Builder's Diagram?

GreenTed

We need to get a brick chimney breast removed in a bedroom & kitchen below.  There's no chimney above it or any structure in the loft, but we've been told by the bank (mortgage) that they need a builder's diagram.  We have 2 quotes but neither with a diagram.  For reasons I won't go into time is of the essence and the bank take a few days to return their decision/permission.  I've googled around but can't find any info about a builder's diagram - I wondered if the diagram might be something we could do ourselves at all?

Section62

GreenTed said:

We need to get a brick chimney breast removed in a bedroom & kitchen below.  There's no chimney above it or any structure in the loft, but we've been told by the bank (mortgage) that they need a builder's diagram.  We have 2 quotes but neither with a diagram.  For reasons I won't go into time is of the essence and the bank take a few days to return their decision/permission.  I've googled around but can't find any info about a builder's diagram - I wondered if the diagram might be something we could do ourselves at all?

You really need a structural engineer to check the chimney breast isn't giving lateral support to the wall.  The structural engineer should be able to give you a suitable plan as part of their report.

Builder's aren't usually qualified to give an opinion on structural matters, so I suspect by "builder's diagram" the lender possibly means a plan for the builder to use, rather than a plan produced by the builder.

GreenTed

That's interesting, thanks, no-one mentioned a structural engineer to us yet.  We don't want to compromise the strength of the wall, especially as it's a main wall through the centre of the home.  One of the builders is going to speak to council building control for us about it - both who've quoted did say this is something they sometimes get asked to do, 'though not normally for a chimney, especially with nothing above it, and both are very experienced.  I'll talk to the bank again about it tomorrow, try to get more of an idea.  Thanks again.

Doozergirl

GreenTed said:

That's interesting, thanks, no-one mentioned a structural engineer to us yet.  We don't want to compromise the strength of the wall, especially as it's a main wall through the centre of the home.  One of the builders is going to speak to council building control for us about it - both who've quoted did say this is something they sometimes get asked to do, 'though not normally for a chimney, especially with nothing above it, and both are very experienced.  I'll talk to the bank again about it tomorrow, try to get more of an idea.  Thanks again.

They are not experienced at all, not in the right way.  

Every time you affect the structure of the building you consult a structural engineer.  The builder works to the structural engineer's specification and Building Control check that the work conforms to that specification. 

That's how it works each and every time.  

Anyone telling you that it is unusual is a cowboy.  Fullstop.  Look for a member of the Federation of Master Builders, please.  www.fmb.org.uk

gzoom

Why does the mortgage company want to see drawings? We have pretty much demolished and rebuilt our house, and taken out extra borrowing. I had all the drawings etc ready to share with the mortgage company......they had no interest in wanting to see any drawings or do any checks.

GDB2222

gzoom said:

Why does the mortgage company want to see drawings? We have pretty much demolished and rebuilt our house, and taken out extra borrowing. I had all the drawings etc ready to share with the mortgage company......they had no interest in wanting to see any drawings or do any checks.

This gives an idea of what can go wrong.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/finchley-family-left-homeless-after-bodged-building-work-causes-house-to-collapse-a3193121.html


I'll just add that they have completely demolished the house and propped up the houses either side, but insurance doesn’t cover self-inflicted damage, and the house has not been rebuilt. It’s been a hole in the ground for ten years now.

GreenTed

gzoom said:

Why does the mortgage company want to see drawings? We have pretty much demolished and rebuilt our house, and taken out extra borrowing. I had all the drawings etc ready to share with the mortgage company......they had no interest in wanting to see any drawings or do any checks.

I wish we'd gone with your mortgage company gzoom!  How interesting that you took diagrams to them & they didn't want to know.  This is a major bank - even by their own terms & conditions it doesn't seem to be something they'd require for this type of job.  I think we need to speak to them again.  

GreenTed

Update: We spoke to the bank again, who said to send in any information we had, so we sent our own computer diagrams of the rooms with all the measurements, showing exactly what was going to be removed, plus photos including of the loft & outside to show that the chimney had been removed from the attic and roof, plus the description of work & detailed quote from the builder who'll be carrying out the work.  He is extremely experienced and will also work with the council's building control, of course.  The bank approved as long as the insurance company were ok with it, which they are.  

Ganga

GreenTed said:

Update: We spoke to the bank again, who said to send in any information we had, so we sent our own computer diagrams of the rooms with all the measurements, showing exactly what was going to be removed, plus photos including of the loft & outside to show that the chimney had been removed from the attic and roof, plus the description of work & detailed quote from the builder who'll be carrying out the work.  He is extremely experienced and will also work with the council's building control, of course.  The bank approved as long as the insurance company were ok with it, which they are.  

Have you spoke to a structural engineer yet? you cannot trust the builder to get everthing right. 

GDB2222

Good luck.