Employer asking for doctors letter when sick note produced

snails's_pace

Hi all,
Im asking this on behalf of a good friend of mine and I've tried to research online first but can't find anything relevant to my question, so thought I'd ask my friends on here

Ok, my friend has torn the lateral ligaments in her ankle (last sunday), and is in a lot pain, can't walk on it and it's very swollen and bruised. Anyway, hospital made the diagnosis last sunday , went to her GP on Monday, who said yes it's very nasty indeed and it'll be a good few months before you run any marathons. GP gave her a sick note for 1 week off of work, to be reviewed today in time for next week. Her employer basically swore at her down the phone and said the office can't afford to lose a member of staff for tihs amount of time and he has been giving her grief about when she's returning.
Today she went back to gp who said you'll need another week off of work as it is still very bad and the foot needs to be kept up on the sofa,so another sicknote produced. She rung employer to apologise for the inconvenience of having another week off and that her friend (me ) would drop the sicknote through the office door over the weekend. Employer says its not good enough and has requested the gp to contact him direct with a letter or phone call to say that staying at home would be better for my friends health than going into work! I couldn't believe it.
Basically her employer wants her in the office with her foot up in the air answering the phones which he says would be no different than staying at home!
What I'm trying to find out is ...is a sick note sufficient evidence that someone isn't well enough to work and would the employer be unreasonable to ask her to come in to work when she's signed off?
He has been harassing her all week but bear in mind my friend has had 2 sick days in 22 months, and has never had a sicknote before.

sorry for the long winded post, I've tried looking online under employment law but can't seem to find anything,

many thanks snails x

snails's_pace

anyone?

elona

The sick note is evidence in itself and your friend should not be pestered while she is off sick.

I would be tempted to point out that if she was bullied into doing something that adversely affected her health she would sue!

Is she in a union?

snails's_pace

elona wrote: »

The sick note is evidence in itself and your friend should not be pestered while she is off sick.

I would be tempted to point out that if she was bullied into doing something that adversely affected her health she would sue!

Is she in a union?

thankyou elona, i don't think she is in a union although I shall check this out with her tomorrow

dawnybabes

Also if she goes into work whilst off sick the comany and her aren't insured. Years ago I dislocated my knee and my boss insisted I stay at home till the pot was off as he couldn't run the risk of me not being able to get oout quickly in case of fire. I had full pay for 4 months - twas great !

snails's_pace

dawnybabes wrote: »

Also if she goes into work whilst off sick the comany and her aren't insured. Years ago I dislocated my knee and my boss insisted I stay at home till the pot was off as he couldn't run the risk of me not being able to get oout quickly in case of fire. I had full pay for 4 months - twas great !

ouch..dislocated knee, very painful!
my friends company have already told her she will be on ssp, which is their right of course.

mymatebob

If your friend has a "sick note" then that is the end of it.

What is it that the employers want? Some sort of "proof" that your friend is incapacitated?

The employer has no right to speak to the GP in this instance.
If a doctor has decided that your friend is unfit for work then so be it.
The employer should not be putting any pressure on your friend to return to work.
If this goes any further then your friend may be looking at harassment.

snails's_pace

mymatebob wrote: »

If your friend has a "sick note" then that is the end of it.

What is it that the employers want? Some sort of "proof" that your friend is incapacitated?

The employer has no right to speak to the GP in this instance.
If a doctor has decided that your friend is unfit for work then so be it.
The employer should not be putting any pressure on your friend to return to work.
If this goes any further then your friend may be looking at harassment.

thanks bob

Sugar_Coated_Owl

Yep the sick note itself is satisfactory. I can't believe how mean your friends boss is being :mad:

FamilyHistoryMad

Hi, OP

I told my oh about your message and he has some advice to offer.

Hi there (oh here). Sorry about how long this will be, but a few points to cover.

As others have posted, the sick note is the end of the story. The employer has no right to request contact with the doctor in this manner. If it's part of the company's sick policy, they may write to the doctor to get a better understanding of the incapacity - but the employee will have access to all information provided (but see policy issue below).

The company's absence policy is crucial to this. They should have a policy detailing what course of action they will take in situations like this (and the important point is that the policy will cover "long-term absence". Each company has it's own definition of this -but a week off will not be what's in the policy if they have one. Most policies will start the long-term procedure after at least 4 weeks. Also relevant is their policy on level of absence, but if your friend has only had a couple of days in two years, then this shouldn't be an issue). The policy should detail at what point in an absence the company will write to the doctor, but this won't be after a week of being off. Reasonableness is the key.

Health & safety. The employer has a duty of care to it's employees. The employer cannot guarantee that if there is an emergency, they can evacuate the employee in a safe and timely manner. The question of insurance also crops up. If you are signed off sick, the employer should not accept you in the workplace (their liability insurance will normally be invalidated if they knowingly have an employee in the workplace who is signed off sick). Also, if you are signed off with specific instructions to keep the leg up (as you would in a case like this), any journey to/from work has the potential to either cause additional damage or extend the recovery period.

So if you're signed off sick, the employer simply cannot insist you attend work.

If they're verbally abusing your friend to return to work, then you're looking at harassment at the very least. There is no excuse or defense for this. As laborious as this sounds, I suggest your friend documents the frequency and detail of the conversations she has with her boss (going back to their absence policy, it should also cover frequency of communication between employer and employee - if the boss is exceeding this, then that and the nature of the exchange is the basis for a claim of bullying and harassment). The starting position here is bullying - the manager wants the employee back at work and is using offensive behavior to try and achieve this end - this is bullying. If this continues, I recommend your friend submits a grievance at the very least. It may need to go further.

I would understand if your friend is concerned about keeping her job, but she should not worry. If the employer attempts to dismiss her because of her absence, they will have to make sure they abide by the terms of their policies to the letter, otherwise they'll get in to very hot water at an employment tribunal. If your friend is only off for a few weeks, then unless their policy (if they have one) is very, very strict, then there is nothing to worry about - honestly.

If you want more info, try https://www.acas.org.uk who are the governments arbitration and conciliation service who are there to help resolve disputes and can offer decent employment law advice (and no, I don't work for them).

Good luck

snails's_pace

wow:j:j

thankyou so much familyhistorymad , that is very useful indeed, i shall let my friend read this tomorrow and also let you know any updates on the situation,
again,thankyou for taking the time to put together such an informative post

snails