Does anyone here have an underactive thyroid?

saraho_3

Hiya. Thanks for that ! Yes, the test where TSH had gone down to 5.9 was done 6 weeks (I think) after starting on the low dose. I have had a quick look at the suggested book (downloaded the pdf), and think I may be classified as subclinical as I think my T4 test result was 13 when that was tested previously... I don't know if that's relevant, as I guess it's still possible to have symptoms even if you're subclinical ?

moneysaving_pharmacist

ms_london wrote: »

A fab website I have found:

www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

There is a forum on there too, but not on the main site, its via another link on the site.

Really really helpful and great to chat to others with the same conditions xx

There are good, sensible patient websites out there for most conditions. There are also some not so sensible sites. This site seems to fall into the second category - the following 2 paragraphs give you a flavour of the site:

You can cite all the research you want!
You can quote all the statistics you desire!
You can refer to all the medical reviews you know!!
You can even make spurious claims against the efficacy, stability and reliability of desiccated thyroid like Armour. BUT NONE OF IT is more important and revealing than the REAL LIFE EXPERIENCES of lives profoundly changed due to desiccated natural thyroid hormones, as well as dosing by symptom elimination first and foremost, NOT black ink marks on a piece of paper called the TSH lab result!

Now I'm not saying that patient experience isn't important - it is, but it's at the bottom of the evidence heirachy.

The British Thyroid Foundation has a far more sensible and balanced position on the use of Armour: www.btf-thyroid.org/main_frame/pages/armour_statement.htm

TomsMom

moneysaving_pharmacist wrote: »

The British Thyroid Foundation has a far more sensible and balanced position on the use of Armour: www.btf-thyroid.org/main_frame/pages/armour_statement.htm

Unfortunately the BTF is using very old information of an alleged problem over 30 years ago.

Desiccated thyroid extract is not currently licensed in the UK and was withdrawn from use in the UK in the 1970s after synthetic thyroxine had been developed. At that time there was perceived to be a problem with the quality control of thyroid extract with large variations from batch to batch, due to the variation in T4 (thyroxine) and T3 (triiodothyronine) that it contained.

Forest Pharmaceuticals, who make Armour Thyroid, have very strict quality control. During the manufacturing process, since the amount of thyroid hormone present in the thyroid gland may vary from animal to animal, the T4 and T3 are measured in both the raw material and in the actual tablets. This ensures that Armour Thyroid tablets are the same from tablet to tablet.

BTF are happy to point out problems from over 30 years ago but are not so keen to let people know that there are no problems with quality or potency of Armour now. So not really all that balanced.

TomsMom

saraho wrote: »

Hiya. Thanks for that ! Yes, the test where TSH had gone down to 5.9 was done 6 weeks (I think) after starting on the low dose. I have had a quick look at the suggested book (downloaded the pdf), and think I may be classified as subclinical as I think my T4 test result was 13 when that was tested previously... I don't know if that's relevant, as I guess it's still possible to have symptoms even if you're subclinical ?

What makes you say you may be classified as subclinical? Subclinical hypothyroidism is where the patient doesn't actually have any particular symptoms or signs, and may not feel unwell at all. Did you go to the GP with no symptoms of hypothyroidism but for something else and he did a blood test and it showed you were hypo? If not and you went with symptoms and he did the tests because of the symptoms then it can't be subclinical.

Whether you're subclinical or not, your FT4 at 13 is very very low (look at the ref ranges mentioned in post #93 then compare it with what Dr Toft says on page 84 of his book). If you are having hypo symptoms with a TSH of 5.9 and FT4 of 13 then according to Dr Toft (and your symptoms) you are hypothyroid and need more than 25mcgs thyroxine. Your GP really should do the FT4 test every time he does TSH and take both into account, TSH on it's own is not the best indicator. As you are experiencing symptoms I would ask for repeats of both tests then discuss the new results with your GP and take Dr Toft's book with you if you feel it is relevant.

saraho_3

I didn't actually go to the doctor with symptoms - it was kind of found by accident (testing due to having vitiligo and a family history of autoimmune disease), but in hindsight I thought it could explain the tiredness, sensitivity to the cold etc I had been experiencing recently.
I just thought that, as a T4 result of 13 was 'in the range' (although at the low end), it was sublicnical as TSH is (slightly) elevated but T4 is 'normal' (as per page 83 in the book).
Anyway, thanks for the advice. I'm going to make another appointment with my doctor to discuss, as I have been feeling worse recently.
Thank you !

melbury

My heart palps have come back with a vengence over the past few days and I was so sure that the thyroxine had cured them, so really feeling fed up. Have been on the 100mcgs dose for about a month now but don't feel any different and certaily not losing any weight, which is depressing.

