UPRN & COUNCIL TAX

Soosin1

Where to begin?!? We moved to a plot in spring 2014 and had a mobile home while building and paid band B Council tax. From end July 2014 we commenced paying council tax on our newly built 2 bed chalet bungalow. This was banded F which seemed overkill for a small home and I wrote to the VOA to seek review. This was declined in April 2015. We have to date paid band F on our little home!

Over they years we have suffered from mapping issues, emailing Google Maps many times seeking inclusion. Couriers routinely misdelivered, commonly a to barn 2km away! Even an emergency ambulance had to be flagged down in the road. It has been untold misery for the duration. I tried CAB who were unable to assist.

Just this month Openreach attended to install fibre and could not find their mapped adjacent pole. Turns out is is located 2km at this barn! They queried and I was advised to seek support from Ordnance Survey. They confirmed that the UPRN generated by the local council at commencement of council tax registration had inadvertently attributed our home to the barn location! The barn had 2 UPRN numbers! My home is someones garden! This barn is on a private estate and used as a designer furniture store. It is 1500 sq ft in size.

Subsequent emails from VOA indicate that they believe we live in a 4 bed, 5 roomed home with a double garage, instead of a 2 bed, 2 roomed home with a single garage! Oddly the sqm of the barn does not correlate with details held by the VOA either!

The VOA want me to prove value and provide 5 similar properties to justify review, but how can I? 

Is this something the Council must address? I am at a loss to know how to proceed, all I know is I have made 131 monthly payments to date that are excessive and I want it sorted.

Blancmang25

Soosin1 said:

Where to begin?!? We moved to a plot in spring 2014 and had a mobile home while building and paid band B Council tax. From end July 2014 we commenced paying council tax on our newly built 2 bed chalet bungalow. This was banded F which seemed overkill for a small home and I wrote to the VOA to seek review. This was declined in April 2015. We have to date paid band F on our little home!

Over they years we have suffered from mapping issues, emailing Google Maps many times seeking inclusion. Couriers routinely misdelivered, commonly a to barn 2km away! Even an emergency ambulance had to be flagged down in the road. It has been untold misery for the duration. I tried CAB who were unable to assist.

Just this month Openreach attended to install fibre and could not find their mapped adjacent pole. Turns out is is located 2km at this barn! They queried and I was advised to seek support from Ordnance Survey. They confirmed that the UPRN generated by the local council at commencement of council tax registration had inadvertently attributed our home to the barn location! The barn had 2 UPRN numbers! My home is someones garden! This barn is on a private estate and used as a designer furniture store. It is 1500 sq ft in size.

Subsequent emails from VOA indicate that they believe we live in a 4 bed, 5 roomed home with a double garage, instead of a 2 bed, 2 roomed home with a single garage! Oddly the sqm of the barn does not correlate with details held by the VOA either!

The VOA want me to prove value and provide 5 similar properties to justify review, but how can I? 

Is this something the Council must address? I am at a loss to know how to proceed, all I know is I have made 131 monthly payments to date that are excessive and I want it sorted.

Limited knowledge but...

If you were given a Council tax band B for the mobile home, then the local authority would have had to issue a UPRN to allocate a postcode and address for the mobile home, the VOA would have given the banding for the dwelling on said plot of land.

I would suggest that you contact the local authority and ask them to confirm the details from the beginning, with regard to the original UPRN.

I am presuming you bought the plot of land?

You would of had to acquire planning permission with details of the land you were building on?

I would send the VOA the plans etc.

Maybe some one with more knowledge of the VOA could answer this for you.

lincroft1710

Unfortunately the VOA are likely to say that the as matter has already been investigated the band is correct. It was normal procedure for the VOA to actually visit a property before banding. So whether they visited the wrong property (which is unlikely) I don't know. You really need them to come out and physically inspect the property, but how easy that is to achieve that these days I'm not sure  (I'm ex VOA). Sending them the plans is not a bad idea


You really should have followed up your original band challenge with an appeal to the independent Valuation Tribunal.


