Northern Rock End of Mortgaged Deal (Merged Threads)

enay73

Semanticist,

you have might misunderstood my post. To be honest I am not blaming anyone and also I am not blaming myself. I knew what I was doing.
Yes I am in negative equity, it's not too much but enough to remortgage somewhere else. I did take the mortgage because my mortgage broker adviced me to take NR because it was a better deal. I wanted to buy this house because I loved it and I refurbished completely and I have spent money and times because I do care about what I am doing. Not certainly to make a profit. I do buy a house for living and enjoy my life and not certainly moving from home to home to make a profit. That's not my way. These are my subjective point of view.
In the other hands, I do definately see that in UK is just about speculations and don't tell me the recession had something else to do, because I do not believe it. Almost Banks and not all of them had run out money and the system stopped in some point. I haven't got enough money and I can't lend anymore.
So tell me who is the organisation control and check the banks? Where they were, when suddenly happened??
You take out a mortgage because you as a private individual wants to buy a dream home and not just making profit. This system has collapsed because it was too much indulgent in lending criteria. This is my objective way to see things and how much I have learn it.
You shouldn't take the anger or the blame to me or with someone else. Giving an example to you I do own a house in my own country of origin and believe me things are better,my government helps people who are in difficulty and try as much they can do not let them to loose their houses. The government should help and not let them to sink. Any country have got problems and a government show how much they do care about you in these circumstances.
If you are able to see other reality, then you can see things more wise.
I am lucky to see the difference and it's disgraceful to know how people they can easily loose their jobs and then potentially for sure too loose their homes.
Also you should be realistic and see how houses market is just a speculation. If they are selling houses than a normal average then prices goes up, then if this system stops then the houses prices falls. This is a trouble for the presents and for the future.
So I should be blamed for this too? I try
I am just trying to give my point of view, I am not working in the finances but if things would be have checked before, maybe things could have been different.
Well I will be in SVR then, whatever I am using my all efforts to go through and not certainly to let someone spoil my life and my sacrifice, after a long run I should be able one day and say the house is mine. Whatever happens I will do my best. I am not blaming myself or others but the systems should be blamed for this all mess.
Also I don't believe it's just NR was in difficulty but as normal mortgage lending and savings account, had faced the most problems but banks they didn't sank like NR did but still run normal business and people perhaps in negative equity there too, they at least still have another deal after they end the actual one.
That's all. I could write thousands of sentences on here and never stop, but believe me I am not angry with anyone I am just feeling sorry because this country could be better and make people living better and have less worries in the future to loose jobs and houses. We should be more protected.

dasilva_2

semanticist wrote: »

You probably didn't think about the consequences too much because most people do not have the slightest clue about how the financial services sector works and it's easier for them to just stick their head in the sand than try and find out. (I've worked in this sector in the past. It did leave me slightly bitter.)

Very bitter if you ask me.
But that comment seems to indicate that anyone taking a mortgage out with NR was sticking their head in the sand. I actually agree that people being offered 125% should have been sceptical. I wasn't, my LTV was less than 50% and i had offers from other mainstream lenders. I picked NR after reading 'expert' opinion on the internet and looking at cost factors. My argument is now why should I be treated any differently to the customers of other lenders, that I could have borrowed from, just because NR was run by a bunch of crooks regulated by the FSA. No one has ever taken any responsibility for the downfall of NR and the only people being asked to take any liability are its customers and the taxpayer. If the financial services sector is going to be regulated it has to regulate on a level playing field and the regulator takes responsibility when thinks go wrong.
They were the ones 'sticking their heads in the sand'. Did you ever see them proclaim 'Don't take a mortgage with NR, their business plan is flawed'.

b0rker

MarkyMarkD wrote: »

...

To be honest with you Mark I only come on here because I am bored and feel that NR customers in general deserve better. I can easliy get away from NRAM if I want to as I have paid down my mortgage in the past 3 years and have about an 80% LTV.

