Third State Pension age review: independent report call for evidence - published today

Stubod

Forum....a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged......

(Unless it's an MSE Forum???)....

sgx2000

artyboy said:

sgx2000 said:

dunstonh said:

I think they should abandon it, freeze retirement age and start to work on a proper fair taxation regime and redistribution of wealth.

fair in whose eyes?

Why should wealth be distributed to those who have not earned it?

But also why should wealth receive a massivly disproportionate  share of the overall wealth of society?
The wealthy have, by nature, become greedier and greedier....

Oh please... not another closed down thread...

lol........

sgx2000

Stubod said:

Forum....a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged......

(Unless it's an MSE Forum???)....

Even funnier.....

hyubh

sgx2000 said:

dunstonh said:

I think they should abandon it, freeze retirement age and start to work on a proper fair taxation regime and redistribution of wealth.

fair in whose eyes?

Why should wealth be distributed to those who have not earned it?

But also why should wealth receive a massivly disproportionate  share of the overall wealth of society?
The wealthy have, by nature, become greedier and greedier....

I think you're saying, wealth differentials in society are such because the greedier someone is, the more they get...? So 'society' is a sort of communal warehouse, and 'wealth' like goods in it, where the greediest grab as much as they can and the austere take very little...?

dunstonh

sgx2000 said:

dunstonh said:

I think they should abandon it, freeze retirement age and start to work on a proper fair taxation regime and redistribution of wealth.

fair in whose eyes?

Why should wealth be distributed to those who have not earned it?

But also why should wealth receive a massivly disproportionate  share of the overall wealth of society?
The wealthy have, by nature, become greedier and greedier....

The definition of wealthy is the issue.   The super rich just leave the UK and instead its the middle ground that hit again and again.

NickPoole

dunstonh said:

sgx2000 said:

dunstonh said:

I think they should abandon it, freeze retirement age and start to work on a proper fair taxation regime and redistribution of wealth.

fair in whose eyes?

Why should wealth be distributed to those who have not earned it?

But also why should wealth receive a massivly disproportionate  share of the overall wealth of society?
The wealthy have, by nature, become greedier and greedier....

The definition of wealthy is the issue.   The super rich just leave the UK and instead its the middle ground that hit again and again.

The "super rich" don't pay any tax on their earnings anyway

NickPoole

On the (new) subject of the thread, the levers the Government can pull easily are the thresholds and the tax rates (as well as, as has been said, deciding whether retired people pay NI.

I don't know why people of pension age can't continue to pay NI on non-pension earnings. Could also consider allowing them to continue earning credits if they haven't claimed state pension and haven't qualified for full pension yet. 

You could stage the bands a bit - 20%, 25%,35%,40%,45%, 49.5%* and have a play with thresholds.

(*I've always thought 49.5% was a good psychological top rate - not taking away half of what you earn, maximising take because people are less likely to aggressively avoid it)

I think we (middle earners and above) probably should and will end up paying more tax for the time being, let's try to spread it fairly and make it as painless as possible

NickPoole

P.S. probably need to do something about "cliff edges" where the combination of a higher rate and losing other benefits costs you massively for earning very little more.

Cobbler_tone

sgx2000 said:

dunstonh said:

I think they should abandon it, freeze retirement age and start to work on a proper fair taxation regime and redistribution of wealth.

fair in whose eyes?

Why should wealth be distributed to those who have not earned it?

But also why should wealth receive a massivly disproportionate  share of the overall wealth of society?
The wealthy have, by nature, become greedier and greedier....

Haven't you just framed socialism and capitalism? I sense which way you are leaning. 

I think we already have a system where people who can afford to pay more generally do. There has been over a 40% increase in the number of people paying some 40% tax in the past three years. The 'wealthy' earning (for example) £130k incur stoppages of 35% in total. It would feel unfair to increase that even more.
Not sure on 'greedier' but admittedly money does make more money. Good luck changing that!
I'd be leaning slightly less to the left but it does seem to be the average Joe who feels the brunt. Once you breach 40% it can feel like diminishing returns.

DE_612183

Andy_L said:

The other problem with the idea that NI should be paid on pensions is that pensioners can't claim most of the benefits that NI pays for.

But a lot of people do claim the benefits that NI pays for have never and never will pay NI.

The point of NI is not an investment where you get a return - it's to support those who can't support themselves.