How to compare Lloyds IPS against other investements

moneybelle

Hi

I am considering using a balanced profile Lloyds Investment Portfolio Service for a cash windfall.

Could members suggest how I can compare recent performance with similar products, and non-managed funds such as index trackers. Please post the relevant links.

I have tried to do this without success.

Thanks.

dunstonh

I am considering using a balanced profile Lloyds Investment Portfolio Service for a cash windfall.

Why?

I think you are on the wrong site if you are considering that service. This is a site about getting value for money (not paying the least but getting the best value). Lloyds is neither the best or the cheapest.

Could members suggest how I can compare recent performance with similar products

You cannot as it is down to the skill of the adviser and the portfolio they build that matches you needs, your risk profile and your tax status.

moneybelle

You say it's not value for money;

how do I know that?

how do you know that?

We need evidence.

Where is it?

Show me!!

dunstonh

how do I know that?

You dont unless you ask questions and then compare.

how do you know that?

I'm an IFA. It's my job to know. Plus I have taken a number of clients on over the years who have left Lloyds service because it was too expensive, service wasnt consistent (high staff turnover) and they werent getting returns that were worth the cost.

We need evidence.

What is the estimated reduction in yield due to charges from Lloyds?
Do you require a full managed service and are willing to pay more for it or can the same be acheived cheaper utilising investment funds?
If you want a full managed service then why are you picking a bank? Why not an independent dedicated discretionary management firm?

You need to give us information about the level of service you are going to get and how much its going to cost. Then we can provide evidence of what alternatives are.

moneybelle

The money is in the bank; thats why, and they (very kindly!!) offered advice. But I don't have to take it. Now I'm doing my homework.

I've looked at some profiles of funds over the past few years on various sites and they look similar return. What I did notice was that the entry fee at 5% is twice as high as lloyds and the annual management fee 40-50% higher. So far lloyds looks good value.

I'm not sticking up for them; I want a balanced risk portfolio that performs well, but I don't want fees that make it uncompetative.

So are you saying that I cannot find out the info I asked from my first post on the web, or that you're not going to tell me.

Because unless you can show me that I would not get a good deal you have not got my attention.

You may be very good at your job, but I've had enough doctors saying 'that they've had x number of years experience and that they are a doctor and know best (puffed up with self importance) and have got it wrong to know that my own judgement is of equal importance to any expert.

Jonbvn

moneybelle,

Please understand that dunstonh is only offering his comments on your proposals. You are not his client and therefore he does not have a legal duty to answer your questions. Dunstonh is well known on this site (although sometimes he does come across as abrupt;-)) and has offered basic comments (I won't say advice) to many people. However, you are not forced to follow any comments or information offered.

In your second post you have fallen for your banks BS. You say they have "kindly" offered to provide you with financial advice. Do you think they are offering such advice from goodness of their heart? NO! It's because they want to make money out of you. An important message to learn on the MSE site is that your bank is not your friend.

Finally, I would strongly suggest that you see an IFA, rather than a salesman at your bank. For more info check out ubiased.co.uk

meester

moneybelle wrote: »

The money is in the bank; thats why, and they (very kindly!!) offered advice. But I don't have to take it. Now I'm doing my homework.

I've looked at some profiles of funds over the past few years on various sites and they look similar return. What I did notice was that the entry fee at 5% is twice as high as lloyds and the annual management fee 40-50% higher. So far lloyds looks good value.

Have a look at www.h-l.co.uk

Entry fees are 0.

I'm not sticking up for them; I want a balanced risk portfolio that performs well, but I don't want fees that make it uncompetative.

So are you saying that I cannot find out the info I asked from my first post on the web, or that you're not going to tell me.

Because unless you can show me that I would not get a good deal you have not got my attention.

You may be very good at your job, but I've had enough doctors saying 'that they've had x number of years experience and that they are a doctor and know best (puffed up with self importance) and have got it wrong to know that my own judgement is of equal importance to any expert.

You are very rude. You have come here for advice but have not provided enough information for anybody to give you a full answer. When you have received advice based on experience, you reject it and say that the answerer is clueless.

This is really not the way to go about getting free help from people.

You have not said how much you are investing, how much the fees you have been asked to pay are, what funds they are proposing, and what initial and ongoing service is being provided.

The only information I have found about the service is that it is for people with over £100k to invest.

