The Adversarial Consumer Society In Practice - Who's side are you on? Blog Discussion

biglugs

I accept Mr Cavells comments absolutely - there can't ever be any excuse for calling up and being abusive to call centre staff - they're just doing their job like the rest of us. If you have a complaint take it to the top in writing - and you're more likely to get a positive result too.
However companies now have to accept that in the web world news travels fantastically fast. In future anyone considering offers online will have to think very carefully about both the up-side and the down-side. This probably means that there will be fewer special deals around, or that eligibility criteria will have to be more tightly controlled.
It amazes me how little understanding there appears to be in the Marketing and IT departments of what are often HUGE companies! Businesses will happily spend tens of millions on glitzy TV advertising campaigns, but not a few tens of thousands on making sure their next promotion is well thought out and properly planned. And when it goes wrong it's the frontline staff who get the abuse.

I take advantage of "loopholes" or bad marketing like most MSErs, but if I get caught out and have orders cancelled etc. I like to take it with good grace and move on.

bridiej

elvis_bloggs wrote:

When I ordered my 9 pence a ream paper and free radio I never once mentioned MSE......so.......I'm not to blame for that e-mail, not guilty m'lud.

Actually, how does he know for a fact that these people are MSErs?

Personally if I've ever gone for a bargain I wouldnt dream of mentioned MSE in case I jinx it or something and they withdraw the offer!

I agree that there is no excuse for rudeness to call centre staff and also that there is quite a bit of greed on the side of some MSE members.

But I would certainly be interested to know how exactly he knows that said rude people are members of the site?!

bs7

bridiej wrote:

Actually, how does he know for a fact that these people are MSErs?

Exactly. It's also not as if any of these codes are exclusive - they send out their catalogues indiscriminately.

You just have to look at the number of topics dealing with free stuff and viking direct on the newsgroups to see MSE isn't the only place circulating the codes with those people lucky enough not to be on Viking Direct's mailing list - http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&c2coff=1&q=%22viking+direct%22+%2B+free&safe=off&qt_s=Search

patchwork_cat

I do agree that there are some people who really do abuse loopholes and so they close up and everyone suffers. Some greedy people do mean that loopholes change quicker than they need to and people miss out.

Last years La redoute being case in point and I also wonder about Tesco and the beef.

There are an awful lot of guests also who abuse these offers, but I suppose that there will always be some selfish people who ruin it for the rest of us. Sometimes my faith in human nature is seriously tried.

No doubt I will be blasted for putting forward my opinion.

bylromarha

No blasting at all.

I just want to point you back to Martins reply...and thats the theory I go by too...as little profit as possible if the loopholes are out there. I don't know what the La Redoute problem was, but know that I have taken full advantage of the Tesco/Beef offer (which some may call a loophole) without remorse.

DesG

I must say I'm impressed with the MD's attitude. It is a refreshing change to have an honest discussion of the situation, rather than the usual lawyers threats that a lot of other big companies would resort to.

Viking Direct, you have my custom.

Cheers, Des.

The_Bhoy_3

bridiej wrote:

Actually, how does he know for a fact that these people are MSErs?

I'd imagine that when CS told certain people that they couldn't have the freebies that they countered with "but I know other people have gotten it" or "I've read that I am entitled to it". I don't think it's that much of a leap to take from this that the people had heard of the promotion through MSE, especially if many of them were buying exactly the same [cheapest] item in order to qualify.

On another note, I don't think there is anything wrong with the way Mr.Cavell has written his e-mail. Yes, he has used colloquial language, but I think that that is a good thing as it helps readers to empathise with his position. Additionally, I am impressed with his attitude with regards to the way promotions have been taken advantage of: in effect, I interpret him to be saying "fair enough, it was my own fault for not closing all the loopholes, but in the future I will make sure I do". This is the opposite of the way LX Direct handled the discount code fiasco. If I remember correctly, did they not send letters to people who had used code they weren't entitled after the fact asking for payment of the extra money?

As for staff being abused, anyone that thinks doing that will help their position is a complete moron. In a similar vein, I don't think that the comment suggesting the staff need more training is a particularly fair one since, no matter how much training some people have, they will always be the sort of person that gets upset in confrontational situations.

shieldsy

I'm on the side of the MD. I love MSE but am often dismayed by the amount of people who talk of creating new email addresses in order to get "new customer" discounts, or using voucher codes intended for business users, or even just telling lies to claim discounts etc

This is just dishonesty & stealing.

The same root problem with a lot of businesses is the same root problem with a lot of MSE's (and people in general of course) ... greed. And could be the undoing of MSE in the long run.

nearlyrich

However I do have a problem with my staff being abused by MSE readers demanding their ‘right’ to free stuff in the most extreme terms. I have people in tears tonight. Sod the thousands of pounds we’ve given away to people who are not interested in us: what bothers me is my people are in the firing line."


I am very impressed with the guy, he obviously cares about his staff. No-one should have to take abuse in their workplace.

I tried to get the latest deal but failed due to the website being overloaded at the time, I didn't even think to ring up and complain.

biglugs

I love MSE but am often dismayed by the amount of people who talk of creating new email addresses in order to get "new customer" discounts

People do this for a very good reason - because they can, and because companies want us to! Companies like to think they are setting up really clever promotions, and Sales Directors like to report to the board that they have signed up millions of "new" customers. We know, and the Sales directors know, that this is a load of rubbish and what they've done is sign up the same customers millions of times!
The secret is not to let the Board know
If Finance Directors and CEOs thought a little bit more, and questioned what the hell their companies are doing online, or spent some time actually learning to use computers, then we would all be in trouble because they might seriously consider spending money on decent IT staff to close the loopholes, rather than p***poor marketing staff who just invent them! IMO