Higher rate state pension payment

Dribble0806

As a retained firefighter prior to being allowed to join a pension scheme, I paid in extra National insurance contributions on top of my normal employment contributions. I was told that this would give me a higher rate state pension when I retired. I did not pay into a separate pension scheme with the fire brigade. This was from 1976 to 1997 (21 years). 
Any ideas where i can find this money ,If at all as the higher rate scheme was abolished in 2016.

Flugelhorn

are you taking the state pension yet or have you got a forecast?

eskbanker

Have you reached state pension age yet, and if so, when?

Marcon

Dribble0806 said:

As a retained firefighter prior to being allowed to join a pension scheme, I paid in extra National insurance contributions on top of my normal employment contributions. I was told that this would give me a higher rate state pension when I retired. I did not pay into a separate pension scheme with the fire brigade. This was from 1976 to 1997 (21 years). 
Any ideas where i can find this money ,If at all as the higher rate scheme was abolished in 2016.

Retained firefighters have to be at least 18, so if you became one in 1975, you must now be over State Pension Age.

I don't think there is money to 'find'. Assuming you were a paid volunteer, you will have paid National Insurance on the money you received as a retained firefighter, as well as NI on your earnings from your 'normal' job. All these  NI contributions will (or at least should!) have been taken into account when calculating your state pension and will have given you a higher amount of State Additional Pension (SAP) on top of your basic state pension. SAP would have been Graduated Retirement Benefit (pre-1978) and then State Earnings Related Pension/State Second Pension.

molerat

I thought the only extra top ups were class 3a for pre 2016 retirees where an extra weekly amount could be purchased 

Linton

You may be thinking of SERPS which was effectively a state DB pension based on income and paid for out of NI during the time when most employees did not have access to an employer pension.  SERPS income was paid as part of SP until 2016 when it was merged into the new SP.

So if your SP date was after 2016 and the SERPS  component did not take you above the new SP level you would not see any explicit payment.

Blue_Butterfly

My late father was a full time fireman and we moved to a village where there was a retained fire station. The fire service insisted he join the village retained crew in addition to his main job, and he did this for several years from late 1960's to early 1980's. When he died in 2016 I was looking at his pension for my mum. I was surprised at how much SERP's he had accrued for someone with a public sector pension. I suspect that retained earnings were contracted in so accrued SERPs etc. The other retained firemen in our village had other day jobs, with employers who would release them when the fire siren sounded!

Marcon

Blue_Butterfly said:

My late father was a full time fireman and we moved to a village where there was a retained fire station. The fire service insisted he join the village retained crew in addition to his main job, and he did this for several years from late 1960's to early 1980's. When he died in 2016 I was looking at his pension for my mum. I was surprised at how much SERP's he had accrued for someone with a public sector pension. I suspect that retained earnings were contracted in so accrued SERPs etc. The other retained firemen in our village had other day jobs, with employers who would release them when the fire siren sounded!

That's exactly what I think has happened here. Contracting out certificates were held by employers who offered membership of a suitable pension scheme to their employees. Retained firefighters were not employees, so could not have paid anything other than full rate NI - which is where OP's reference to being told it would give them a higher state pension when they retired comes in.

Loved your final sentence!

xylophone

You reached SPA before 6/4/16?

If you were not in a contracted out pension scheme in the time period mentioned, you will likely have accrued SERP.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Earnings-Related_Pension_Scheme

What is shown on your State Pension letter under pre 97 Additional State Pension?

Secret2ndAccount

You might, or might not have benefited from paying into SERPS. In the great recalculation of 2016 your number would have been higher as a result of your SERPS payments. Whether that eventually resulted in a higher pension for you is a maybe.
Made up example.
In 2016, your new pension starting number was calculated using your years of NI + your extra SERPS, as £200.
Your twin, who worked the same years as you, but didn't pay any SERPS only got a starting number of £180.
Each year of work after 2016 adds a fiver to your pension until you hit £220 which is the maximum new SP.
So, if you worked 4 more years, by 2020 your pension reached the maximum £220.  If both you and your twin retired in 2020, your pension would be £220, and his would only be £200.
On the other hand, if you both worked another 5 years to 2025, then you would both hit the ceiling of £220. Now you got no benefit at all from contributing to SERPS as your twin is on just the same pension as you.
So the answer is: It depends...   Would need a bit of digging into your pension history to figure out the actual numbers and whether or not you are getting any benefit from your SERPS. Unless there has been a big error in your record, it HAS been taken into account in calculating your pension. We just can't say whether it has increased your pension or not without more info

Blue_Butterfly

I think my dad was paid a modest retainer fee to be on call, and they were expected to do training sessions. I know they got paid a fee for attending the fire station when there was a "shout", as sometimes more retained firemen came than were needed. The ones that went out on the fire engine I think got paid hourly. Earnings could vary depending on how often they were needed for fires/road accidents/cats up trees etc!