Changes at work

Undervalued

LightFlare said:

LinLui said:

Jaguar98 said:

Tough spot, but try formally requesting flexible work arrangements due to childcare it could help you maintain some balance.

Only employees can apply for flexible working. Based on what the OP has said, they are not an employee. They can turn down work any time they want, and equally the employer is not obliged to offer them work. 

In another thread the OP also said:

3) I'll be paid holiday pay during my holidays.

Do workers also get holiday pay ?  (genuinely dont know -- hence asking)

Something is very muddled here!

In the OP's second post in this thread they quote (presumably from their contract....

You will be notified of the hours that you are required to work prior to the start of each project. If there is no work available or if you do not wish to work on a project you will not be required to attend the office and will not receive any payment for these periods. 

Which surely makes this zero hour?

So is the company really saying that if they assign the OP no work at all during the year they will still pay in full for (presumably) 28 days holiday? I don't think so as it is my understanding that with a zero hour contract you only accrue holiday for the days you actually work. See this article ( don't know the company so can't vouch for the accuracy)

https://www.personio.com/hr-lexicon/zero-hour-contract-holiday-pay/

LinLui

LightFlare said:

LinLui said:

Jaguar98 said:

Tough spot, but try formally requesting flexible work arrangements due to childcare it could help you maintain some balance.

Only employees can apply for flexible working. Based on what the OP has said, they are not an employee. They can turn down work any time they want, and equally the employer is not obliged to offer them work. 

In another thread the OP also said:

3) I'll be paid holiday pay during my holidays.

Do workers also get holiday pay ?  (genuinely dont know -- hence asking)

Yes they do. Everyone gets holiday pay. How they are paid it may be the question. For example, where I work (public sector) we bank what is accrued and pay it when someone asks for holiday pay. Sometimes it is rolled up. 

As @Undervalued has said, the various bits of information seem to be quite confusing. It is possible, given that the contract being quoted comes from the original employer, that the contract terms have changed over the years and the OP simply doesn't realise they have become an employee (although they say that isn't the case). So all we can go on is what is said. They did say in that same thread (a month ago) that they were taking the kids abroad for over a month before school restarts, so unless they are posting from "abroad" that doesn't seem possible now?

Without clarity we can only go on what is said - perhaps the OP will come back and explain more. 

LinLui

Which surely makes this zero hour?

So is the company really saying that if they assign the OP no work at all during the year they will still pay in full for (presumably) 28 days holiday? I don't think so as it is my understanding that with a zero hour contract you only accrue holiday for the days you actually work. See this article ( don't know the company so can't vouch for the accuracy)

I am making the same assumption about it being zero hours - although it may have "migrated" to employee status over the years and the OP just isn't aware. But it is also possible that the OP either didn't have the 28 days they thought (they don't appear to have actually done it); or that they can accrue leave over a longer period and have banked that much (the employer can agree to that for workers if they both agree); or that the OP is just very confused about everything. 

Farid2024

Thanks for the expert insight. My contract does say I am entitle to holidays and bank holidays plus do get length of service holidays too. I do get SSP and paternity pay. If i am a worker I would not got all of that. All this years I am working full time 40 hours a week since the time I joined without any issues.

I can not formally request flexible working as I am away from the country and work PC.

LinLui

Farid2024 said:

Thanks for the expert insight. My contract does say I am entitle to holidays and bank holidays plus do get length of service holidays too. I do get SSP and paternity pay. If i am a worker I would not got all of that. All this years I am working full time 40 hours a week since the time I joined without any issues.

I can not formally request flexible working as I am away from the country and work PC.

Sigh. OK, let's try some FULL transparency instead of drip feeding, shall we?

• Where is your employer based?
• Where do you work from currently - which country?
• The clause that you have now quoted twice on threads is VERY clear that you have no employee status - is that the same document that says you get these other rights?
• SSP, holidays and paternity pay are not dependant upon being an employee - workers qualify for these things too; and employers are at liberty to extend "rights" to workers even if they are not entitled to them. 
• And here's a question that I have just thought of - does the company that you do work for actually pay you; in what currency do they pay you?
• And an even more interesting one based on what you just said and your user name - are you a British citizen, and when you started this work, where you living in the UK; if your were living in the UK then, when did you leave the UK and did you get permission to work from home in another country?
  
  

All that said, I think you may be on a hiding to nothing now with that new information. I very much doubt that there is any court that would force an employer to allow somebody to work from another country, especially given the fact that there are performance concerns about your work which need to be addressed. 

Grumpy_chap

Farid2024 said:

I can not formally request flexible working as I am away from the country and work PC.

Can you clarify you simply mean you are currently on holiday, hence out of the country and the work PC?

You do not mean that you are working from home, but from a home that is abroad somewhere.  That would be a conflict with your initial statement:

Farid2024 said:

mostly working from home, due to child care arrangement.

Now my employer ask me to work from office daily (which I have said it's not possible due to child care arrangement). 

If you are residing abroad, that would be a reason that prevents you attending the office - quite possibly trumping any childcare issues.

I assume that if you were residing abroad, you would have access to the work PC while out of the country (not on holiday).

It is just your comment about unable to request flexible working because of being abroad seems a bit odd.  If you are only out of the country and work PC because of a holiday, then simply make the request in a week or so when you are back.

LinLui

Can you clarify you simply mean you are currently on holiday, hence out of the country and the work PC?

Good point - it could be read that way. But here's another question - if the OP is out of the country for a holiday and not in cobtact with work, when did the employer say that they had to return to the office - by that I mean how could they tell an employee to return to the office if the employee is on holiday and not in contact?

I think that the OP needs to give us the complete story of what is happening instead of snapshots based on what they think. Because the one thing that the OP hasn't done is deny that there are performance issues to be addressed. They've just said that others are worse (which isn't relevant). And if there are performance issues then the alternative to complying may very well be dismissal.

Just to add - if the OP is working in the UK normally, can they please explain why childcare issues make it impossible to work from the office? Because childcare isn't the employers problem per se, and whilst I don't want to make sexist assumptions, OP also says elsewhere that their wife has carers allowance (which yes - they also claim UC so must be in the UK normally - you are right), so presumably is doing the majority of the childcare?

LinLui

@Farid2024 I hope your are going to come back,  because we are trying our very best to clarify things and help you. We can't if we don't understand the whole picture.