personal pension transfer to stakeholder?

EdInvestor

Did you read in the press today that the FSA might be looking at the sale of SIPPs as they are concerned that they could be the next miss selling scandal.?

It's not the FSA that is supposedly worried about SIPPs being the next misselling scandal - it's the life companies.

They are attempting to stoke these fears because so much pension business is going out of their coffers and into SIPPs.

Quite understandable - normal business practice. :rolleyes:

I hate to mention this, but have you noticed how being regulated doesn't really help?
Anyone who had any experience of Equitable Life is well aware of that.

Being regulated is no guarantee of anything at all, sad to say.

dunstonh

Surely an ifa worth his salt would have produced a documented report ?
This is my first experience of ifa's.

It depends on how seriously they were taking your enquiry. I issue all my reports pre-sale but I won't do it until we get to a stage where I believe the business is almost certainly going to proceed by one means or another. Otherwise, I would be going through plastic binders and reams of paper like no tomorrow. Also, the report contains fund information and if the enquiry hasnt got to that stage, it would be hard to produce it. The regulatory requirement is that the report has to be issued within 10 days after the sale of the product (some exceptions to that but thats the general rule). My view is that its better to have the report in advance and have all pros and cons discussed. (plus my research software leads me into the report after the research is done so its easy to do all of it in one go).

I'll still be paid commission whichever fund you choose, it is how the industry is now" certainly left me feeling that I wasted my time.

IFAs have to recommend the funds. It's not your job. Tied agents are not allowed to recommend funds, you have to choose them. Either you have seen an IFA who has recently been a tied agent and hasnt got used to being an IFA yet or you are seeing a multi-tied agent who is pretending to be an IFA. Either way that service is not good enough.

IFAs get a fairly bad treatment on this site which I think is overdone and can be quite annoying, however I find it a hundred times more annoying when I read about IFAs who had been asked to perform the most basic of functions and cant do it. Its not that they give bad advice but cant just give advice!

There is an anti IFA brigade on this board, Ed being one of them, as you probably guessed. Strangely the tied advisors don't get that. I agree with whiteflag 100%.

If the IFA cannot give advice, it means they are not confident in what they are recommending. Sure, there are times when you can go many different ways but you can still narrow things down. i.e. with pensions, I will ask questions about the preference of the individual to have the cheapest option available or whether they want access to externally managed funds which may offer greater potential over the long term? or whether they will be actively managing, want me to actively manage it or really just intend to leave it where it is, plus others. Questions like that will easily narrow down personal pensions, stakeholders or SIPPs.

IFAs are just like shops. You get some cheap ones, some expensive ones, some good ones and some poor ones. Its hard to tell often what one wil be like until you go through it.

Being regulated is no guarantee of anything at all, sad to say

Yeah, its better to get advice from Ed, a "money mail" reader who thinks he knows everything and is totally negative towards financial services companies and has an agenda against them. Oh, and when it goes wrong, you can sue Ed.

EdInvestor

dunstonh wrote:

There is an anti IFA brigade on this board, Ed being one of them.

Not so. Good IFAs (if you can find them) can be very useful people indeed, as I know personally

IFAs are just like shops. You get some cheap ones, some expensive ones, some good ones and some poor ones. Its hard to tell often what one wil be like until you go through it.

Quite agree with this. There is a lack of basic standards in the IFA industry (I won't go so far as to say "profession") which is probably due to the origins of most of its practitioners as insurance salesman.It's made worse by the fact that they are selling products which many people find difficult to understand and monitor and worse still by the fact that the advisors are paid by the insurance companies, not the clients (though the clients get billed in the end).Thus the client has no real control and the advisor feels no real responsibility.This is quite different from the relationship between a client and his solicitor - or even his estate agent.

Yeah, its better to get advice from Ed, a "money mail" reader who thinks he knows everything and is totally negative towards financial services companies and has an agenda against them. Oh, and when it goes wrong, you can sue Ed.

I don't give "advice" and nor does anyone else on this board.If readers want regulated "advice", they should go to a regulated salesperson such as an IFA, and then if the advice is wrong, they can sue him.The approach of this board is to assist readers to save money by going the unregulated DIY route.

