'Have you ever cheated the taxman?' Poll results/discussion

Former_MSE_Lawrence

Poll started 25 March 2008: Have you ever cheated the taxman?

Have you ever not declared earnings, left money in a hidden account, or not paid tax when you should? It is of course a crime, and being cracked down on ever more harshly. How widespread is tax evasion?

Which is the closest to your situation? Over your life have you knowingly:

1. Undeclared/Hidden substantial sums (£10,000s) [FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]4% (214 votes)[/FONT]
2. Undeclared/Hidden big sums (£1,000s) [FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif] 9% (436 votes)[/FONT]
3. Undeclared/Hidden some cash (£100s) [FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]17% (847 votes)[/FONT]
4. Undeclared/Hidden small cash (less than £100) [FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]16% (795 votes)[/FONT]
5. Nothing ever. I declare every penny [FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]53% (2600 votes)[/FONT]

Voting has now ended, but you can still click 'post reply' to discuss below.

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MagicBurd29

You're inviting MSE members to admit to a crime, in public?

What happens when HMRC come knocking at MSE Towers saying "We believe you have evidence of crimes being committed, hand over your server logs" ?

And what of MSE's reputation if, say, 1000 votes are cast, only 500 of which are for option 5? Any future campaign by MSE can be shot down with "But half of all MSE members are self-confessed criminals" !

I'm struggling to see any way in which this survey is a good idea ... sorry ...

[follow-up] I voted after posting ... and am gob-smacked to see that so far, 41% of voters have confessed.

A la House MD: WHAT ARE YOU THINKING, PEOPLE?? You want them to say "41% of MSE Members are idiots!" ?

:huh:

whitesofmyeyes

earwig1928 wrote: »

You're inviting MSE members to admit to a crime, in public?

What happens when HMRC come knocking at MSE Towers saying "We believe you have evidence of crimes being committed, hand over your server logs" ?

:huh:

HMRC Don't have the time to pick up on a poll get a court order for server logs so then can trace people who said they have cheated what would that prove?

I doubt any Judge would give them a court order on that results of an internet poll.

They would then have to get investigate those who voted yes,it isn't going to happen .

jessc_2001

earwig has a point of course... we all know that some people are naive enough to believe that "Big Brother" won't knock on MSE towers' door and say "evidence of crime etc... we must hunt them down" and here's a "court order" to prove we're serious Obviously, the answer would be not to commit the crime in the first place... but then I'm enough of a realist to know that this will not deter some people... sad but true

teddyco

See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil...........

MagicBurd29

whitesofmyeyes wrote: »

HMRC Don't have the time to pick up on a poll get a court order ... They would then have to get investigate those who voted yes,it isn't going to happen .

a) do you have any idea of the amount of trouble an HMRC investigation can cause? (I have knowledge of this, one step removed thank goodness).

b) you don't think HMRC occasionally take action for the sake of being seen to act? As a deterrent, to make a point, etc?

c) look at how many have voted for >£10k - there'd be a bit of money in that

Anyway you're rather missing my main point which is about the message this gives out about the attitude of MSE and MSE members to tax avoidance/evasion. The mention of "it's a crime" does little to offset this message, I suggest.

It's tantamount to being seen to condone avoidance/evasion.

Far better to report and comment on someone else's representative survey.

Frugaldom

I am finding this entire subject a complete and utter joke! First of all, I'd like to remind people that tax evasion is completely different from tax avoidance. The former is ILLEGAL and the latter is, supposedly, the 'norm' by way of selective purchasing, tax free savings and legitimate investments. (Apparently, the richer you arem the finer the line between the two and it's seen by many as the job of their accountant to keep it legal.) However, it is naiive to think that 'the tax man' and various other 'fraud investigation services' do not read forums.

Has everyone forgotten about RIP? (The Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act.)

Has everyone forgotten that anyone can claim about £1000 for pinpointing benefits cheats?

