Overpaid maternity leave - must I repay?!

MattMattMattUK

You have to pay it back, you can attempt to negotiate the amount, but in reality the chances of that being successful are zero. Your best course of action is to negotiate the period you will repay over. Your employer will have a policy which allows them to deduct overpayments from your wages, they also have the option to take court action should you refuse to repay and the amounts exceed a reasonable amount of time to repay. Remember, they hold all the cards. 

I would expect that you can probably negotiate repayments over six months, possibly twelve, but I suspect that would be the limit.

Savvy_Sue

Are you in a union? They might help you negotiate longer term repayment plan.

Be aware that if you leave before you've finished repaying, they can (and will) take final balance from your final salary payment, and expect anything more than that straight away.

Hoenir

Undervalued said:

Marcon said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

Undervalued said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

I’ve been overpaid a few thousand on maternity leave. No, I didn’t notice. First maternity leave, asked employer for a breakdown of what to expect, never received it, busy with newborn. Anyway. Employer has admitted fault. I’ve researched and from what I can see, legally I’ll have to pay it back. Just wondering if anyone has any experience of this? Wondering if I could negotiate with them to just pay some of it back, any advice? Thanks 

If they had underpaid you by "several thousand" would you be happy to write some of it off?

I suspect you really already know the answer to this question.

Yes, they may well agree to "easy instalments" but no, they don't have to and could demand it all at once.

Depends on whether it was my fault or not. 

Somehow I doubt that...but despite all the naysayers, there's absolutely nothing to stop you trying to negotiate to pay some rather than all of it back. Remember that you start from a position of weakness, so your best bet is a charm offensive, not drum-banging that it's all their fault etc etc.

Send them a carefully considered email so you can think out in advance what you want to say, and don't run the risk of getting sidetracked by the new arrival crying at just the wrong moment during a phone call. Make the point that you didn't know what to expect in terms of pay and in the absence of the breakdown you requested on [date], took it for granted that your employer would have everything correct. Make a wry comment that you are finding motherhood even more expensive than the books had led you to believe, and although you realise the employer is entitled to seek full reimbursement, is there any chance they might be willing to consider accepting a little less than their due/repayment over a period of [xxx] months? Stress how grateful you'd be (no need to be servile, though!) and how much it would help you.

There is nothing to stop anybody from trying to negotiate in pretty much any circumstances.

However in this situation I would seriously consider what impression it would make on the OP's employer. 

Certainly could have an impact on future pay and career prospects. 

Marcon

Undervalued said:

Marcon said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

Undervalued said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

I’ve been overpaid a few thousand on maternity leave. No, I didn’t notice. First maternity leave, asked employer for a breakdown of what to expect, never received it, busy with newborn. Anyway. Employer has admitted fault. I’ve researched and from what I can see, legally I’ll have to pay it back. Just wondering if anyone has any experience of this? Wondering if I could negotiate with them to just pay some of it back, any advice? Thanks 

If they had underpaid you by "several thousand" would you be happy to write some of it off?

I suspect you really already know the answer to this question.

Yes, they may well agree to "easy instalments" but no, they don't have to and could demand it all at once.

Depends on whether it was my fault or not. 

Somehow I doubt that...but despite all the naysayers, there's absolutely nothing to stop you trying to negotiate to pay some rather than all of it back. Remember that you start from a position of weakness, so your best bet is a charm offensive, not drum-banging that it's all their fault etc etc.

Send them a carefully considered email so you can think out in advance what you want to say, and don't run the risk of getting sidetracked by the new arrival crying at just the wrong moment during a phone call. Make the point that you didn't know what to expect in terms of pay and in the absence of the breakdown you requested on [date], took it for granted that your employer would have everything correct. Make a wry comment that you are finding motherhood even more expensive than the books had led you to believe, and although you realise the employer is entitled to seek full reimbursement, is there any chance they might be willing to consider accepting a little less than their due/repayment over a period of [xxx] months? Stress how grateful you'd be (no need to be servile, though!) and how much it would help you.

There is nothing to stop anybody from trying to negotiate in pretty much any circumstances.

However in this situation I would seriously consider what impression it would make on the OP's employer. 

Which is why it needs to be carefully worded. There's nothing at which an employer should take offence if done politely - and especially where they have failed to give an employee the requested breakdown of pay.

Do you seriously believe OP will be the first person to make such a request in the history of employment?

Hoenir

Marcon said:

Undervalued said:

Marcon said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

Undervalued said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

I’ve been overpaid a few thousand on maternity leave. No, I didn’t notice. First maternity leave, asked employer for a breakdown of what to expect, never received it, busy with newborn. Anyway. Employer has admitted fault. I’ve researched and from what I can see, legally I’ll have to pay it back. Just wondering if anyone has any experience of this? Wondering if I could negotiate with them to just pay some of it back, any advice? Thanks 

If they had underpaid you by "several thousand" would you be happy to write some of it off?

I suspect you really already know the answer to this question.

Yes, they may well agree to "easy instalments" but no, they don't have to and could demand it all at once.

Depends on whether it was my fault or not. 