This is a lot of money to hand to a salesman.

jamesd

Say you were to use the non-advised service provided by Hargreaves Lansdown. Initial charge would often be zero, sometimes 0.25%, occasionally a bit more. If it's ever as high as even 1% I haven't noticed a case. The annual management charge from the fund is commonly discounted by 0.25%, sometimes less, which is paid to you via their loyalty bonus system.

Now, that's with no advice. Say you want advice to help you select investments. All financial advisors will charge for this, and rather than being kind by offering advice, Lloyds were offering to sell you this service. Standard bank cross-sales pitch to make money from existing customers, nothing wrong with it.

The cost of advice and service provided varies, so it's not really possible to say what others would charge for an advised service without knowing which services you want to buy. Many competitive providers would also charge less as a percentage as the amount of money goes up (by rebating the commission to you instead of keeping it all). Or many would offer you the choice of flat rate or hourly fees if you prefer, or fees at an hourly or flat rate but commission fully refunded to you to offset the fees.

So, to answer your question, you should ideally say:

1. roughly how much you have to invest to the nearest, within 20% or so. This is because commission percentage retained often depends on total investment value and will be higher for low value investments than for high values.
2. what investment advice you want. A typical good advisor might provide:
2a. initial investment selection after discussing how much up and down movement you'd accept without losing sleep, the volatility or risk measure (the more you accept, the greater your likely long term returns).
2b annual rebalancing of the investments, a technique that has been proved to significantly increase overall returns.
2c. advice on changing investments if a fund manager changes, something that is generally believed to increase the risk of poorer than usual performance.

You should say what Lloyds will provide, though dunstonh probably has some idea, the rest of us generally don't and will be able to make more informed comments if we do know.

It's a pretty safe assumption that the deal from Lloyds can be bettered. It's routinely the case for investment services and products from high street banks and it would be exceptional if this was any different.

moneybelle

Thanks for your comments. Please see comments in red.

Jonbvn wrote: »

moneybelle,

Please understand that dunstonh is only offering his comments on your proposals. You are not his client and therefore he does not have a legal duty to answer your questions. Dunstonh is well known on this site (although sometimes he does come across as abrupt;-)) and has offered basic comments (I won't say advice) to many people. However, you are not forced to follow any comments or information offered. I realise I don't need to follow any advice. I didn't ask for any advice. All I asked was is there a comparison site on which i could look up the information. I was disappointed that dunstonh did not answer my question.

In your second post you have fallen for your banks BS. You say they have "kindly" offered to provide you with financial advice. My comment was tongue in cheek. Hence putting "kindly" in quotes with 2 exclamation marks. My mistake to think that was obvious. I am not so green to think they must be doing me a favour.Do you think they are offering such advice from goodness of their heart? NO! It's because they want to make money out of you. An important message to learn on the MSE site is that your bank is not your friend.

Finally, I would strongly suggest that you see an IFA, rather than a salesman at your bank. For more info check out ubiased.co.uk Yes I will probably do that.

moneybelle

Please see comments below in red

meester wrote: »

Have a look at www.h-l.co.uk

Entry fees are 0.



You are very rude. You have come here for advice but have not provided enough information for anybody to give you a full answer,All I wanted was to make a fair comparison using a good website. My question was not answered.

When you have received advice based on experience, you reject it and say that the answerer is clueless.
Read my posts again slowly and you will see I said no such thing.
Saying that someone is an expert and therefore their word is law does not wash. All I asked for was evidence. I want to see facts for myself.


This is really not the way to go about getting free help from people. Does this guy really need you to defend him? From the first line of his first post, I admit his attitude annoyed me.

You have not said how much you are investing, how much the fees you have been asked to pay are, what funds they are proposing, and what initial and ongoing service is being provided. Because I did not want advice, I wanted a website.

The only information I have found about the service is that it is for people with over £100k to invest.

This is a lot of money to hand to a salesman. I agree. Thats why I am doing my homework

moneybelle

jamesd wrote: »

It's a pretty safe assumption that the deal from Lloyds can be bettered. It's routinely the case for investment services and products from high street banks and it would be exceptional if this was any different.

Thank you for your carefully crafted post.

Lloyds are definately going for the relationship thing here. And its whether the cost is worth it.

I may get back to this thread with more details later.