Have you any idea how many thousands of pounds website companies/owners could generate through disclosing user details to the relevant authorities? They aren't breaking any data protection rules, as far as I am aware, if they can justify it by suspecting a crime. (Benefits fraud and tax evasion are both crimes.)

Here is how you COULD envisage a newspaper headline going on the current voting trend:

45% OF MSE USERS ARE CRIMINALS

In a recent poll carried out on behalf of TV personality and money mogul Martin Lewis, 45% of respondents on his Moneysavingexper.com website openly admitted to criminal activity...

or perhaps, elsewhere,

55% OF MSE USERS ARE HONEST

In a recent poll carried out on behalf of TV personality and money mogul Martin Lewis, 55% of respondents on his Moneysavingexpert.com website openly admitted paying every penny due to the taxman...

It's sometimes called spin, it's sometimes called sensationalising, it's maybe even just a publicity stunt drawing attention to a site and it's users. It's probably going on all the time...

PLEASE NOTE THAT THE ABOVE IS NOT AN ACTUAL HEADLINE nor does it in any way reflect the beliefs of the writer. It is simply an example of how certain aspects of a website and/or particular forums can be perceived and adequately demonstrates that many forum users do not fully appreciate the importance of the word 'PUBLIC' in the term 'Public Forums'. I would also like to point out that I am fully aware that, "this site asserts copyright on all comments posted on the board."

silvercar

Never believe everything you read, particluarly on an internet forum, particularly on an internet poll.

teddyco

I, my wife, my family and friends are all waiting patiently here in Maidstone for the next election so we can:

VOTE CONSERVATIVE!

Lower taxes!
Make fox hunting legal again!
Nationalize the British Rail System and get Britain moving again!
Lower petrol taxes!
Fix all the pot holes in 90% of our roads!
Make foreign Lorry drivers qualify to drive on British roads!
Make the NHS mostly private!
Scrap the pre-war, out-of-date car tax!
Folks who claim state benefits must qualify every 6 month's to show that they are still unfit to work. Incentivize disability payments to get as many working again like they do in the USA.
Get rid of the sham that is the child benefits program! Lowering taxes for everyone benefits everyone equally.
Scrap the TV License!
Build more airports since all the smart people really know global warming is a myth!
High Speed trains for the whole of Britain!
Scrap ASBO's and bring back National Service!
Let kids wear hoodies or anything else they want because with all the cops on the streets under Conservatives, it won't matter what they are wearing.
Make smacking legal in schools so teachers can beat the living crap out of
naughty kids once and for all!
Bring back the London Routemaster buses with conductor's, and ditch bendy buses forever!
Get out of the EU Now!
Make the English language mandatory for anyone who gets UK citizenship or works at a UK call center.
Lower corporate taxes and CGT's and scrap death taxes!
Give all police guns and teach them them how to use them!
Widen the M25 and build more roads in the UK!
Get rid of stupid, senseless Labour targets in hospitals, schools and the police forces and allow the professionals to do their jobs!

Elect Boris Johnson for London Mayor! Woo Hoo!

chuckles1066

earwig1928 wrote: »

A la House MD: WHAT ARE YOU THINKING, PEOPLE?? You want them to say "41% of MSE Members are idiots!" ?

:huh:

As low as that? I'd have put it in the high 90's

chuckles1066

whitesofmyeyes wrote: »

HMRC Don't have the time to pick up on a poll get a court order for server logs so then can trace people

Server logs don't, and can't, "trace people".

They can provide an ip address. Armed with that ip address, any authority can go to the relevant ISP and get a Court Order revealing the name and address of the bill-payer using that ip address at the time of the alleged infraction.

Note: bill-payer. Not "person sat at the pc at that time".

It's why internet actions for libel will always fail (unless the accused is very stupid and admits everything).

You will never prove who actually typed something at any given time.......so confess away to all your tax-dodging deeds