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Barclays - good customer/bad customer?
BarclaysBunk
Posts: 1 Newbie
We applied for a mortgage with Woolwich on 31st March this year. The application was conducted by telephone and we were told that our application was classed as being Fast Track. We provided all the info that was requested at the time and our sales advisor conducted an affordability test, and a credit scoring, which we passed. A couple of days later, we received a hardcopy of our application by post.
We returned this, along with all the documents that had been requested, by return of post and in turn, these were returned to us a day or so later. A couple of days after that, we were sent a letter by Barclays solicitors who asked us to sign and return the mortgage deed as soon as possible. We were informed that they anticapted that we would receive our mortgage offer from Barclays/Woolwich "shortly".
A couple of days later, we received a letter from our current mortgage lender, who had provided a mortgage redemption firgure and date for Woolwich/Barlays. We had no reason to believe that completion would not take place as per the paperwork, on Friday 18th April, although it seemed a little odd that the mortgage offer letter had not yet arrived.
We contacted our sales advisor to ask when we could expect to receive this as we could not complete without it. He was completely baffled and had no response for us. To cut a very long story short, it subsequently transpires that on 9th April, Barclays processing team had tried to contact us but were unable to get through (presumably by telephone). It was also suggested that a message was left with the sales advisor, although upon closer scrutiny, this turned out to be a colleague of the sales advisor as our own advisor was not actually at work at the time of their call as he was working a later shift that day. The long and the short of it is that we did not receive any message asking us to to provide any additional information. To date, this remains the case. It was only because we happened to ring our advisor on 15th April, to ask where the mortgage offer was, that we became aware of any potential problem.
Also on the 15th, we sent a formal letter of complaint to Barclays on the basis that Barclays had failed to provide us with information material to our mortgage application, compounded by the fact that when we telephoned our advisor, he was also unable to provide any insight as to what had gone wrong. (He has worked magnificently for us since day one and we believe he is as hampered by Barclays inadequate means to communicate in the same way we have been).
To date, (20th April) we have not received a response to that complaint. We spoke to our advisor again on 17th April; and also to a lady in the processing department, who managed to make matters somewhat worse by being rude to us. In essence, she informed us that the processing department had tried to get through to us. She was quite clear that any failure to do so was not their fault. We felt this response to be unhelpful as we were not seeking to apportion blame, only to understand what had gone wrong and how it may be put right. This lady did not want to help us, so we had no choice but to go back to our sales advisor, who after an equal amount of difficulty communicating with the underwriter, informed us - verbally - that the original mortgage application had been altered (significantly), in that the reserve facility that ws on offer had been withdrawn. We were also told that proof of income was now required, along with my husband's pension details and 3 months' bank statements (hardcopy), although none of these things were originally required.
No explanation was given, either by our sales advisor (as he did not know) or by the underwriter to him, as to why there was a change in condtions being made. As we felt this to be wrong, we have challenged it, except in order to do so, one must make a complaint - another one, to another department. It makes little sense to us that in order for a customer to resolve any concerns, that the only way to do so is by instigating a formal complaint, when all we require is to be able to speak to someone or have someone from Barclays contct us, in order to resolve these problems.
Does anyone reading this, have any idea as to how customers can apply for a Fast Track mortgage and be informed that they have been accepted in principle, and receive all the paperwork indicating that the mortgage is proceeding, to then discover by accident that it is not progressing and that the terms of their original application have been altered, so that what they applied for is not now being offered?
Worse still, is that no-one from Barclays appears to be willing, or even able, to talk to us to try to resolve this. How is it that we can be told that our income is sufficient and that we have passed the affordability test; when it would appear that Barclays underwriter has decided otherwise - but has offered no reason as to why?
Because we know that our income is sufficient (as it has already passed Barclays affordability test) and that as our income is derived from a company pension, it is about as rock-solid a form of income as one could wish for, we are puzzled, confused and more than a little frustrated with Barclays for their stance. We were so determined to "prove" that we are good customers that we even paid to obtain our own individual credit score as evidence of our creditworthiness. We did this as we could think of no possible reason why the underwriter has decided to withdraw the reserve that was on offer to us and thought that it may be possible that something negative was in our credit files. Except the opposite is true - both our ratings are excellent.
No-one at Barclays has yet appeared willing to assume responsibility for this predicament we now find ourselves in in. It is surely wrong that Barclays informs its customers they qualify for something and proceeds to instruct the solicitors to act on their behalf, only for the underwriter to decide otherwise - and all, without informing us.
We did not especially want to complain; all we want is for someone to talk to us, to tell us how it is that Barclays can say yes, followed by no, and then fail to notify us of any changes which may affect us. How can it be that a customer can have an excellent credit profile and a guaranteed income and this be the "reason" for the underwriter reducing the mortgage offer? This quite simply does not make sense.