You on the other hand come across as some kind of "Investment Banker"...

The problem with the whole sorry affiar is that if Northern Rock put their SVR up to sub prime levels then Northern Rock are making their customers pay for Northern Rocks errors.

MarkyMarkD

dasilva wrote: »

Do you really think that NR is going to make a profit?
In most of your other posts you have stated how bad NR lending strategy was.
(by the way I'm not some sort of cyber stalker, I just seem to commenting on the same threads as you)

Why would the government NOT make money out of NR? It didn't pay to nationalise the company - it simply appropriated it. It's hard not to make money out of an investment that you don't pay for, unless things are truly appalling.

The flaw in NR's lending strategy was primarily on the funding side, not anywhere else. So with free access to government-guaranteed funds (as NR has whilst in public ownership) that problem was fixed.

I have also been accused of stalking, and for the same reason. Some people are simply interested in the same threads.

dasilva wrote: »

But that comment seems to indicate that anyone taking a mortgage out with NR was sticking their head in the sand. I actually agree that people being offered 125% should have been sceptical. I wasn't, my LTV was less than 50% and i had offers from other mainstream lenders. I picked NR after reading 'expert' opinion on the internet and looking at cost factors. My argument is now why should I be treated any differently to the customers of other lenders, that I could have borrowed from, just because NR was run by a bunch of crooks regulated by the FSA. No one has ever taken any responsibility for the downfall of NR and the only people being asked to take any liability are its customers and the taxpayer. If the financial services sector is going to be regulated it has to regulate on a level playing field and the regulator takes responsibility when thinks go wrong.
They were the ones 'sticking their heads in the sand'. Did you ever see them proclaim 'Don't take a mortgage with NR, their business plan is flawed'.

I agree with most of what you say there, dasilva. But someone in your position can (I presume) freely remortgage elsewhere. Those who borrowed 125% were, like it or not, entering into a high risk transaction and should have appreciated that. There was a clear risk that they wouldn't be able to remortgage elsewhere, if house prices fell. There was a clear risk that they would have to pay SVR at some stage. And the present level of SVR - and any level they are likely to pay in the next few years - are lower than any prudent person would have allowed for in their calculations of maximum possible rates.

I agree that the FSA were woefully behind the curve in their regulation of NR. They have had to play catch-up with a vengeance, and have arguably gone too far "the other way" since as they are so fearful of another failure.

semanticist

dasilva wrote: »

My argument is now why should I be treated any differently to the customers of other lenders

You shouldn't. You should pay an interest rate that's competitive given the bank's overall levels of risk. If that's a problem then you should move it elsewhere. If no one else will give you a mortgage then that suggests that you - like me! - benefited from Northern Rock's policies which you're now railing against.

If you feel that you were given bad advice when you took out your mortgage, you might have grounds for a mis-selling complaint, but given you talk about 'expert opinion on the internet', I think you got all the advice you paid for! What did your IFA/mortgage broker advise? Ours didn't want to use Northern Rock as a first choice, which suggests that the higher risk/costs were known even before the collapse.

In any case, you seem to be taking it entirely too personally. That's really what prompted me to post in the first place - people post here as if someone from NR/NRAM decided to specifically mess up their lives just out of spite. I just can not understand that attitude.

It's not even as if you've seen any negative effects (yet!) - you can harp on about being with a 'sub-prime bank' (which doesn't even make any sense), but NRAM's SVR is reasonable at the moment and if any of us could predict the future we wouldn't be in this position!

In the end, if you can do something about your position: DO IT! And if you can't, freaking out and blaming other people for your unfortunate choices won't make riding it out any better.