Trying to find 5 similar properties in the area may be difficult, but the VOA can be very intransigent so you will have to persevere.


How do you know the barn is 1500 sq ft?


Do keep us informed of any progress.


 

Soosin1

I will try to address comment in order. The mobile home shows as deleted on the .gov website, but does not give a UPRN number.

We did purchase a plot and it was addressed by the council as Plot adj. To my next door neighbour.

I have sent some of the plans to the VOA, but they seem to keep telling me that I haven't offered the evidence they seek. Namely, 5 adjacent properties to illustrate why it should be lowered. We are on a country lane 3 miles long with approx 30 random dwellings of various age and design. There is nothing similar within 10 miles of here!!

The original band challenge was made without knowledge of the UPRN and we were new to the area. I was disappointed, but it's hard to know how to deal with beurocracy without insight to the system. 

I know the barn size as I found an Estate Agent ad to lease it as a commercial space. It is a vast open barn with a bathroom in one corner. It is single floor to the Eaves.

The VOA describe my home as 160 sqm with 5 rooms, 4 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms and 2 floors. Parking for 2 vehicles.

My home is 89sqm, minus 10.6sqm as under 1.5m height in the bedroom eaves. We have kitchen, Cloakroom, lounge, dining room, bathroom and 2 beds. Single garage.

Soosin1

I have just spoken to Ordnance Survey and the deleted mobile home has an entirely different UPRN! Essentially meaning our home has not had a UPRN since 30th July 2014. This week, Ordnance Survey transferred the duplicate barn UPRN number to our home.

lincroft1710

UPRNs are relatively recent. When I started settling CT appeals back in 1994, no reference was made to the UPRN (if they even existed then) and everything was done by address. If you challenged your band within 6 months of receiving notice of your CT band, the VOA should have treated it as a formal appeal (or advised you to make one, if your challenge did not meet the requirements of a formal appeal) so that if you couldn't agree you could appeal to the VT. Whether you had a UPRN or not was irrelevant.


As I suspected, the VOA are playing hardball. I would therefore suggest you contact your MP, explain your case (but omit details about UPRNs and barns 2 km away as they are irrelevant) and ask that they write to the VOA on your behalf. There is no guarantee this will get a result, but it is about the only option you have.


Finally it is equally possible that the EA could have got the barn size wrong

Soosin1

The issue is, mapping is controlled by UPRN and until recently Google maps and most courier apps point to the barn because of it! How does the VOA assess a new build without visiting? If they used Google earth or maps of any nature, they got the barn!

lincroft1710

Soosin1 said:

The issue is, mapping is controlled by UPRN and until recently Google maps and most courier apps point to the barn because of it! How does the VOA assess a new build without visiting? If they used Google earth or maps of any nature, they got the barn!

VOA may have had sight of deposited plans at council's planning office or may have just made an external inspection. Although neither are recommended, in one of the areas I dealt with, an external inspection could easily identify a Band G property. However only the VOA will know. Very doubtful they would have used Google Earth. 

Blancmang25

Soosin1 said:

I have just spoken to Ordnance Survey and the deleted mobile home has an entirely different UPRN! Essentially meaning our home has not had a UPRN since 30th July 2014. This week, Ordnance Survey transferred the duplicate barn UPRN number to our home.

This I think is the problem.

The local authority would have given a unique UPRN for the mobile home, this allows the council tax section to set up the address etc on the system and refer to the VOA. The VOA then sets the band for the property.

Your property cannot have the same UPRN as the barn as it is not part of their property, hence why the VOA have banded your property as a band F.

I am sure you would have been visited by the council tax office for them to give a completion notice when the property was built. I expect a new UPRN would be required as a new property.

As I said I have limited knowledge regarding UPRN's but I worked in Council Tax(now retired) and we needed the details for council tax accounts to be set up. The VOA then bands the properties, the LA have no input to this part.

@lincroft1710 has given a few suggestions and hopefully you may be able to get the VOA to visit.