At the time of application (for a mortgage term of 14 years), when we provided our ages on the telephone and in writing afterwards, we informed Barlcays that applicant one, me, is 46 and applicant 2, my husband, is 64. We were told that as my age is lower than my husband's that this would offset any potential age restrictions of my husband. The underwriter appears to have now suggested that because of my husband's age, additional proof of income etc is required, although this supersedes the requirements of a Fast Track mortgage. The sales advisor challenged the underwriter by pointing out that his guidelines told him to take both ages into account - and the underwriter says he was wrong to do this. If Barclays own guidelines say one thing and the underwriter says the opposite, it will cause conflict as both cannot be correct. It also places the sales advisors in a vulnerable position as they will unwittingly be responsible for wrongly assessing customers, resulting in the kind of sitaution we are in right now.
We believe that Barlcays should honour the original mortgage offer in principle to us as a gesture of goodwill if only for the problems we have been caused.
If anyone has any tips as to how to get through to Barclays, or how to challenge a decision that was first given and then had restrictive caveats placed upon it, we would be very grateful.
We returned this, along with all the documents that had been requested, by return of post and in turn, these were returned to us a day or so later. A couple of days after that, we were sent a letter by Barclays solicitors who asked us to sign and return the mortgage deed as soon as possible. We were informed that they anticapted that we would receive our mortgage offer from Barclays/Woolwich "shortly".
A couple of days later, we received a letter from our current mortgage lender, who had provided a mortgage redemption firgure and date for Woolwich/Barlays. We had no reason to believe that completion would not take place as per the paperwork, on Friday 18th April, although it seemed a little odd that the mortgage offer letter had not yet arrived.
We contacted our sales advisor to ask when we could expect to receive this as we could not complete without it. He was completely baffled and had no response for us. To cut a very long story short, it subsequently transpires that on 9th April, Barclays processing team had tried to contact us but were unable to get through (presumably by telephone). It was also suggested that a message was left with the sales advisor, although upon closer scrutiny, this turned out to be a colleague of the sales advisor as our own advisor was not actually at work at the time of their call as he was working a later shift that day. The long and the short of it is that we did not receive any message asking us to to provide any additional information. To date, this remains the case. It was only because we happened to ring our advisor on 15th April, to ask where the mortgage offer was, that we became aware of any potential problem.
Also on the 15th, we sent a formal letter of complaint to Barclays on the basis that Barclays had failed to provide us with information material to our mortgage application, compounded by the fact that when we telephoned our advisor, he was also unable to provide any insight as to what had gone wrong. (He has worked magnificently for us since day one and we believe he is as hampered by Barclays inadequate means to communicate in the same way we have been).
To date, (20th April) we have not received a response to that complaint. We spoke to our advisor again on 17th April; and also to a lady in the processing department, who managed to make matters somewhat worse by being rude to us. In essence, she informed us that the processing department had tried to get through to us. She was quite clear that any failure to do so was not their fault. We felt this response to be unhelpful as we were not seeking to apportion blame, only to understand what had gone wrong and how it may be put right. This lady did not want to help us, so we had no choice but to go back to our sales advisor, who after an equal amount of difficulty communicating with the underwriter, informed us - verbally - that the original mortgage application had been altered (significantly), in that the reserve facility that ws on offer had been withdrawn. We were also told that proof of income was now required, along with my husband's pension details and 3 months' bank statements (hardcopy), although none of these things were originally required.
No explanation was given, either by our sales advisor (as he did not know) or by the underwriter to him, as to why there was a change in condtions being made. As we felt this to be wrong, we have challenged it, except in order to do so, one must make a complaint - another one, to another department. It makes little sense to us that in order for a customer to resolve any concerns, that the only way to do so is by instigating a formal complaint, when all we require is to be able to speak to someone or have someone from Barclays contct us, in order to resolve these problems.
Does anyone reading this, have any idea as to how customers can apply for a Fast Track mortgage and be informed that they have been accepted in principle, and receive all the paperwork indicating that the mortgage is proceeding, to then discover by accident that it is not progressing and that the terms of their original application have been altered, so that what they applied for is not now being offered?
Worse still, is that no-one from Barclays appears to be willing, or even able, to talk to us to try to resolve this. How is it that we can be told that our income is sufficient and that we have passed the affordability test; when it would appear that Barclays underwriter has decided otherwise - but has offered no reason as to why?
Because we know that our income is sufficient (as it has already passed Barclays affordability test) and that as our income is derived from a company pension, it is about as rock-solid a form of income as one could wish for, we are puzzled, confused and more than a little frustrated with Barclays for their stance. We were so determined to "prove" that we are good customers that we even paid to obtain our own individual credit score as evidence of our creditworthiness. We did this as we could think of no possible reason why the underwriter has decided to withdraw the reserve that was on offer to us and thought that it may be possible that something negative was in our credit files. Except the opposite is true - both our ratings are excellent.
No-one at Barclays has yet appeared willing to assume responsibility for this predicament we now find ourselves in in. It is surely wrong that Barclays informs its customers they qualify for something and proceeds to instruct the solicitors to act on their behalf, only for the underwriter to decide otherwise - and all, without informing us.
We did not especially want to complain; all we want is for someone to talk to us, to tell us how it is that Barclays can say yes, followed by no, and then fail to notify us of any changes which may affect us. How can it be that a customer can have an excellent credit profile and a guaranteed income and this be the "reason" for the underwriter reducing the mortgage offer? This quite simply does not make sense.
