Statute Barred advice

Swans86

Hi, just looking for some advice on statute barred debt.  I'm currently being chased by a debt collection agency for a debt which I believe is now statute barred.  The date of the original default notice with the original company is January 2018 so this would put it over the 6 year limitation period.  I've had no contact with the debt collection agency in this period and no payments were made so am I correct in thinking this is now statute barred?  I have sent them a letter informing them of this (template from step change) and they have come back to me claiming that the date they have for this becoming statue barred is 07/2025 due to the default date and the account will remain open for further communications.  They have not provided any evidence and I know this not to be true.  What are the next best steps from here?

sourcrates

Yes, you'll see that in the appeal court ruling "Sir Terence Etherton MR", giving the judgment of the Court, held that limitation commences from the date specified in the default notice for payment of the arrears, which may or may not also be the date of default. 

That has been deemed the cause of action date.

Are they proposing a different date because it did not actually default straight away?

See here:

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2019/12.html

DisabledDan

sourcrates said:

Yes, you'll see that in the appeal court ruling "Sir Terence Etherton MR", giving the judgment of the Court, held that limitation commences from the date specified in the default notice for payment of the arrears, which may or may not also be the date of default. 

That has been deemed the cause of action date.

Are they proposing a different date because it did not actually default straight away?

See here:


http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2019/12.html

Hi @sourcrates

How does one know that from the information posted by the OP?

I thought the significance of PRA Doyle was that the original agreement had to state within their terms, you appear to be saying that the "date specified in the default notice for payment of the arrears"

Do they need qualifying terms in their credit agreement AND a different date.

Is there a list of providers you could add to the PRA Doyle sticky so Forumites could have an idea of what might be likely to have this issue?

So many debt collectors are faking information, alleged fake micro payments, alleged fake CCJ and so on.

sourcrates

OP states original default notice dated January 2018, but does not specify the day.

Standard default notice issued under sec 87 CCA, allows 14 days to rectify a breach, so 14 days after the date the default notice was issued, can be construed to be the cause of action date, according to PRA/Doyle.

Qualifying terms??? List of providers for what?? not sure what you mean there, I have not read the judgement in full, just the summery.

We do not give legal advice on this forum, there are others much better equipped to do that, we provide basic advice on most debt issues but in laymen's terms.

I do agree that DCA`s should never be trusted.

fatbelly

Swans86 said:

Hi, just looking for some advice on statute barred debt.  I'm currently being chased by a debt collection agency for a debt which I believe is now statute barred.  The date of the original default notice with the original company is January 2018 so this would put it over the 6 year limitation period.  I've had no contact with the debt collection agency in this period and no payments were made so am I correct in thinking this is now statute barred?  I have sent them a letter informing them of this (template from step change) and they have come back to me claiming that the date they have for this becoming statue barred is 07/2025 due to the default date and the account will remain open for further communications.  They have not provided any evidence and I know this not to be true.  What are the next best steps from here?

You've stated your position. They've stated theirs.

If they want a decision on this they must start a court claim, which you would defend.

What date is showing on your credit file?

Swans86

fatbelly said:

Swans86 said:

Hi, just looking for some advice on statute barred debt.  I'm currently being chased by a debt collection agency for a debt which I believe is now statute barred.  The date of the original default notice with the original company is January 2018 so this would put it over the 6 year limitation period.  I've had no contact with the debt collection agency in this period and no payments were made so am I correct in thinking this is now statute barred?  I have sent them a letter informing them of this (template from step change) and they have come back to me claiming that the date they have for this becoming statue barred is 07/2025 due to the default date and the account will remain open for further communications.  They have not provided any evidence and I know this not to be true.  What are the next best steps from here?

You've stated your position. They've stated theirs.

If they want a decision on this they must start a court claim, which you would defend.

What date is showing on your credit file?

I have nothing on my credit file with regards to this. Just a bit concerned that something might end up on there, although I'm guessing they can't add anything on now 5 years after they're incorrectly saying the default was? 

sourcrates

Swans86 said:

I have nothing on my credit file with regards to this. Just a bit concerned that something might end up on there, although I'm guessing they can't add anything on now 5 years after they're incorrectly saying the default was? 

It doesn't show on any of your credit files?

That would support your position, and discount theirs in that case.

RAS

If the default was issued more than 6 years ago, it would not show up on your credit record. In practice, folk find it may take a month or two longer to disappear.

Assuming, you've check all three providers?

DisabledDan

Swans86 said:

Hi, just looking for some advice on statute barred debt.  I'm currently being chased by a debt collection agency for a debt which I believe is now statute barred.  The date of the original default notice with the original company is January 2018 so this would put it over the 6 year limitation period.  I've had no contact with the debt collection agency in this period and no payments were made so am I correct in thinking this is now statute barred?  I have sent them a letter informing them of this (template from step change) and they have come back to me claiming that the date they have for this becoming statue barred is 07/2025 due to the default date and the account will remain open for further communications.  They have not provided any evidence and I know this not to be true.  What are the next best steps from here?

I think the mistake here was to engage with them in the first place, I would have waited a year or two to see if they went to Court.

I would imagine your steps are dependent on whether you value a credit record, i.e. may get finance or a mortgage or credit card in future.

Normally when I receive anything from a debt collector I would wait and see.

The fact that it does not appear on your credit record would seem to suggest total BS is being alleged by the debt collector, I think they would have actually been firmer if they had a debt that was not statute barred.

You could now send a "prove it letter" (see the sticky)

If they can't produce that paperwork then tell them that the debt is unenforceable.

If they can produce that paperwork then you look for evidence that it is Statute Barred and tell them the debt is unenforceable if it is Statute Barred.

If you believe it is not Statute Barred then you can just wait it out.

Sadly due to the egregious behaviour you can't trust Debt Collectors not to make up things, so if they fail to provide evidence of it not being statute barred until 2025 as alleged, then you do a Subject Access Request for EVERYTHING.  Every letter, every call, every email, computer notes, the lot.  If they refuse or fail to provide this within 30 days you complain to the ICO who will make them comply.

Then you look to the SAR data and if there is no reason or evidence for the allegation of Statute Bar until 2025 you make a FOS complaint and ask them to recommend that the FSA investigate the Debt Collector for breaching Conc rules of chasing a debt that cannot be enforced and lying to the debtor.  This should also be done on the basis of the new FSA rules on Consumer Duty

• communications should be tailored to the customers receiving them – what information do customers need to make good decisions?

• firms should take extra care where customers are more likely to be vulnerable, for example high-cost credit, debt collecting, second charge mortgages, and debt advice.

https://debtcamel.co.uk/fca-consumer-duty/

A debtor can't make a good decision if the debtor is telling lies.