Hot flushes are awful and I haven't had a decent nights sleep for ages because of waking up hot and sweaty - ugh! I still think there is a link between starting on the thyroxine and the hot flushes - as I have said before not a single menopause symptom before then.

Have been researching a lot about HRT, but that makes scary reading. Basically came to the conclusion that if you can manage without it then don't take it. Also I would have to take the oestrogen only one due to having had a hysterectomy and sounds like this increases the risk of ovarian cancer:eek: :eek: :eek:

Does anybody know of any good natural cures for hot flushes??? Many thanks.

TomsMom

Hi Melbury

Have you had a hormone test in connection with menopause?

The private thyroid doctors frequently suggest natural progesterone cream for pre and menopausal ladies.

It might be useful to read about progesterone here http://www.npis.info/introduction.htm (Natural Progesterone Information Service), particularly HRT-where do we go from here? and Menopause the natural way. Also go to FAQ and if you scroll down to almost the bottom of the page there is the question Can I take use natural progesterone after a hysterectomy?

Don't confuse natural progesterone with wild yam cream, they are not the same, nor progestin which is the synthetic form.

Hope that helps.

melbury

TomsMom wrote: »

Hi Melbury

Have you had a hormone test in connection with menopause?

The private thyroid doctors frequently suggest natural progesterone cream for pre and menopausal ladies.

It might be useful to read about progesterone here http://www.npis.info/introduction.htm (Natural Progesterone Information Service), particularly HRT-where do we go from here? and Menopause the natural way. Also go to FAQ and if you scroll down to almost the bottom of the page there is the question Can I take use natural progesterone after a hysterectomy?

Don't confuse natural progesterone with wild yam cream, they are not the same, nor progestin which is the synthetic form.

Hope that helps.

Thanks for this information, have had a quick look and will definitely spend some time this weekend reading it all. As previously mentioned, had oestrogen levels tested at Christmas time and was told absolutely fine, so don't know where it has all disappeared to. Progesterone theory sounds very plausible, just don't know why doctors in this country are so narrow minded and will only stick to their text book remedies:mad: I don't want to take HRT, I think one synthetic hormone is plenty - personally I wouldn't mind trying the piggie pills, but getting hold of them seems very difficult.

I wonder where you can buy natural progesterone???

TomsMom

melbury wrote: »

personally I wouldn't mind trying the piggie pills, but getting hold of them seems very difficult.

It is possible, but quite difficult, to get Armour Thyroid (piggie pills) on the NHS. You need a doctor who is willing to allow you to try them (of course, they have to believe they will help first and will need convincing that synthetic thyroxine is not helping you) then I think the PCT has to authorise the cost (?).

This info is from Thyroid UK's website:

According to the MHRA, in the UK a GP is allowed to prescribe any of the natural thyroids on a "named patient basis" on the NHS or privately. Your doctor can give you a normal green prescription (FP10) and write Armour Thyroid on it, (or any of the others) then your local chemist can contact: Idis World Medicines, Millbank House, 171-185 Ewell Road, Surbiton, Surrey KT6 6AX. Tel: 020 8410 0700/ Fax: 020 8410 0800. Email: prodinfo@idis.co.uk or idis@idis.co.uk for orders. Website: http://www.idis.co.uk. If your doctor or pharmacist needs information from them, they must set up an account first, but they are not obliged to purchase anything. You just need to persuade your doctor that you need Armour because the synthetic hormone does not suit you. Ask him for a trial, at least. This company import Armour and add a very small administration charge.

Forest Pharmaceuticals Inc in America make Armour and they are very helpful. They will send your doctor any information he requires.

I wonder where you can buy natural progesterone???

On the internet. There are a few brands. Serenity from Wellsprings. Natpro is an organic one and there is Pro-gest. I think possibly Pro-gest is the more well known one.

melbury

TomsMom wrote: »

:

On the internet. There are a few brands. Serenity from Wellsprings. Natpro is an organic one and there is Pro-gest. I think possibly Pro-gest is the more well known one.

Thanks for the information, think I will order some Pro-gest as it sounds about the best. Perhaps it would be wise to wait until I have had my next blood test for thyroid.

On reading further about natural progesterone, it says that all of your body's hormones are inter-linked and controlled by the pituitary gland and so perhaps one failing does have an impact on another one. Don't really know for sure, but food for thought.

Have started a new thread asking if anybody on the site has actually tried natural progesterone cream. All of the serious medical reviews that I have found are pretty negative about it and basically say it doesn't work. Is it the old "if it sounds to good to be true, then it probably is?"