At the time of application (for a mortgage term of 14 years), when we provided our ages on the telephone and in writing afterwards, we informed Barlcays that applicant one, me, is 46 and applicant 2, my husband, is 64. We were told that as my age is lower than my husband's that this would offset any potential age restrictions of my husband. The underwriter appears to have now suggested that because of my husband's age, additional proof of income etc is required, although this supersedes the requirements of a Fast Track mortgage. The sales advisor challenged the underwriter by pointing out that his guidelines told him to take both ages into account - and the underwriter says he was wrong to do this. If Barclays own guidelines say one thing and the underwriter says the opposite, it will cause conflict as both cannot be correct. It also places the sales advisors in a vulnerable position as they will unwittingly be responsible for wrongly assessing customers, resulting in the kind of sitaution we are in right now.
We believe that Barlcays should honour the original mortgage offer in principle to us as a gesture of goodwill if only for the problems we have been caused.
If anyone has any tips as to how to get through to Barclays, or how to challenge a decision that was first given and then had restrictive caveats placed upon it, we would be very grateful.
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Comments
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Can you summarise what you actually need to know please? That is a very long post!!Gone ... or have I?0
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The original decision was merely 'in principle' and without documents being sighted. In my opinion, it is perfectly reasonable to ask for proof of income. Failure to do so has led to a lot of trouble for banks! So far as "getting through", if the tone of your post is anything to go by (and I appreciate it might not be, as you may be unused to this kind of forum), perhaps if you are less aggressive/combative in your dealings, you might get a friendlier response. To instigate two complaints while still trying to get the mortgage is a very odd way of going about things!Mortgage started on 22.5.09 : £129,600Overpayments to date: £3000June grocery challenge: 400/6000
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BarclaysBunk wrote: »Also on the 15th, we sent a formal letter of complaint to Barclays on the basis that Barclays had failed to provide us with information material to our mortgage application...
To date, (20th April) we have not received a response to that complaint. We spoke to our advisor again on 17th April; and also to a lady in the processing department, who managed to make matters somewhat worse by being rude to us. In essence, she informed us that the processing department had tried to get through to us. She was quite clear that any failure to do so was not their fault. We felt this response to be unhelpful as we were not seeking to apportion blame, only to understand what had gone wrong and how it may be put right. This lady did not want to help us.
I think in the current financial market, you would be wise not to make a formal complaint until everything is signed, sealed and delivered. You have to appreciate that the people working for Barclays are only human and if they have someone formally complaining after they did their best to contact you, I would also be inclined to withdraw your application.
If the shoe was on the other foot and you were the person working for Barclays and you had someone on the phone complaining after your company did everything they could make contact, I'm sure you too would be annoyed.
Perhaps you should just put this down to experience.
I hope you find another company willing to accommodate your needs.
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we had a very similar experience a couple of years ago. Like you, had it not been for our Sales Adviser we would have been completely stuck, in our case it tooks weeks for a pre-approved mortgage to be approved by the underwriters, unfortunately in the meantime we had reduced our offer (survey found problems) and needed to borrow less. No way could the underwriters cope with this. We got a hamper of goodies as an apology. We got a second hamper when the underwriters made some further mistakes but for some reason my brain can not recall the exact problem which prompted the second hamper, but my mother-in-law loved the pot-pourri!
Not much help but at least you know you are not alone.
We do have a woolwich/barclays mortgage and (as others on these boards have noted) we got a letter a couple of weeks back saying that the reserve would be dropped to £250 unless we told them otherwise AND that if we didn't arrange a new figure now in future they would charge £100 to re-arrange the reserve (I should say the £250/£100 figures are from memory and in reality they could have been slightly different, so I hope all those people with faultless memories won't jump down my throat). I think just about everybody on these boards wrote back and said they wanted to keep the reserve as it was!
Barclays must be trying to rebalance their books, they must have to provide some kind of finance to service all these reserves, just in case everyone wakes up one morning and decided to write cheques for the whole amount of their reserves!!!!!
My guess is you were caught out by Barclays changing a general policy. There are others out there who have lost houses/chains because of this, and not just because of Barclays, or so I understand.If anything I say starts to make sense, PANIC!0 -
The problem seems to stem from a breakdown in communications within your Financial Advisor's own office - a message was left for him/her by Barclays with a work colleague, and it appears this may not have been passed on to your advisor. This does not explain the change in the conditions of the mortgage that Barclays wants to makes, but does explain the delay."You were only supposed to blow the bl**dy doors off!!"0
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Maninthestreet
the sales adviser works for barclays (sorry Barlcaysbunk if stepping on your shoes) we are talking about one office in barclays not talking to another office in barclays.If anything I say starts to make sense, PANIC!0 -
Lenders can ask for proof regardless of what method you use. Whether it is fast track, self cert or whatever.
A decisions in principle is nothing. Its an indication that at that very moment in time they will lend you the money if you what you have said turns out to be correct. It will not take into account any change of criteria that may happen in the future. Changes that have been happening weekly, if not daily at times.I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). The comments I make are just my opinion and are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice and you should not treat them as such. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.0
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