Somehow I doubt that...but despite all the naysayers, there's absolutely nothing to stop you trying to negotiate to pay some rather than all of it back. Remember that you start from a position of weakness, so your best bet is a charm offensive, not drum-banging that it's all their fault etc etc.

Send them a carefully considered email so you can think out in advance what you want to say, and don't run the risk of getting sidetracked by the new arrival crying at just the wrong moment during a phone call. Make the point that you didn't know what to expect in terms of pay and in the absence of the breakdown you requested on [date], took it for granted that your employer would have everything correct. Make a wry comment that you are finding motherhood even more expensive than the books had led you to believe, and although you realise the employer is entitled to seek full reimbursement, is there any chance they might be willing to consider accepting a little less than their due/repayment over a period of [xxx] months? Stress how grateful you'd be (no need to be servile, though!) and how much it would help you.

There is nothing to stop anybody from trying to negotiate in pretty much any circumstances.

However in this situation I would seriously consider what impression it would make on the OP's employer. 

Which is why it needs to be carefully worded. There's nothing at which an employer should take offence if done politely - and especially where they have failed to give an employee the requested breakdown of pay.

Do you seriously believe OP will be the first person to make such a request in the history of employment?

Payslips would have been issued. Probably require somebody of seniority to sit and calculate manually the correct figures. Such is the dependence on payroll systems these days. Where it's little more than plugging numbers in. Be unsurprising if the original error wasn't actually very apparent. If the overpayments are a couple of thousand pounds. 

Savvy_Sue

Hoenir said:

Payslips would have been issued. Probably require somebody of seniority to sit and calculate manually the correct figures. Such is the dependence on payroll systems these days. Where it's little more than plugging numbers in. Be unsurprising if the original error wasn't actually very apparent. If the overpayments are a couple of thousand pounds. 

It's not quite a manual calculation, but there is (almost always) a manual element to it, because most payrolls run calendar monthly, whereas the SMP element is calculated on a weekly basis. So in some months there are 4 SMP payments, and in other months there will be 5. 

And then there's the issue that for the first 6 weeks SMP is based on a % of salary, after which it drops to a standard rate. 

And that's just the Statutory element: if there is also a more generous Employer's scheme, then that has to be factored in, and again, if the employer pays one rate for the first X weeks followed by another rate for the next Y weeks, then what falls into each payroll month has to be worked out. 

I'm sure you (and others) are aware of all this @Hoenir, but it does mean that it's extremely difficult to work out if you're being paid correctly if the employer does not give you a breakdown, and although a prediction can be made based on EDD, if baby has the temerity to arrive before or after EDD (in a different week for SMP purposes), the whole thing has to be re-calculated. (Been there, done that, got the t-shirt!) Indeed, that may have been why a payment schedule wasn't provided, because "we won't know for sure until baby arrives". I don't think that's a great idea - I always provided one based on EDD and said "this is subject to change, but at least you now know the total amount you'll be paid, it just might not be on these dates". 

If the OP was paid her normal rate throughout her maternity leave I would agree she should have noticed and been suspicious. Likewise if the rate didn't drop dramatically after six weeks, UNLESS there was a very generous employer scheme - which seems unlikely if the overpayment is thousands. 

But the best I would hope for from the employer is an admission that they were at fault, an apology, and a generous length of time for repayment. 

OP hasn't said if they're in a union. I would definitely ask for their support if they were. 

Penguin_

Hoenir said:

Marcon said:

Undervalued said:

Marcon said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

Undervalued said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

I’ve been overpaid a few thousand on maternity leave. No, I didn’t notice. First maternity leave, asked employer for a breakdown of what to expect, never received it, busy with newborn. Anyway. Employer has admitted fault. I’ve researched and from what I can see, legally I’ll have to pay it back. Just wondering if anyone has any experience of this? Wondering if I could negotiate with them to just pay some of it back, any advice? Thanks 

If they had underpaid you by "several thousand" would you be happy to write some of it off?

I suspect you really already know the answer to this question.

Yes, they may well agree to "easy instalments" but no, they don't have to and could demand it all at once.

Depends on whether it was my fault or not. 

Somehow I doubt that...but despite all the naysayers, there's absolutely nothing to stop you trying to negotiate to pay some rather than all of it back. Remember that you start from a position of weakness, so your best bet is a charm offensive, not drum-banging that it's all their fault etc etc.

Send them a carefully considered email so you can think out in advance what you want to say, and don't run the risk of getting sidetracked by the new arrival crying at just the wrong moment during a phone call. Make the point that you didn't know what to expect in terms of pay and in the absence of the breakdown you requested on [date], took it for granted that your employer would have everything correct. Make a wry comment that you are finding motherhood even more expensive than the books had led you to believe, and although you realise the employer is entitled to seek full reimbursement, is there any chance they might be willing to consider accepting a little less than their due/repayment over a period of [xxx] months? Stress how grateful you'd be (no need to be servile, though!) and how much it would help you.

There is nothing to stop anybody from trying to negotiate in pretty much any circumstances.