(Oh, and I meant the comment about people sticking their head in the sand far more generally - people here are likely to be better than most, at least now - but most people - even smart people - hear financial services terminology and seem to go 'JARGON! JARGON!' and stop thinking. And then sign up for something random that in no way fits their needs and that they just don't understand. A large part of this is the fault of in-bank-branch affiliated financial advisers who will be pushing whatever product head office set a quota for that month, but that's no excuse for not keeping your wits about you! Same seems to go for anything people don't have direct immediate knowledge about - cars, computers, AV equipment. So many people make a killing selling expensive rubbish to people that don't need, or even want, it - at least there's the possibility of a mis-selling complaint with financial services products!)

semanticist

MarkyMarkD wrote: »

And the present level of SVR - and any level they are likely to pay in the next few years - are lower than any prudent person would have allowed for in their calculations of maximum possible rates.

The current SVR is a full two points lower than my fixed rate! It would be quite nice to be on the SVR right now for me.

I still think that buying this house (our first purchase) was a mistake - not just for the NR mortgage, the location is poor - but it's a mistake I can live with. The absolute worst case scenario is defaulting on the mortgage and declaring bankruptcy. Which would be really bad for a few years, but we'd get over it.

I think people overestimate how bad things can be. If you need to save money, you will. If you can't pay for things, you won't pay them. As long as you've got wits and some skills you can exchange for money you'll survive.

The people I feel bad for are the people retiring now - with the low interest rates annuity payments must be pitiful, and that'll stick with them for the rest of their lives.

dasilva_2

semanticist wrote: »

In any case, you seem to be taking it entirely too personally. That's really what prompted me to post in the first place - people post here as if someone from NR/NRAM decided to specifically mess up their lives just out of spite. I just can not understand that attitude.

I

I'm posting on here from an entirely personal point of view. That is what I thought a forum was for. The very fact I am thinking about what could happen in the future seems to contradict your 'head in the sand ' theory. I don't think my life has been messed up and certainly not out of spite. Any actions the NR
management took were out of greed.

'In the end, if you can do something about your position: DO IT! And if you can't, freaking out and blaming other people for your unfortunate choices won't make riding it out any better.

Actually, I can not and its nothing to do with my credit worthiness or LTV or infact my ability to pay Nr, hence for 7 years I have not missed a payment. If you read my previous postes, it's to do with my employment status, something that NR could not have predicted when I took out my mortgage 7 years ago. As I have said before, if and that is if, NR raise their SVR at any point to a higher level because they have a less prime mortgage book that is the point that I would feel hard done to because it is a form of retrospective underwriting that had I been with any other lender would not have taken place. I also think you are a little harsh in your description of my posting as 'freaking out'.
I'm posting my views on a public forum not attempting to assasinate the ex board of the NR.

'I think people overestimate how bad things can be. If you need to save money, you will. If you can't pay for things, you won't pay them. As long as you've got wits and some skills you can exchange for money you'll survive.'

Too right, I actually think things will get considerably worse before they get any better. Please don't start me on the state of the country because I may 'freak out' about that too. I am quite lucky in that I bought properties, mostly more than 10 years ago, I have a reasonable income and mortgage rates are low. The mortgage on my main property is nearly half what it has been and I paid it when it was double and I will hopefully when it is double again. My partner is a Macmillan Nurse and that helps me keep everything in perspective.
In comparison to some of her patients I am extremely lucky to have a NRAM mortgage. (but that won't stop me posting my personal opinions)

enay73

DaSilva

well done, I do think the same. You are right, we are in the forum. Even you are posting your opinions, you are still doing as much you can to save your investement. That's what I am doing as well. We don't know the future and either how long the interests rate will be like it is now. We just wish the best of.
Maybe it will be better in NRAM rather to somewhere else in the future, who knows?
Have a nice day:)

LionKing

Hi, I have been moved to NR plc. Are they likely to reduce SVR??

dasilva_2

LionKing wrote: »

Hi, I have been moved to NR plc. Are they likely to reduce SVR??

I wouldn't think at the present time any SVR is going to go down, but they might be able to offer some deals.