I am not totally negative towards all financial services companies. I can think of quite a few which display customer friendly behaviour - internet banks, quite a few mortgage providers, companies like Nationwide which pursue ethical policies, execution only brokers and SIPP providers are just a few examples. Credit where it's due.

Pity there are not more insurance companies on the list.

dunstonh

Thus the client has no real control and the advisor feels no real responsibility.This is quite different from the relationship between a client and his solicitor - or even his estate agent.

As an IFA that is financially responsible for the advice I give, I disagree with that. If i was to do a mis-sale and compensation become due, I have to pay the first £4500 out of my own pocket before my liability cover kicks in. A better statement would be to say that some advisors are not responsible for their advice as their employer takes care of any compensation. However, I have known a few tied agents who have lost their jobs because of that and once you have a complaints record, its very hard to get another job because of it (depending on severity). Complaints now follow you whereas in the past, they did not. Those that act as if they are not responsible, will get found out sooner or later.

I am not totally negative towards all financial services companies. I can think of quite a few which display customer friendly behaviour - internet banks, quite a few mortgage providers, companies like Nationwide which pursue ethical policies, execution only brokers and SIPP providers are just a few examples. Credit where it's due.

Pity there are not more insurance companies on the list.

What is your experience of these companies? I place at least one proposal a day, usually more, with companies. I service a heck of a lot more. There are some pretty poor companies or some very good ones. Some are good in one area but rubbish in another. However, i can base my comments on experience. What experience of these companies do you have?

EdInvestor

Some are good in one area but rubbish in another. However, i can base my comments on experience. What experience of these companies do you have?

My experience is as a customer/investor, like most people on this board.Our experience may be different from that of an industry person such as yourself.

Take insurance companies, for instance.They regard the IFA as their customer, not the actual investor. Thus it's almost impossible to get any sense out of them if you go direct - you must go through an IFA.

Possibly IFAs are not aware of the frustration and irritation this causes to people who are otherwise perfectly capable of competently dealing with their financial affairs ( sometimes at a rather higher level than the IFA they are required to employ!)

By comparison, most execution-only providers, whether IFAs, brokers or SIPP providers, are a beacon of efficiency, clarity and pleasant service. I'm sure that's why once people go down the DIY route, they never go back: the difference can sometimes be quite amazing.

dunstonh

Take insurance companies, for instance.They regard the IFA as their customer, not the actual investor. Thus it's almost impossible to get any sense out of them if you go direct - you must go through an IFA.

That is incorrect with most insurance companies nowadays. However, the IFA may get a lot better service out of that insurance company than the policyholder. For example, Norwich Union serviceline for IFAs is in the UK. Policyholders will usually end up in India.

Possibly IFAs are not aware of the frustration and irritation this causes to people who are otherwise perfectly capable of competently dealing with their financial affairs ( sometimes at a rather higher level than the IFA they are required to employ!)

If they used an IFA to place the business, then why are they contacting the insurance company anyway? If they contact the IFA, then they will service it for free. Unless, it was fee based advice, in which case, servicing may be chargeable as well.

By comparison, most execution-only providers, whether IFAs, brokers or SIPP providers, are a beacon of efficiency, clarity and pleasant service. I'm sure that's why once people go down the DIY route, they never go back: the difference can sometimes be quite amazing.

Depends on what service you want. If you want to sit in front of a computer and do it, then fine. It may be a regional thing, but here in North Suffolk/Norfolk, the home visit is still the most requested appointment, not an appt in the office. I even get clients who bake a cake when I pop in for an update because they appreciate the service (one regular drops in fruit and veg). Different people want different service and will rate the service they get differently based on their needs.

hinchy

Would like to thank all of you, this lively " discussion" has thrown up lots of nuggets .
I will be fully armed with questions and know what I should expect from the next ifa I see will .I'll certainly will check their credentials and whether they are tied for e.g..
and enquire into SIPPS. etc.
.
(hope you 're all still friends).