However in this situation I would seriously consider what impression it would make on the OP's employer. 

Which is why it needs to be carefully worded. There's nothing at which an employer should take offence if done politely - and especially where they have failed to give an employee the requested breakdown of pay.

Do you seriously believe OP will be the first person to make such a request in the history of employment?

Payslips would have been issued. Probably require somebody of seniority to sit and calculate manually the correct figures. Such is the dependence on payroll systems these days. Where it's little more than plugging numbers in. Be unsurprising if the original error wasn't actually very apparent. If the overpayments are a couple of thousand pounds. 

Ours is automatically calculated through the software.

Strummer22

I was overpaid during a period of shared parental leave. My company offered it at the same rate as maternity pay (which was higher than the statutory amount). My payslips showed I'd been paid the uplifted parental leave amount, and the statutory amount. As this was only for a few weeks I think the overpayment was about £600. I asked the finance director about it (in writing - always get this sort of thing in writing), fully expecting to pay it back. However, she told me to forget about it, which was a nice bonus! I suspect I would not have received the same answer for an overpayment of several thousand, though. 

As others have noted, the best you can hope for is a relatively long repayment period. I can't think if a way to word a request to keep some of it that doesn't sound cheeky, or grovelling. 

EnPointe

Hoenir said:

Undervalued said:

Marcon said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

Undervalued said:

mumofoneupnorth25 said:

I’ve been overpaid a few thousand on maternity leave. No, I didn’t notice. First maternity leave, asked employer for a breakdown of what to expect, never received it, busy with newborn. Anyway. Employer has admitted fault. I’ve researched and from what I can see, legally I’ll have to pay it back. Just wondering if anyone has any experience of this? Wondering if I could negotiate with them to just pay some of it back, any advice? Thanks 

If they had underpaid you by "several thousand" would you be happy to write some of it off?

I suspect you really already know the answer to this question.

Yes, they may well agree to "easy instalments" but no, they don't have to and could demand it all at once.

Depends on whether it was my fault or not. 

Somehow I doubt that...but despite all the naysayers, there's absolutely nothing to stop you trying to negotiate to pay some rather than all of it back. Remember that you start from a position of weakness, so your best bet is a charm offensive, not drum-banging that it's all their fault etc etc.

Send them a carefully considered email so you can think out in advance what you want to say, and don't run the risk of getting sidetracked by the new arrival crying at just the wrong moment during a phone call. Make the point that you didn't know what to expect in terms of pay and in the absence of the breakdown you requested on [date], took it for granted that your employer would have everything correct. Make a wry comment that you are finding motherhood even more expensive than the books had led you to believe, and although you realise the employer is entitled to seek full reimbursement, is there any chance they might be willing to consider accepting a little less than their due/repayment over a period of [xxx] months? Stress how grateful you'd be (no need to be servile, though!) and how much it would help you.

There is nothing to stop anybody from trying to negotiate in pretty much any circumstances.

However in this situation I would seriously consider what impression it would make on the OP's employer. 

Certainly could have an impact on future pay and career prospects. 

in what way ? 

asking for a proper review  on leaving (unexpectedly ) a job  resulted ina demand for  several hundred pounds of 'over payment'  turning into a wirtten apology and the payment or  several hundred pounds after  the alleged 'overpayment'  had been corrected as a proper reconciliation of  that years leave and leave from  the previous year  which was subject to an employer imposed embargo   being paiud out  without  question  ( also not helped by  the recruiter  who initially appointed me ignoring   the information i provided aobut my previous service within the sector ( which impacted on my annual leave netitlement by a  significant amount  of days) 

Savvy_Sue

Penguin_ said:

Hoenir said:

Payslips would have been issued. Probably require somebody of seniority to sit and calculate manually the correct figures. Such is the dependence on payroll systems these days. Where it's little more than plugging numbers in. Be unsurprising if the original error wasn't actually very apparent. If the overpayments are a couple of thousand pounds. 

Ours is automatically calculated through the software.

That may be true at the time each payment is made, but even when we were paying just SMP, I had to do a little bit of fiddling to give an advance statement of what would be paid month by month. Once we improved our scheme to pay slightly enhanced pay, there was even more fiddling needed. 

I could give a statement of how much SMP was due, but what I could NOT give with just a wave of my mouse was a statement of what my colleague would receive each month. 

Strummer22 said:

I was overpaid during a period of shared parental leave. My company offered it at the same rate as maternity pay (which was higher than the statutory amount). My payslips showed I'd been paid the uplifted parental leave amount, and the statutory amount. As this was only for a few weeks I think the overpayment was about £600. I asked the finance director about it (in writing - always get this sort of thing in writing), fully expecting to pay it back. However, she told me to forget about it, which was a nice bonus! I suspect I would not have received the same answer for an overpayment of several thousand, though. 

Which suggests that I'm not alone in expecting that a certain amount of manual adjustment may be needed. 

I have used a couple of different payroll packages, and even with Sick Pay we have to manually deduct that from the normal salary if we're paying full Company Sick Pay - the Statutory Sick Pay is not paid on top of CSP.