RE: Refused Holiday request - already booked

GingerTim

EnPointe said:

ohreallƳ said:

sheramber said:

The OP has logged in since his meeting but has not chosen to update  the thread.

Bit of a peeve of mine, abandoning an established thread, second only to deleting a  thread question.

it's normally because they didn't get the answer they want 

And, you suspect, they didn't get the result they wanted at work, either.

PierremontQuaker03

Hi OP here, apologies for not updating - I did manage to get the holiday request signed off in the end, I spoke with HR and they said as the dates had already been agreed and signed off then they did not see the issue in slightly changing the dates in that it benefited the company (I was reducing the number of days off) - basically HR must have had spoken to my manager and said there is nothing you can do as you have already signed them off
Obviously it has left a sour taste in the mouth the way it has been handled and am now searching for a new job

Tryinghardtosave

Glad that HR have given some sense and sorted it for you and a shame you have to work in what sounds like a bit of a toxic environment. 

PierremontQuaker03

Tryinghardtosave said:

Glad that HR have given some sense and sorted it for you and a shame you have to work in what sounds like a bit of a toxic environment. 

Thank you - toxic is a very popular word in our office at the moment, its amazing how one person can bring down the mood so much (but I suppose they are the boss LOL).

p_anotherguy

PierremontQuaker03 said:

Hi OP here, apologies for not updating - I did manage to get the holiday request signed off in the end, I spoke with HR and they said as the dates had already been agreed and signed off then they did not see the issue in slightly changing the dates in that it benefited the company (I was reducing the number of days off) - basically HR must have had spoken to my manager and said there is nothing you can do as you have already signed them off
Obviously it has left a sour taste in the mouth the way it has been handled and am now searching for a new job

You did the right thing. I'm glad that everything got sorted out. I'd suggest that you look for a job with a more flexible manager, since she'll probably keeps giving you problems in the future. Some people aren't made for a managerial position

pinkshoes

Tabieth said:

pinkshoes said:

Some harsh comments on here! 

To be fair to @PierremontQuaker03 , they were told the holiday they had initially requested and had reluctantly approved was inconvenient to the company, so they tried to be nice, put the business first, and opt for a different week instead.

This was actually above and beyond what an employee would be expected to do, so the response of the company was VERY petty.

But... the OP did make a mistake booking the holiday, even though it was done based on what was best for the company.

The OP has been treated quite badly here, so it's not surprising they're feeling really p*ssed off! I certainly would be furious. 

@PierremontQuaker03 how did you get on with HR? Unless the company can give you a valid reason why they cannot possibly approve the holiday for the week after, then it's not the sort of company I'd want to work for.

I'd personally still take the week you HAVE got approved, then put in a week for emergency unpaid family leave for the week after so you can still go on the booked holiday.

I once had my holiday approval held to ransom over my project being finished to a certain point, but all MY actions were dependent on work by others, people whom I did not manage and had no control over when the work would get done! It was ludicrous. I didn't stay much longer after that. 

I don’t think the OP has been treated badly, quite the reverse. They didn’t follow what’s a totally reasonable and standard HR policy and booked a holiday before getting the annual leave approved. 

What would be the justification for the emergency family leave? Most companies have conditions for it and a limit for how much can be taken. “Booking a holiday before getting annual leave approved by the line manager” is unlikely to be considered a valid reason! 

There are company rules vs common sense. A company that applies common sense rather than everything by the rule book will have happier employees. It's about treating people as humans and not statistics.

And I see from the OPs update that they have indeed approved the holiday, as it made sense. 

Tabieth

pinkshoes said:

Tabieth said:

pinkshoes said:

Some harsh comments on here! 

To be fair to @PierremontQuaker03 , they were told the holiday they had initially requested and had reluctantly approved was inconvenient to the company, so they tried to be nice, put the business first, and opt for a different week instead.

This was actually above and beyond what an employee would be expected to do, so the response of the company was VERY petty.

But... the OP did make a mistake booking the holiday, even though it was done based on what was best for the company.

The OP has been treated quite badly here, so it's not surprising they're feeling really p*ssed off! I certainly would be furious. 

@PierremontQuaker03 how did you get on with HR? Unless the company can give you a valid reason why they cannot possibly approve the holiday for the week after, then it's not the sort of company I'd want to work for.

I'd personally still take the week you HAVE got approved, then put in a week for emergency unpaid family leave for the week after so you can still go on the booked holiday.

I once had my holiday approval held to ransom over my project being finished to a certain point, but all MY actions were dependent on work by others, people whom I did not manage and had no control over when the work would get done! It was ludicrous. I didn't stay much longer after that. 

I don’t think the OP has been treated badly, quite the reverse. They didn’t follow what’s a totally reasonable and standard HR policy and booked a holiday before getting the annual leave approved. 

What would be the justification for the emergency family leave? Most companies have conditions for it and a limit for how much can be taken. “Booking a holiday before getting annual leave approved by the line manager” is unlikely to be considered a valid reason! 

There are company rules vs common sense. A company that applies common sense rather than everything by the rule book will have happier employees. It's about treating people as humans and not statistics.

And I see from the OPs update that they have indeed approved the holiday, as it made sense. 

“Common sense” to allow staff to book their holidays before getting the annual leave approved?! Hardly! That’s a recipe for total disaster. The inevitable will happen and lots of staff will book their trips in the same few popular weeks meaning there’s not enough staff left working to maintain minimum safe staffing levels. Then what? Either the company allows everyone to take leave at the same time (in some safety critical industries this could be dangerous) or some are allowed their leave and others aren’t. How does the company / manager decide who gets it? Favouritism? 

The simplest, easiest, most practical solution is what virtually every company does. An employee requests annual leave and is granted if there are enough staff to maintain the service. It’s fair as it’s first come, first served, and staff know not to book until their line manager has approved the leave. That’s the common sense approach. Not allowing some individuals to do whatever they want because they can’t or won’t follow policy. 

kinger101

Uriziel said:

OP I feel like you are being too rash and needlessly aggressive. If you are determined to go on your holiday then write an email to your manager and let them know that you will be taking the holiday and apologize. Maybe explain your reasoning if you have any and then just take the holiday. It is very unlikely that they will take any action at all because quite frankly I don't think this matters. You wrote that your previous boss was not fussy. If this is true it means you work in a team or company where people going on leave is not a very big deal and the new manager is just whiny. This means that you going on holiday won't make too much of a negative impact and she will probably just suck it up. Nobody wants to cause unnecessary drama and problems. Sure one can argue that you left without approval for your holiday.. but then again.. if you are let go because of this and they cannot prove at all that the company encountered any difficulties or problems at all, which I assume they won't since your last boss was so lenient, how would it make them look legally to fire you over this? I don't think there is any need for you to hand in your notice unless you actually want to leave.

Very bad idea.  HR are involved.  The leave policies are there for a reason.  This case is now highly visible.  They are not going to make a exception for one employee.