First hour is unpaid

stu12345_2

I'm a mobile employee, meaning I have no fixed site at work.i have a works company van with fuel card which I take home every day.
I'm employed 7 hrs a day at £12.50 an hour. but first hour is unpaid ( company class it as unpaid traveling time)

so say I drive from home for 2 hrs to a site, then do 4 hrs work, then drive 2 hrs back home, I'm only paid for 7 out of the 8.
is this legal, does it take my wage below min wage or is that irrelevant, cos contract says first hour is unpaid traveling time.

very occasionally I drive 1hr then do 5 hrs work and drive 1 hr back home,  I still get paid 7 hrs., ( even if they apply the first hour unpaid)so I win on that occasion.
cos 7hrs is guaranteed wages daily 

my van has a tracker, my manager adds up the time the van was in motion ,( perhaps to prove I was stuck in a traffic jam) then adds that to the hours worked at the site,to work out if I'm due overtime, so I guess not rushing to a site would occasionally give me overtime,( I'm expected  to take the shortest route, which I do) but I guess that's a different matter.

MattMattMattUK

It would depend if the first hour of driving is classed as a commute or not. You say you have no fixed site at work, but does your work have an office/depot somewhere, what does your contract say about your normal place of work?

stu12345_2

no office, place of work is anywhere in the country, first hour is classed as unpaid travel time to site
the company headquarters are 250 miles away, which I never go to or need to.

all paperwork is done online

Marcon

stu12345_2 said:

I'm a mobile employee, meaning I have no fixed site at work.i have a works company van with fuel card which I take home every day.
I'm employed 7 hrs a day at £12.50 an hour. but first hour is unpaid ( company class it as unpaid traveling time)

so say I drive from home for 2 hrs to a site, then do 4 hrs work, then drive 2 hrs back home, I'm only paid for 7 out of the 8.
is this legal, does it take my wage below min wage or is that irrelevant, cos contract says first hour is unpaid traveling time.

very occasionally I drive 1hr then do 5 hrs work and drive 1 hr back home,  I still get paid 7 hrs., ( even if they apply the first hour unpaid)so I win on that occasion.
cos 7hrs is guaranteed wages daily 

my van has a tracker, my manager adds up the time the van was in motion ,( perhaps to prove I was stuck in a traffic jam) then adds that to the hours worked at the site,to work out if I'm due overtime, so I guess not rushing to a site would occasionally give me overtime,( I'm expected  to take the shortest route, which I do) but I guess that's a different matter.

https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/national-minimum-wage-manual/nmwm08300

Penguin_

Im sure if you have no fixed office, your travel time should be payable.

nyermen

Penguin_ said:

Im sure if you have no fixed office, your travel time should be payable.

Agreed - contract normally states location (albeit company can change this) - either depot (in which case travel time from depot is considered working time) or otherwise travel to anywhere?.  Wasn't there a case about this with eg. Carers not having a base location and travelling between patients putting the below minimum wage?

Andy_L

stu12345_2 said:

I'm a mobile employee, meaning I have no fixed site at work.i have a works company van with fuel card which I take home every day.
I'm employed 7 hrs a day at £12.50 an hour. but first hour is unpaid ( company class it as unpaid traveling time)

so say I drive from home for 2 hrs to a site, then do 4 hrs work, then drive 2 hrs back home, I'm only paid for 7 out of the 8.
is this legal, does it take my wage below min wage or is that irrelevant, cos contract says first hour is unpaid traveling time.

very occasionally I drive 1hr then do 5 hrs work and drive 1 hr back home,  I still get paid 7 hrs., ( even if they apply the first hour unpaid)so I win on that occasion.
cos 7hrs is guaranteed wages daily 

my van has a tracker, my manager adds up the time the van was in motion ,( perhaps to prove I was stuck in a traffic jam) then adds that to the hours worked at the site,to work out if I'm due overtime, so I guess not rushing to a site would occasionally give me overtime,( I'm expected  to take the shortest route, which I do) but I guess that's a different matter.

I'm not following their rules here. Why are they not subtracting 1 hour in the 2nd example?

Is it only the 1st hour of travelling time above you std 7hr/day that they don't pay?

stu12345_2

they deduct one hour a day, but if it makes my wage below 7 hrs , they still have to pay me 7 hrs.( such as a really short day).

but they them make up the difference by giving me lo g days the rest of the week

I'm on a ,35 hours a week , over 5 days contract guaranteed wages

my base is my home, I get the list if sites to go to in an email at start of the week.
so in general my daily shift is 8 hours long, then they deduct an hour's commute , so it makes a 7 HR wage,

it's usually designed that way, but if my day is 9 hours long, they take one hour off and pay me for 8 hrs

stu12345_2

Andy_L said:

stu12345_2 said:

I'm a mobile employee, meaning I have no fixed site at work.i have a works company van with fuel card which I take home every day.
I'm employed 7 hrs a day at £12.50 an hour. but first hour is unpaid ( company class it as unpaid traveling time)

so say I drive from home for 2 hrs to a site, then do 4 hrs work, then drive 2 hrs back home, I'm only paid for 7 out of the 8.
is this legal, does it take my wage below min wage or is that irrelevant, cos contract says first hour is unpaid traveling time.

very occasionally I drive 1hr then do 5 hrs work and drive 1 hr back home,  I still get paid 7 hrs., ( even if they apply the first hour unpaid)so I win on that occasion.
cos 7hrs is guaranteed wages daily 

my van has a tracker, my manager adds up the time the van was in motion ,( perhaps to prove I was stuck in a traffic jam) then adds that to the hours worked at the site,to work out if I'm due overtime, so I guess not rushing to a site would occasionally give me overtime,( I'm expected  to take the shortest route, which I do) but I guess that's a different matter.

I'm not following their rules here. Why are they not subtracting 1 hour in the 2nd example?

Is it only the 1st hour of travelling time above you std 7hr/day that they don't pay?

they deduct one hour a day regardless,, but if it's short days all week,  eg 6 hrs, they still have to pay me 35 hrs regardless.

they try giving long and short days of that happens, but they must pay me 35 hrs.

my point is , is it right that they can deduct an hour daily and call it unpaid travel time.
I think they don't like the idea of mobile  staff getting paid  for every minute from  my home when I start and drive the van to first job, if it's miles away.

employer is trying to save money for itself 

ok , let's say next week I actually do 40 hrs work, but as they deduct an hour a day, I lose out by giving 5 hrs of my time to them for free, but I get the 35 hrs wage at end of the week and no more that week.

what if I was in an accident in the first hour, am I actually working as an employee in that first unpaid hour

housebuyer143

I found this article which seems to suggest you should be paid travel by law.

https://www.crunch.co.uk/knowledge/article/travel-and-working-times-regulations

LightFlare

The law may say one thing but I don’t think it’s actually unreasonable for all/part of the daily commute to be unpaid.

If you are using a works van - you need to very carefully check the insurance validity

How much do you pay towards the vehicle, tax,insurance,fuel ?
A fully subsidised commute is a nice perk most people would be grateful for

Bear in mind - less than 2 years employment, they can get rid pretty easily