IHT - GWRoB - Complications

Grumpy_chap

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82169152#Comment_82169152

I don't see how FiL maintains ownership of the PBs if this is GWRoB.

As a gift, the ownership transfers to my Wife. When FiL becomes deceased, the value of the gift is no longer in the Estate for distribution. However, FiL has retained some benefit over the value, hence GWRoB applies when determining HT liabilty.

If it is not a gift then GWRoB cannot apply.

Yorkie1

I think you are trying to conflate two different sets of rules, intended for different purposes, in order to make them run in parallel. But I'm not going to argue the point further with you 🙂

DRS1

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82169152#Comment_82169152

Sorry I was probably typing while you were posting so I missed it

DRS1

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82169149#Comment_82169149

But you are omitting the "looking after FiL's money for him" bit from the first post. She is holding the PBs on his behalf - if she wasn't there wouldn't be any question of him keeping the prizes.

phlebas192

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82169128#Comment_82169128

Thanks for finding the 2015 regulations. I was going by the 1972 ones which were the latest I could find so I was wrong to state that the PBs could be seized without payment..

I disagree with you that paragraph 4 does not apply. Section 2 is the important part:

(2) A bond may not be purchased or held by more than one person or by a body of persons, whether incorporated or not.

'held' is not defined, but if a court considered it synonymous with 'owned' then if someone else has a beneficial ownership in a bond then it would be 'held' by more than one person. I would argue that FiL retains a beneficial ownership if he has any say over how the prizes are distributed. But IANAL so that's just my opinion.

silvercar

If your wife owns the PBs, then the winning prizes are hers. If you are saying the prizes belong to your FiL, then you are saying the PBs actually belong to him, even if held in your wife’s name. But holding PBs for another adult isn’t allowed by the PBs rules, so you have a quandary.