!).
And complain to the retail park and/or the Store Managers this coming week, and press the Equality Act issue.
The retail park are guilty of disability discrimination (whether you like that term used to refer to your little lad's medical condition or not, it's true in law), because they are liable for the illegal actions of the parking firm.
Come back and tell us in a week, how the complaints go. It should be cancelled, no POPLA needed. You may need to speak to the managing agents of the entire retail park (most have a website with a phone number 'contact us').PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
It's always so frustrating that expert advice from seasoned regulars gets questioned....... and then further questioned/argued.
I tend to give it once. Take it or leave it, I'm just too busy to 'beg' people to believe me!Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .
I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.
Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street0
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