*Update* - Grumpy creditors and lack of CCA's

Jules

I have been in a DMP with CCCS for 4 years now and up until recently things were going well. I got made redundant in Feb, and I had to reduce my CCCS payments due to a reduction of income and now I am having trouble with some of my creditors and wondering if sending CCA requests would do any good.

Moorcroft are ringing constantly every day, usually the 1st call comes at 8.12am and they continue until the evening. I screen these calls and don't answer as I won't confirm my details to someone who rings me!
They have been sending threatening letters saying that they would be sending a Home Collections Officer to my door and I think he was at my door on Thursday, thankfully my hubby had the sense not to answer it. I can't say for sure that it was them but this person only called at my house in the street.
I got another letter yesterday saying that they have no option but to take me to court if I don't make a suitable arrangement with the collections officer. I already pay what I can through the CCCS.

I'm also having problems with the Lewis Group (CL Finance) and they have started adding a £12 collections charge onto my account each month and as my payment is currently reduced to £5 it means my debt is now rising.

Barclaycard rang me last week and asked me to confirm my DOB, I told her I wouldn't confirm any details as I didn't know who she was, she went on to tell me that in that case she couldn't discuss anything with me!! I said fine, you rang me I don't have anything to discuss with you and hung up, so they have now handed my account to Mercers (their inhouse DCA's).

What a nightmare this week has been, it never rains but it pours, thank goodness there's no post on a Sunday.

Would it do any good to send these DCA's a CCA request? I don't want to make things worse but at the minute I can't see that they could be any worse!!

I'm sure the rest of my creditors will follow suit shortly (I have 10 accounts with 7 creditors), but I have kept them all informed at every stage (and there have been plenty of stages this last couple of months) and even tried to do full and final settlements when I got made redundant to no avail, so I paid off my mortgage instead.

I wouldn't normally let this get to me but I dread tomorrow as I know the phone will start again and who knows what the postie will bring.

Thanks
Jules

10past6

Hi Jules

Try not to let them get to you, they will try I know, but it's a game of whose the strongest.

OK, as for moorcroft, yes, request your CCA, I had problems with Moorcroft where they really became a pain in the butt, I requested my CCA, as they could not produce it, they sent my debt back to the OC and closed my a/c.

As regards threats re doorstep visits, send this:

Your address

Date

Creditor / DCA address

Please be advised that I am only prepared to communicate with XXXXXXXXX in writing. OFT rules and regulations clearly state that you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you.

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; e.g. the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.).

Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives, to visit me at my property and if you persist in sending "doorstep callers" to my home, you will be reported for harassment and be liable for damages for a tort of trespass.

You would also be liable for conspiring in a tort of trespass by acting in defiance of my instructions and sending someone to visit me nevertheless.

Should it be necessary, I will obtain an injunction

ONLY INITIAL - NEVER SIGN


As for your creditors contacting you directly, send this letter:


Your Address

DAC / Creditor's Address

Date

Ref A/C xxxxxxxx

On the top of your letter state very clearly in big bold letters “FORMAL COMPLAINT”

Dear Sir / Madam

I refer to the above account, held with yourself's.

I have informed your company on numerous occasions I am experiencing financial difficulties.

I am acting in a responsible manner re my current situation, by seeking the advice from [Enter woever is managing your DMP] of this, which has fallen on deaf ears.

Due to the continued harassment I'm experiencing from your company, I have taken advice from the OFT, I am informed your company is in breach of the following guidelines:

Deceptive and / Or Unfair Methods.

2.8 Examples of unfair practices as follows:

C: Refusing to deal with appointed or authorised appointed third parties, such as, Citizens Advice Bureau, Independent Advice Centres, or Money Advisor's.

Contacting debtors directly and bypassing their appointed representatives.

I have informed your company, that (give the name of the organisation and account number of whose managing your DMP), is my authorised third party appointed representative.

If I do not receive a satisfactory reply to my complaint from your company within 7 working days, from the date of this letter, I reserve the right to refer my complaint to the OFT for adjudication.

ONLY INITIAL - NEVER SIGN

As for recieving telephone calls, send this letter:

Your address

Company Name
Dear Sirs
Harassment by telephone
Account Number: XXXXXXX
I am writing in relation to the quantity and frequency of telephone calls that I have received from your company, which I deem to be personally harassing.
I have verbally requested that these stop, but I am still receiving calls. (Delete if necessary)
I now require all further correspondence from your company to be made in writing only.
I am of the view that your continued harassment of me by telephone puts you in breach of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act 1970, and the Protection from Harassment Act 1997.
If you continue to harass me by telephone, you will also be in breach of the Communications Act (2003) s.127 and I will report you to OFCOM, Trading Standards and The Office of Fair Trading, meaning that you will be liable to a substantial fine.
Be advised that any further telephone calls from your company will be recorded. (**Even if you don‘t yet have recording equipment!!**)
I request confirmation that my telephone details have beem removed from your databases.

Yours faithfully,

[NAME HERE] ONLY INITIAL, NEVER SIGN THE LETTER!!

Send all letters by RECORDED DELIVERY

Jules

Brilliant, thank you very much.
I'm typing the letters now to send off.

You are quite right it is a game of who is the strongest and up until now that probably was me, but I think they are getting the upper hand at the minute.

Thanks
Jules

10past6

Jules wrote: »

I think they are getting the upper hand at the minute.

