natwest cannot loacte credit agreement

bridget81

received a letter from natwest saying they are still trying to locate agreement and they have requested an off site office to look for it where they are stored, but they did this in february and wrote back to say they have been advised by the relevant office they could not locate it. they must think if they ask again it will reappear!

sent stuff to onwardsman anyway so will just see what happens

homer_j_3

fermi wrote: »

If you stop paying then they will most likely default the account and register the defaults with the CRA.

Without a credit agreement it is arguable that they would not be entitled to do this, but it can be a nightmare to get the courts and/or the Information Commissioner to accept or rule on this.

Without a fully completed credit agreement that complies with the CCA 1974 rules, there is no argument to be had. No agreement, no loan.

You should maintain repayments if you are able to because its one less thing to worry about whilst you are trying to sort this mess out.

If they cannot locate the agreement then you do not owe the money and not only that, you are entitled to all the money you have paid to the loan if it was regulated under CCA 1974.

bridget81

thank-you for that information, i really appreciate it.

i have and will ocntinue to pay the loans, the loan is regulated byt eh CCA 1974 - its documented on the original loan agreement, BUT i have no way of knowing if the recalculated loan is, it was 14 months after original loan and i have never seen a copy.

if it is and i am entitled to a refund, can natwest not argue as the original loan with the PPI that i do have a credit agreement for was paid off with the second loan that i do not have an agreement for. so how would it work?

dont want anyone to think i am disputing tha i owe the money as i am not, just want to pay what i am supposed to and not a penny more!

thanks again for all your help:beer:

homer_j_3

This is the issue bridget81. You could be paying more or less than what they have agreed.

I find it very difficult in todays world for a bank to lose a copy of the agreement as its usually computerised and your copy scanned into electronic filing.

bridget81

:T thank-you for your advise Homer-j. i have also read your thread, didnt know if i was meant to comment or not, so didnt in case i wasnt supposed to! But it is very good and very helpful. Thank-you :T

As for my loan i am just going to wait and see what happens with the onwardsman now. But i'm getting quite frustrated with natwest as 4 months have now passed since my original request, at this rate the loan term will have ended before it gets sorted out!

does anyone know how the onwardsman work? do they have a timescale? never done anything like this before.

Thanks again :beer:

homer_j_3

No comment away on the thread.

Do you mean the ombudsman? The ombudsman is a mediation resolution type of organisation. I believe the easiest way to explain what they do is:

They will investigate the complaint by looking at first of all

What the companies procedures were at that time.

Then how those procedures stood against the rules at the time

Then work out whether any retrospective guidance has been issued by the FSA and then make a ruling.

Their main purpose is to put the consumer back in the position that they would have been had the errors not occurred. They are not there to offer compensation over and above the error and nor are they there to get involved with commercial decisions of lenders.

The ombudsman process can be lengthy but their time relies on the lenders times also as they request information to them etc. If they need more info, they go back.

I have read on here that its taken 9 months from start to finish.

bridget81

I received a letter from onbudsman (always spell it wrong!) stating they have received my information, but will deal with it as soon as they can as they have a backlog.

i have also called natwest as not heard from them for 2 weeks. They advised they are still waiting for off-site dept who keep agreements to locate my CCA and get back to them. Although she did say it is not looking hopeful as she has still not had a response. I did state i received a letter in feb from another advisor saying the off-sure office had told her they could not locate it. SHe then stated they also had to request and they basically start their investigation again from scratch.

I asked what would then happen, she said she is in the process of getting copy statements to go through figures and hopefully answer some of my questions that way ie why have payments and term gone up.

I asked what would happen if they could not find it, she did not answer but went onto state that each agreement has to be passed onto a senior manager to be signed off (gave me the impression she thinks i'm lying) but if i am convinced i did not sign and cannot recall doing so, and they cannot locate it then was there one signed or not.

still even if she does answer my questions and can expalin the payment increase and term increase, am i still within my rights to sit tight and wait for copy agreement if one exists?

she also told me that the bank do not hold 'notes on systems' for back when my loan was taken out as they do not keep them that long. does anyone know if this is true? it was back end of 2005.

i have told her i have referred it onto onbusman as she asked me, so i didnt see a reason to lie, hoped it might get them into gear a bit more!

dont really know what else i can do now other than just carry on waiting.

Any advice will be greatly appreciated as i'm starting to feel a little angry at them time it is taking :mad:

Thanks again

fermi

homer_j wrote: »

Without a fully completed credit agreement that complies with the CCA 1974 rules, there is no argument to be had. No agreement, no loan.

I agree. It should be an 'open and shut' case.

In practice the Information Commissioner's Office has been very inconsistent in enforcing the removal of defaults in these cases. But they do seem to be doing a bit better recently.

bridget81

over the last few days i've had loads of missed calls from an 020 number, so i presumed it was natwest customer relations as thats how theirs starts. I called them up but it wasnt them, but the lady said she was going to phon me anyway.
She advised she has now got my bank statements but has asked me to fax her a copy of the original loan agreement so she can see actual figures. I have already enclosed these within the loan.
i said ok, but then thinking about it, why should i? surely they can locate that one as i do have a copy, but if i dont send it can they cay i am being obstructive?
oh what to do... i dont have access to a fax machine and dont really want to send such personal data from work..

any ideas?
and why would they want it if i have already given them the figures?

thanks again

bridget81

can anyone advise me whether i should send a copy of the loan agreement i have to the bank as they verbally requested?

thanks