Xmas day pay

daisy164

My friends son is 16 and works in a pub as a waiter. He was told that he would be paid double pay on Xmas day (he’s on minimum wage). He worked 6.5 hours, which he was happy to do for the extra money but it meant that he didn’t get to spend the day with his family, he also had no break and was not offered any food.

They have today told him that they’ve changed their minds and as the tips are substantial they are just getting basic wage. 

Can somebody offer some advice on this please as surely they cannot get staff in under false pretences, get them to work flat out and then change the terms?

Thank you 

Brie

I'm guessing there's no union or other official body to get to act on his behalf.  So as a parent it might be to you to act as his advocate. 

does he have anything in writing?  even a text message?  that might help convince the manager to play ball.  maybe go in and have chat and ask how much business they might lose if this made it into the papers?  Is it part of a chain or linked to a brewery of any sort?  might be satisfying to let them know how their franchisee was treating the staff and again mention how this might ultimately affect profits.  

OH and no breaks?  That's against employment law so that's another hole they are digging for themselves.

 It may be just one of those things that your son needs to find out about to make him see how not to do business.  And maybe he'll want to ensure he's not working for them on New Year's Eve or possibly ever again.

Ultimately there may be little that can be done about it as maddening as that might be.  I mean it wouldn't be legal for you and a bunch of friends go in and run a tab and then walk out without paying would it?  Even if it felt just.

Undervalued

daisy164 said:

My friends son is 16 and works in a pub as a waiter. He was told that he would be paid double pay on Xmas day (he’s on minimum wage). He worked 6.5 hours, which he was happy to do for the extra money but it meant that he didn’t get to spend the day with his family, he also had no break and was not offered any food.

They have today told him that they’ve changed their minds and as the tips are substantial they are just getting basic wage. 

Can somebody offer some advice on this please as surely they cannot get staff in under false pretences, get them to work flat out and then change the terms?

Thank you 

Theoretically not but realistically doing anything about it is going to be difficult to say the least.

There is no legal right to extra pay for bank holidays, even Christmas day. However if it was offered and he agreed to work on that basis then it should of course be honoured.

Pragmatically, if the "tips are substantial" and he had know that in advance, would he have worked for the total he actually received or turned the work down?

An agreement (contract) doesn't have to be in writing to be binding but the obvious difficulty is proving what was agreed. He could threaten to, and if necessary actually sue them for what was agreed, particularly if somebody else will back up what was promised.

The pub will no doubt claim something along the lines that they were told the total (including tips) would be around double normal pay.

You say he worked 6.5 hours without a break. Legally only 6 is allowed before a break is required. Again they will no doubt claim that there was opportunity to take a break and it is his fault for not doing so.

Sorry but that is the reality of it. Yes, he could name and shame but goo luck finding any similar work in the area.

LightFlare

would he be better off refusing any tips (above what would be expected on a “normal” day) and pushing for double pay ?

I suspect that increase in tips would have more than covered the lack of double pay.

Is this right? - probably not but is a pragmatic approach

General_Grant

Undervalued said:

daisy164 said:

My friends son is 16 and works in a pub as a waiter. He was told that he would be paid double pay on Xmas day (he’s on minimum wage). He worked 6.5 hours, which he was happy to do for the extra money but it meant that he didn’t get to spend the day with his family, he also had no break and was not offered any food.

They have today told him that they’ve changed their minds and as the tips are substantial they are just getting basic wage. 

Can somebody offer some advice on this please as surely they cannot get staff in under false pretences, get them to work flat out and then change the terms?

Thank you 

Theoretically not but realistically doing anything about it is going to be difficult to say the least.

There is no legal right to extra pay for bank holidays, even Christmas day. However if it was offered and he agreed to work on that basis then it should of course be honoured.

Pragmatically, if the "tips are substantial" and he had know that in advance, would he have worked for the total he actually received or turned the work down?

An agreement (contract) doesn't have to be in writing to be binding but the obvious difficulty is proving what was agreed. He could threaten to, and if necessary actually sue them for what was agreed, particularly if somebody else will back up what was promised.

The pub will no doubt claim something along the lines that they were told the total (including tips) would be around double normal pay.

You say he worked 6.5 hours without a break. Legally only 6 is allowed before a break is required. Again they will no doubt claim that there was opportunity to take a break and it is his fault for not doing so.

Sorry but that is the reality of it. Yes, he could name and shame but goo luck finding any similar work in the area.

It is for adults that a shift has to be expected to last more than 6 hours for a break to be allowed around the half-way mark.  For young people (and the OP's son is only 16), a break is required where the shift is expected to last more than 4.5 hours.

Undervalued

General_Grant said:

Undervalued said:

daisy164 said:

My friends son is 16 and works in a pub as a waiter. He was told that he would be paid double pay on Xmas day (he’s on minimum wage). He worked 6.5 hours, which he was happy to do for the extra money but it meant that he didn’t get to spend the day with his family, he also had no break and was not offered any food.

They have today told him that they’ve changed their minds and as the tips are substantial they are just getting basic wage. 

Can somebody offer some advice on this please as surely they cannot get staff in under false pretences, get them to work flat out and then change the terms?

Thank you 

Theoretically not but realistically doing anything about it is going to be difficult to say the least.

There is no legal right to extra pay for bank holidays, even Christmas day. However if it was offered and he agreed to work on that basis then it should of course be honoured.

Pragmatically, if the "tips are substantial" and he had know that in advance, would he have worked for the total he actually received or turned the work down?

An agreement (contract) doesn't have to be in writing to be binding but the obvious difficulty is proving what was agreed. He could threaten to, and if necessary actually sue them for what was agreed, particularly if somebody else will back up what was promised.

The pub will no doubt claim something along the lines that they were told the total (including tips) would be around double normal pay.

You say he worked 6.5 hours without a break. Legally only 6 is allowed before a break is required. Again they will no doubt claim that there was opportunity to take a break and it is his fault for not doing so.

Sorry but that is the reality of it. Yes, he could name and shame but goo luck finding any similar work in the area.

It is for adults that a shift has to be expected to last more than 6 hours for a break to be allowed around the half-way mark.  For young people (and the OP's son is only 16), a break is required where the shift is expected to last more than 4.5 hours.

Thanks for clarifying that.

However my other point remains, in a dispute I imagine the pub will try to argue that the staff should have taken their break and weren't prevented from doing so. Probably not true......

Still hard to see any useful redress if the lad wants further holiday work I'm afraid.

Marvel1

Seems they took advantage.

The problem is raising the issue - they can termintate him easily instead as employed under 2 years.