Only if you allow them to

Very important, no matter how many letters you send to the same creditor / DCA, make sure you send them all INDIVIDUALLY, otherwise, you have no proof which letter they received.

I know it's expensive to send recorded letters when you're on a budget, but it may well pay dividends in the long run, and don't forget to ask for your CCA

Remember, when you ask for your CCA, this puts your a/c into dispute, so no one should be calling you until it's resolved.

If you do receive calls, inform them your a/c is in dispute, most people who call are from a call centre working under targets, so may well not be aware in the early stages your a/c is in dispute.

Jules

10past6 wrote: »

Very important, no matter how many letters you send to the same creditor / DCA, make sure you send them all INDIVIDUALLY, otherwise, you have no proof which letter they received.

I know it's expensive to send recorded letters when you're on a budget, but it may well pay dividends in the long run, and don't forget to ask for your CCA

Good point, looks like Moorcroft will be getting quite a bit of mail from me this week as I have 3 accounts with them, so far I have 3 x CCA's, 3 x Telephone harassment and 3 x the collections caller letters ready to go. Will send them all recorded tomorrow.

Thanks
Jules

10past6

Jules wrote: »

Good point, looks like Moorcroft will be getting quite a bit of mail from me this week as I have 3 accounts with them, so far I have 3 x CCA's, 3 x Telephone harassment and 3 x the collections caller letters ready to go. Will send them all recorded tomorrow.

Thanks
Jules

Your welcome, remember keep a diary, if any of your Creditors / DCA's break any of the guidelines, YOU MUST REPORT THEM.

There's not much more than can do to you.

I'll bet the letters from Moorcroft are from their pre whatever division

Pity Moorcroft don't have a pre "Were learning the OFT Guidelines Division"

Jules

Just a quick update.
Moorcroft received 8 of my 9 letters this morning and so far today I haven't had any phone calls, :j so that's definitely a start.
Let's hope its not just coincidence.

I have also sent off CCA's to Mercers and CL Finance today so will see what happens. I have just decided it's time to get tough with these people and play them at their own game!

Many thanks for your help and advice 10past6 it was much needed and very much appreciated. :beer:

Jules

Zinfandel_2

Sorry I am a bit thick. LOL What is a CCA?
I am in dispute with Moorcroft at the moment. They say I owe them £118.00. I say I only owe them £18.00. They say they added 2 x £50.00 fees for late payments by request from 02, but I don't remember this? It is actually an 02 debt. I rang 02 who said they have never added any fees on. Moorcroft are now threatening me with legal action. What shall I do?

Jules

Zinfandel wrote: »

Sorry I am a bit thick. LOL What is a CCA?
I am in dispute with Moorcroft at the moment. They say I owe them £118.00. I say I only owe them £18.00. They say they added 2 x £50.00 fees for late payments by request from 02, but I don't remember this? It is actually an 02 debt. I rang 02 who said they have never added any fees on. Moorcroft are now threatening me with legal action. What shall I do?

A CCA is Consumer Credit Agreement and we are asking for copies of these. Not sure if it applies to mobile phone contracts but if you start your own thread someone should know.
Good Luck

Jules

Jules

I am trying to keep track of things and thought the best plan was to do it here - I'm useless with bits of paper - tend to lose them.

Tue 17th June
Posted 9 letters Recorded Delivery to Moorcroft
Received and signed for on 18th June

Wed 18th June
Posted CCA requests to Mercers and one to CL Finance
Received and signed for on 19th June

On Sat 29th June I received a letter from Moorcroft in relation to my 9 letters (skin flints couldn't reply individually) and included a copy of their complaints procedure!!! Mmmm might need that!
They also noted that I will receive no further telephone contact! Yipee!!!!!!

They say
"........we are continuing to seek to obtain a copy of the CCA's that you have requested..... and confirm that at this stage the account has been placed on hold and that we will not seek to enforce the debt until such time as an agreement is obtained."

On Sat 5th July I received a copy of the CCA for one of the debts and they even returned one of my postal orders - how kind!

I have just received my statement from Barclaycard and my account it would seem has been passed back to them from Mercers (that was quick) and they are now happy to accept my £5 payment although they are charging interest. Can they do this (charge interest) now that the account is technically in dispute and no CCA has been produced yet? Just a thought.

I also have my statement from CL Finance and they too are happy to accept my £5 payment. The cheeky so and so’s did use my £1 cheque that I sent for the CCA as payment towards my account and haven’t even mentioned the CCA request!

I'm well beyond the 12+2 now for the 2 Moorcroft, Barclaycard and CL Finance but do I sit back and wait until the additional 30 days pass or send off another letter to them now?

All help gratefully received
Thanks
Jules

RAS

Jules

Wow, this looks promising.

First off, di you check that the CCA you recieved is actually a CCA and not some bit of paper that says it is one? A lot of application fomrs say they are a CCA.

Secondly. It is 12 working days, plus 2 days, so do the calculations on that to work out when they went into default.

There are then two options:

1. Send a 12+2 default letter. If this incudes a DPA section advising them that they may not pass your details to anytone else, it may prevent them selling the debt on. Or give you something really powerful to complain about if they do sell it on.

2. Wait until 30 calender days after the default day and send the 12+2+30 bogoff not paying any more letter.

I am assuming that you already have defaults on all these debts in your credit record? If so, at this point you can stop paying them anything. If you do not have a default, you need to weight up paying them to keep you credit record clean and using the absence of the CCa to bargain, or taking the rap if they post a default on your credit record.